More White House contradictions. This time, the EU

[Bullettime]

Concerning story here.

Basically, the White House isn't even seemingly on the same page regarding relations with the EU. Pence went and claimed that that they want to keep a strong and growing economic bond and such, but Bannon is shadily making different remarks. Despite the White House claiming it was a three minute hello, multiple anonymous sources are claiming that Bannon went opposite of Pence and praised/supported the nationalist movements.

Thoughts? Concerning as the unraveling of the EU would be absolutely disastrous and despite Pence's remarks, Bannon/Trump may have different ideas and Pence is on the outside again.

[Sharkconas]

Trump is clearly being manipulated by Bannon and his ideology, Bannon does not like the liberal EU so no surprise here. If you want to know who's really telling the truth its probably the puppet Trump.

[PACOX]

In cases like this you have to look at the chain of command. Pence is the VP which comes with a lot of influence, prestige, and potential responsibility. But lets be honest, how much power does a VP actually have?

Bannon owns the only credible news outlet in the free world. He has the greatest spokesman in the world, Donald. He isn't a politican so that means he knows whats best when it comes to state affairs. Donald does nothing without getting permission from Bannon, so doesn't that make Bannon the President of the President? Which would mean he outranks Pence. Therefore what Bannon says goes. Obviously Pence is out of line here.

[ImpTaimer]

The only contradictions are the "three sources".

Sounds familiar...



Hopefully true. This leak shit needs snuffed out already so people will stop attacking celebrities that are in any minuscule fashion "pro-Trump" and discrediting their career with smear campaigns.

*edit* Apparently one was allegedly found, but the article OP posted implies there's at least three. Unless two are patsies. Or maybe we still don't know and their (the people that discovered the alleged leaker) source for the alleged leaker is also a "fake leak".

[Blur4stuff]

With or without leaks, they are a complete mess. You can only hide that kind of dysfunction for so long.

Trump and the republicans aren't capable of producing meaningful, positive results. Even without leaks, they can't just pretend they replaced obamacare with something better or magically created millions of high paying manufacturing jobs from thin air.

[Torto]

With or without leaks, they are a complete mess. You can only hide that kind of dysfunction for so long.

Trump and the republicans aren't capable of producing meaningful, positive results. Even without leaks, they can't just pretend they replaced obamacare with something better or magically created millions of high paying manufacturing jobs from thin air.

It's hard to know whether you are believing what you want to believe, or what the liberal media wants you to believe. Either way, gullible comes to mind.

[Kaleredar]

It's hard to know whether you are believing what you want to believe, or what the liberal media wants you to believe. Either way, gullible comes to mind.

So are you asserting that the republicans are replacing Obamacare with something better, that Trump has created millions of high paying manufacturing jobs, or that the white house isn't currently a complete mess?

[Wyrt]

It's hard to know whether you are believing what you want to believe, or what the liberal media wants you to believe. Either way, gullible comes to mind.

Reality has a liberal bias.

[Karfal]

Concerning story here.

Basically, the White House isn't even seemingly on the same page regarding relations with the EU. Pence went and claimed that that they want to keep a strong and growing economic bond and such, but Bannon is shadily making different remarks. Despite the White House claiming it was a three minute hello, multiple anonymous sources are claiming that Bannon went opposite of Pence and praised/supported the nationalist movements.

Thoughts? Concerning as the unraveling of the EU would be absolutely disastrous and despite Pence's remarks, Bannon/Trump may have different ideas and Pence is on the outside again.

You need to remember trump has several people advising him who all have different views.

Just because bannon and pence have opposing views isn't a problem. Ivanka also her extreme liberal views she pushes on DJT.

Ultimately people need to worry less about the rumors and gossip and focus on what is actually being done. His executive actions and bills he Mrs to get done all are amazing and will be beneficial to the American people.

[Shadowmelded]

It's either intrigue or incompetence and given what people close to the transition team were saying, the former seems more likely.

[Stormspellz]

It's hard to know whether you are believing what you want to believe, or what the liberal media wants you to believe. Either way, gullible comes to mind.

Think you should read what you said and apply it to yourself.

[Skroe]

Considering one of National Security Advisor, General McMaster's projects in the fall was, it's safe to assume that no matter Bannon, the US will continue to support the EU and NATO.

Why? Because that project was warning and countermeasures again Russian political interference in Europe in the name of supporting extremist groups on the right and the left, to dismantle the EU.

[Bullettime]

Considering one of National Security Advisor, General McMaster's projects in the fall was, it's safe to assume that no matter Bannon, the US will continue to support the EU and NATO.

Why? Because that project was warning and countermeasures again Russian political interference in Europe in the name of supporting extremist groups on the right and the left, to dismantle the EU.

Just concerning that now we know what Bannon and Trump's personal stances will be in the years to come pending removal. It also further pushes the divide between Trump and Washington.

[Karfal]

Considering one of National Security Advisor, General McMaster's projects in the fall was, it's safe to assume that no matter Bannon, the US will continue to support the EU and NATO.

Why? Because that project was warning and countermeasures again Russian political interference in Europe in the name of supporting extremist groups on the right and the left, to dismantle the EU.

I think trump will continue to support NATO as long as other countries pay their fair share.


But the EU needs to go.

[Bullettime]

I think trump will continue to support NATO as long as other countries pay their fair share.


But the EU needs to go.

The EU dying benefits no one except Russia who could then chip back away at the smaller countries to expand their power. The EU and NATO are serving as the only block against outside aggression.

edit: It dying could also lead to a return of the aggressive nationalistic might makes right policy that was so prominent in Europe for over a thousand years. We don't need aggressive nationalism rising further, which is what Bannon is saying the Trump administration supports.

[Torto]

So are you asserting that the republicans are replacing Obamacare with something better, that Trump has created millions of high paying manufacturing jobs, or that the white house isn't currently a complete mess?

Too early to tell and the white house is not a complete mess. That's all biased liberal media projection that anti-Trump forum posters here lap up unquestioningly. The whole 'chaotic shambles' you people seem to think is happening is nothing more than minor issues blown out of proportion by the msm. Those of us who aren't willing him to fail are content in the knowledge that his presidency has only just started and he will likely accomplish more in his first 6 months than Obama did in 8 wasted years.

[Skroe]

Just concerning that now we know what Bannon and Trump's personal stances will be in the years to come pending removal. It also further pushes the divide between Trump and Washington.

The National Security Team, with Flynn gone and the addition of McMaster, is actually, pretty fucking good. They just need to keep Deputy Secretary of Defense Robert O. Work (an Obama holdover) until the end of time.

THe question comes down to Bannon and the alt-right. He has to be isolated. K.T. MacFarlane has to get lost. Bannon's little group needs to be cut off. It may not happen immediately, but it'll need to in time.

McMaster's appointment is a huge deal though. The guy is a fucking nightmare to Russia. Over the two years he hit on everything Russia has been doing to out maneuver us: their cyberwarfare and information warfare... their use of irregular forces and political campaigns... their artillery superiority in Europe and growth of conventional rocket forces.

The National Security Advisor, right now, is literally the guy who has spent most of the last two years figuring out how to get the US Military in a position where it could fight and win a war with Russia in Europe again.

He's also been very imaginative on Asian-Pacific affairs, for example, advocating using a new type of high speed / long range artillery projectile to turn Howitzer's into long range anti-ship and anti-drone platforms.

If he's allowed to work, and Mattis and Robert O. Work can do their jobs, and they're given the budget they need from Congress that is, at least, $60 billion higher than last year, they'll be able to very rapidly undo the damage Obama did to the military since 2012 and reinforce our military superiority versus Russia and China. But all, considering their prior jobs (NATO, Obama, Army planning respectively) understand the essential political dimension as well. Which makes strong support for the EU when the chips are down very likely.

Basically if Russia tried something, and Bannon got Trump to do Russia's bidding, Mattis and McMaster would likely quit.

Next step: throw Michael Flynn into federal prison, so even outside an official government position, he isn't whispering into Trump's ear.

[Kaleredar]

Too early to tell and the white house is not a complete mess. That's all biased liberal media projection that anti-Trump forum posters here lap up unquestioningly. The whole 'chaotic shambles' you people seem to think is happening is nothing more than minor issues blown out of proportion by the msm. Those of us who aren't willing him to fail are content in the knowledge that his presidency has only just started and he will likely accomplish more in his first 6 months than Obama did in 8 wasted years.

>lambasts others for projecting
>immediately starts projecting


Pretty sure the only thing Trump has surpassed Obama in so far is spending more on himself and his family in these two months than Obama did in a year.



You confuse "seeing cracks in the chintzy gilding" as "willing to fail." How much turnover has their been in the Trump Whitehouse? Is that "to be expected" when staffers are jumping ship? Are you just going to write off the judicial branch giving Trump the finger as "par the course?"


I don't understand how you can possibly gauge Trump's presence thus far in the white house as being positive.


I'm curious to see how Trumpettes are even going to quantify "making America great again." Like, what is the actual metric?

Because I don't think there is one. I think it's something they want to feel.

[Skroe]

I think trump will continue to support NATO as long as other countries pay their fair share.


But the EU needs to go.

The problem with NATO isn't how much they pay. The problem is redundancy.

NATO minus the US right now, is like asking Massachusetts to field it's own independent air force, navy and army, as part of it's contribution to the US military. Because Massachusetts is largely identical in terms of population and economics, to Denmark, which must do that with respect to NATO.

Completely contrary to what you may realize, the best NATO the US could get would be one where the current national-military contributions is replaced by member nations specializing and contribution to a Pan-European, or even quasi- EU military, that in itself, is the European component of NATO. In other words, fixing NATO involves MORE Trans-nationalism of the EU mold, not less.

I mean OF COURSE EU armed forces aren't what the US needs as a whole. A C-130, a fighter aircraft and a tank cost the same amount weather we buy it or whether they buy it. However the US has 220 million taxpayers contributing to one big $600 billion federal pool. Europe has 26 countries contributing to national pools, with an extreme degree of redundancy. Know how many different tank models Europe uses? Something like 22. The US uses one. Why does Portugal need an independent Nuclear-Biological-Chemical warfare response unit? Why can't it rely on Polands?

Hitting 2% will accomplish basically nothing without FAR MORE DIFFICULT organizational and industrial reforms.

[Bullettime]

The EU dying would not even benefit Russia. You are not talking about a single country leaving the EU but the entire thing dissolving. Russia is not some big exporter that would gain significantly from the fall of the one market; the best they can do is try to annex the Baltics or something and even that is farfetched (though still somewhat possible). On the long term many might profit but on the short term the entire globe would head into a recession the likes of which no one alive has ever seen.

Russia is already doing that though. If left to their own devices, they won't make it another century. That's why they're trying so aggressively to sneak in plays and try to force themselves back into the global economy and being a global power. They're just not selling anything people really want. This isn't going to get better either. And the further they decline, the more likely they are to do something dumb out of desperation.

Russia is basically a wounded dog being backed further into the corner by further modernization and globalization of the rest of the world. The EU and/or NATO crumbling is their only really chance at regaining true relevance by asserting what power they have left.

edit: That's why they're trying so hard to destabilize democratic governments and funding right wing nationalist parties.