Trump Planning to Mobilize the National Guard to Arrest Illegal Immigrants

[Daelak]

See I don't believe that. Especially if you enacted legislation that people need to be working. There are a lot of Americans without work that could easily fill those jobs. They aren't the primo of primo jobs but work is work. That's one thing Americans need to get over. Too many people bitch about work. Quit being fucking lazy and entitled and get out there and do a job. Who gives a fuck what it is. Quit relying on the government to pay your way and earn it for yourself.

Or hell they could not work but couldn't claim any government welfare of any kind either.

You should believe it, because removing that supply would cause a demand shock, disrupting/canceling ongoing and future labor-intensive projects, daily operations for service-oriented businesses, and destruction of perishable goods. All of these would cause a severe recession in the short term, making both domestic and international investment to wane, creating a talent drain and brain drain. There is no upside to destroying productive endeavors for the sake of some nativist utopia.

[Deleted]

Definately! We should also bring forth an informer system where you are rewarded if you suspect your neighbour might be / might harbour illegal refugees so that the Task Force Against Undesirables can more easily break into homes and find the people we have to get rid off. After all, our security is at stake here.

So you're equating strong borders to being Facist. Awesome.

[Daelak]

So you're equating strong borders to being Facist. Awesome.

We already have a "strong" border and the most comprehensive vetting system for immigrants and asylum seekers.

[Deleted]

You should believe it, because removing that supply would cause a demand shock, disrupting/canceling ongoing and future labor-intensive projects, daily operations for service-oriented businesses, and destruction of perishable goods. All of these would cause a severe recession in the short term, making both domestic and international investment to wane, creating a talent drain and brain drain. There is no upside to destroying productive endeavors for the sake of some nativist utopia.

Jesus H christ, this is the most false thing I have ever heard. How is stimming an influx of unskilled, uneducated workers to undercut minimal wage local workers going to cause a talent and brain drain?

Even using the fucking History of the United States we can see with the chinese, the reduction of easy access to undercutting labour with chinese immigrants and the rigid vetting system put on them, both the quality of life for their fellow lower class workers AND the chinese immigrants legally in the country grew massive. Now those very same chinese immigrant families are some of the most well educated and well funded in the country.

The exact same in WW2 with tons of Jewish Immigrants. Illegal Immigrants ruin the workforce for EVERYONE.

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We already have a "strong" border and the most comprehensive vetting system for immigrants and asylum seekers.

Except Trump is merely deporting people who slipped through the cracks? Or do you think people who commit crimes deserve to go unchecked if they get away from the police?

[Daelak]

Jesus H christ, this is the most false thing I have ever heard. How is stimming an influx of unskilled, uneducated workers to undercut minimal wage local workers going to cause a talent and brain drain?

Even using the fucking History of the United States we can see with the chinese, the reduction of easy access to undercutting labour with chinese immigrants and the rigid vetting system put on them, both the quality of life for their fellow lower class workers AND the chinese immigrants legally in the country grew massive. Now those very same chinese immigrant families are some of the most well educated and well funded in the country.

The exact same in WW2 with tons of Jewish Immigrants. Illegal Immigrants ruin the workforce for EVERYONE.

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Except Trump is merely deporting people who slipped through the cracks? Or do you think people who commit crimes deserve to go unchecked if they get away from the police?

They aren't unskilled workers. They would be deporting people who millions of businesses depend on to produce. This is where the misinformation comes in.

The Chinese wave of immigrants in the 1800's were wholly illegal, with their children being the de-facto citizens that were allowed by the western states to keep their wages and start communities to build wealth, same with the Jewish immigration in the 1900s. Enslaved blacks had neither.

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Except Trump is merely deporting people who slipped through the cracks? Or do you think people who commit crimes deserve to go unchecked if they get away from the police?

Trump isn't the first president to focus on deporting violent and felonious immigrants.

[Deleted]

]They aren't unskilled workers.[/B] They would be deporting people who millions of businesses depend on to produce. This is where the misinformation comes in.

The Chinese wave of immigrants in the 1800's were wholly illegal, with their children being the de-facto citizens that were allowed by the western states to keep their wages and start communities to build wealth, same with the Jewish immigration in the 1900s. Enslaved blacks had neither.

Yes, they are. And as with every wave of unskilled uneducated illegal migrants, they depress the working wages of the natives, and yeah, you still didn't prove me wrong. Chinese Immigrants, Jewish Immigrants, hell even Korean Immigrants from the Korean War; All have shown that when they are legal and properly vetted, they assimilate and do extremely well. I think the question here is why are you defending lawbreakers who ruin this for the legal migrants.

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Trump isn't the first president to focus on deporting violent and felonious immigrants.

I didn't say that.

[TwoNineMarine]

You should believe it, because removing that supply would cause a demand shock, disrupting/canceling ongoing and future labor-intensive projects, daily operations for service-oriented businesses, and destruction of perishable goods. All of these would cause a severe recession in the short term, making both domestic and international investment to wane, creating a talent drain and brain drain. There is no upside to destroying productive endeavors for the sake of some nativist utopia.

If you say so.

I happen to disagree.

And neither of us will know the true outcome unless it actually happens.

I feel that the economy would recover after the initial shock. You do not. That's what a good debate entails. Just don't let this devolve to you attempting to question my intelligence.

[Daelak]

Yes, they are. And as with every wave of unskilled uneducated illegal migrants, they depress the working wages of the natives, and yeah, you still didn't prove me wrong. Chinese Immigrants, Jewish Immigrants, hell even Korean Immigrants from the Korean War; All have shown that when they are legal and properly vetted, they assimilate and do extremely well. I think the question here is why are you defending lawbreakers who ruin this for the legal migrants.

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I didn't say that.

This is laughably backwards. There was no vetting process in San Francisco during the time of the Asian immigration waves on the west coast, in fact the only process NYC had during the mid 1800's was literally conscription of all immigrant males, and the women and children were sent to orphanages, textile mills, and other manufacturing centers to work for nearly nothing. Until Allied forces found the concentration camps deep inside Germany, Jewish immigrants were rejected and/or detained from entering due to the anti-semitic beliefs of US politicians and people.

None of these waves were welcomed nor did they assimilate to whatever vagueness of definition of what assimilating to American Values even means. They were allowed to keep their wages in order to start communities and build wealth, which blacks were never allowed to do until the latter quarter of the 20th century.

[Deleted]

None of these waves were welcomed nor did they assimilate to whatever vagueness of definition of what assimilating to American Values even means. They were allowed to keep their wages in order to start communities and build wealth, which blacks were never allowed to do until the latter quarter of the 20th century.

So you're saying the Descendents of those Chinese Immigrants and Jewish Immigrants have not Assimilated to this day?

[Deleted]

So you're equating strong borders to being Facist. Awesome.

Well the guy I responded to equated the national guard rounding up people in the streets and taking them from their homes to strong borders, so I think I'm allowed to in this case.

[Daelak]

If you say so.

I happen to disagree.

And neither of us will know the true outcome unless it actually happens.

I feel that the economy would recover after the initial shock. You do not. That's what a good debate entails. Just don't let this devolve to you attempting to question my intelligence.

You can disagree all you like but this has happened multiple times over the years where nativist language/propaganda has been used to propel a person into power. They promise to be tough on border security and deportation, ramp up the recruitment of border/deportation agents, they aren't vetted due to the political and expedient nature the politician wants it to be completed, border/deportation agents are felonious and engage in unethical behavior, immigrants move from cities where deportation agents are rife with corruption, those cities go through a major recession, next election cycle comes, the past politician is voted out, immigration budgets go back to normal levels, immigrants return to the cities and the economy rebounds.

[Deleted]

Well the guy I responded to equated the national guard rounding up people in the streets and taking them from their homes to strong borders, so I think I'm allowed to in this case.

Using the National Guard to arrest criminals is facist now?

[Allybeboba]

And doing it illegally is what? Or do you even understand the issues?

How is he doing it illegally? Please do tell.
They are practically an invasion force at this point. They are just not mobilized.

[Deleted]

You can disagree all you like but this has happened multiple times over the years where nativist language/propaganda has been used to propel a person into power. They promise to be tough on border security and deportation, ramp up the recruitment of border/deportation agents, they aren't vetted due to the political and expedient nature the politician wants it to be completed, border/deportation agents are felonious and engage in unethical behavior, immigrants move from cities where deportation agents are rife with corruption, those cities go through a major recession, next election cycle comes, the past politician is voted out, immigration budgets go back to normal levels, immigrants return to the cities and the economy rebounds.

Can you name a single instance of this?

[Daelak]

So you're saying the Descendents of those Chinese Immigrants and Jewish Immigrants have not Assimilated to this day?

There was nothing to assimilate "to". They were allowed to keep their meager earnings over generations, and in the case of the Jewish immigrants, didn't get their remainder of their wealth confiscated by US authorities at the behest of anti-semitic politicians and people.

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Can you name a single instance of this?

August 2006-September 2012, the Customs & Border Patrol had their numbers doubled in size, from 10,000 to 21,000, this created huge ethical violations because the new hires were hastily added, and the local economies of the southwestern states were devastated due to immigrants moving to other metro areas until the CBP budgets went back to normal pre-2007 levels.

[Deleted]

There was nothing to assimilate "to". They were allowed to keep their meager earnings over generations, and in the case of the Jewish immigrants, didn't get their remainder of their wealth confiscated by US authorities at the behest of anti-semitic politicians and people.

So they didn't assimilate into the greater American populace and cause a cross of cultural customs and religious ideas?

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August 2006-September 2012, the Customs & Border Patrol had their numbers doubled in size, from 10,000 to 21,000, this created huge ethical violations because the new hires were hastily added, and the local economies of the southwestern states were devastated due to immigrants moving to other metro areas until the CBP budgets went back to normal pre-2007 levels.

So that doesn't explain Immigrants being removed causing a depression, it means Immigrants sweeping areas like a plague causes problems.

[Zenfoldor]

Was this false information put out to find leaks? A poison pill, as it were?

[Daelak]

So they didn't assimilate into the greater American populace and cause a cross of cultural customs and religious ideas?

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So that doesn't explain Immigrants being removed causing a depression, it means Immigrants sweeping areas like a plague causes problems.

Of course not, this is evident through seeing where the highest concentrations of Asian Americans and Jewish Americans are.

Of course it does, nativist rhetoric and policies like hiring more immigration agents destroy the economies of the areas of interest for that agency.

[Zenfoldor]

You can disagree all you like but this has happened multiple times over the years where nativist language/propaganda has been used to propel a person into power. They promise to be tough on border security and deportation, ramp up the recruitment of border/deportation agents, they aren't vetted due to the political and expedient nature the politician wants it to be completed, border/deportation agents are felonious and engage in unethical behavior, immigrants move from cities where deportation agents are rife with corruption, those cities go through a major recession, next election cycle comes, the past politician is voted out, immigration budgets go back to normal levels, immigrants return to the cities and the economy rebounds.

You have just normalized Trump.

[Deleted]

Of course it does, nativist rhetoric and policies like hiring more immigration agents destroy the economies of the areas of interest for that agency.

Sounds like you draw a narrative based on one small case of something happening that is unrelated to what trump is doing.

Trump is removing the unskilled illegal workers, not forcing them into rural areas.