Concordance of the Legionfall..see you next expansion...

[Deleted]

There are better methods to develop a character in rpg game than endless AP grind, WoW is a full time job now.

1. Need to do WQ for chest
2. Need to do random BG for AP
3. Need to win BG for AP/Quest
4. Need to run EN/TV/NH Normal and Heroics to proc leg (5 till now, 4 utility and 1 QoL)
5. Need to do Mythic+ for weekly chest
6. Need to kill all Danger, Wanted world bosses for leg proc chance.
7. Need to farm gold to survive until next raid (BS/Miner)

There is no time to enjoy the game atm. If i won't do this I'll be even more behind others, especially those with BiS legos.

Umm, and I have 2 alts yet...

You don't "NEED" to do any of this. If you do it it because you choose to. If you CHOOSE to be a mythic raider you're making a choice to be a mythic raider and all that comes with it. If you choose to be casual then you do all that comes with that choice. Blizzard to not force anyone to do anything. Its all choice. So in theory you don't "need" to do anything unless you choose a certain path

[HodorBrodor]

double your primary stat? have you tried playing with gear equipped? not sure how much i have on my main stats but its somewhere above 20000, by the time where you eventually have these 50 ranks you will be covered in ToS gear and have probably something around 30000-35000

Sorry meant to say half idk why I said double, at (890) I have idk ~28k without looking right now, but str out weighs any stat I have (same for alot of classes with their primary) so if Tomb bosses have a dps check like NH does,you're going to need the 50 traits because a proc that substantial outweighs any gear you have.

[munkeyinorbit]

It's only optional if fights don't require it...look at krosus right now, so they're solution after all the complaints and if not evidenced by top end guilds giving up progression was too further increase the grind, well they really aren't getting why people are giving up on this expansion...

I'm pretty sure it is you who is not understanding. It is completely optional. You will get better results if you calm down and play your character right. Bads think it is a gear issue were it really is a gear issue for the top 250 players, and then they prove it is not a gear issue at all. If you want to grind, then grind, but arguments about "needing" a certain level of gear to be able to play the game just makes you look stupid.

[HodorBrodor]

You don't "NEED" to do any of this. If you do it it because you choose to. If you CHOOSE to be a mythic raider you're making a choice to be a mythic raider and all that comes with it. If you choose to be casual then you do all that comes with that choice. Blizzard to not force anyone to do anything. Its all choice. So in theory you don't "need" to do anything unless you choose a certain path

No you NEED to do a majority of that if you want to do anything outside of WQs.

[Desparil]

Cya bye o/

[HodorBrodor]

I'm pretty sure it is you who is not understanding. It is completely optional. You will get better results if you calm down and play your character right. Bads think it is a gear issue were it really is a gear issue for the top 250 players, and then they prove it is not a gear issue at all. If you want to grind, then grind, but arguments about "needing" a certain level of gear to be able to play the game just makes you look stupid.

Ok "needing" is completely relevant...you "need" 34 traits on Mythic Krosus unless half your raid has x2 BiS legendaries or has proced a majority 910+. take a look again those top 250 players have max traits...the argument isn't about gear it's about furthering the AP grind that's already making top end guilds quit.

[Deleted]

Ok "needing" is completely relevant...you "need" 34 traits on Mythic Krosus unless half your raid has x2 BiS legendaries or has proced a majority 910+. take a look again those top 250 players have max traits...the argument isn't about gear it's about furthering the AP grind that's already making top end guilds quit.

Once again though this comes down to "needing" to do something. If you choose to do Mythic Krosus then yes you "NEED" 34 traits etc. But nobody "NEEDS" to do Krosus. Its a choice.

Its a bit like me moaning that I want to be top 1/2 in the world at Tennis but I dont want to spend hours and hours training and practising. I want to do the bare minimum but still be the top tennis player in the world. If you want to do anything that make you the top 1% in the world it requires a lot of work. If it was easy, everyone would do it. If you have to grind for it then so be it. If it was easy everyone would be able to do it therefore you wouldnt be top 1% you would be to 20% and the achievement would be less special.

[munkeyinorbit]

Ok "needing" is completely relevant...you "need" 34 traits on Mythic Krosus unless half your raid has x2 BiS legendaries or has proced a majority 910+. take a look again those top 250 players have max traits...the argument isn't about gear it's about furthering the AP grind that's already making top end guilds quit.

Bad players blame not having gear for not being able to kill a boss. That is what you are doing. These top 250 players are killing these bosses in spite of the gear, not because of it. Sure they worked hard but it is not the gear that killed these bosses, it is the player. That is the lesson you should take away from it. Get better at your character and you will kill bosses too. No one is telling you not to grind if you want to grind. You just have to realise that you are bad before gear and you will be bad after gear if you dont take the time to understand your character and learn to play better. It is time for people to stop expecting to have all the toys right now. Blizzard doesn't expect you to so calm down.

[Dracullus]

All I see is promises, but in the end your kind sadly never leave.

[Servasus]

Blizzard's so far gone outside of what is ACTUALLY wrong with their shitty AP grind that they fail to realize the entire reason people hate it is because they want to be DONE with it. Are there SERIOUSLY people out there who find the idea of grinding AP all expansion (AKA for another year and a half or longer) a fun concept?

[v2nkata]

I don't want to be done with my mmo game. If I want to be done with a game I'll go play single player. So yeah i like to log in and have something to do.

[Deleted]

The people who still think that everyone will quit because they don't like something are so cute.

[Deleted]

First, it kind of muddies the waters a bit. When you wipe on a boss at 1%, or just barely miss a kill window, it can be easy to say "if Todd was doing 2% more damage we'd have won." But when it's a proc, you can't actually be that sure. Maybe Todd needs more AP, or maybe he just got unlucky with procs. Maybe the wipe wasn't Todd's fault at all. Maybe you should be a little nicer to Todd.

No Ion...everyone will be pissed because we missed a kill because of your stupid RNG.

After so many people quit and complain because of RNG their solution is to add more of it...I never thought I'd say this but Legion is the worst expansion in WoW's history and it's getting worse by every single patch. This might be a final nail for the most of raiding community...

[Deleted]

I'm out, sick of this legion design. I have 3 spec max out but I don't want to start another nonstop ap grinding (which seems much worse than the one we had). I really don't understand blizzard's logic, instead of solving the issue (removing ap, share ap between weapons or removing paragon traits) they make it much worse, I mean, W T F?

[Simplex]

Bye, Felicia o/

[Deleted]

No Ion...everyone will be pissed because we missed a kill because of your stupid RNG.

After so many people quit and complain because of RNG their solution is to add more of it...I never thought I'd say this but Legion is the worst expansion in WoW's history and it's getting worse by every single patch. This might be a final nail for the most of raiding community...

What is it with you kind of people that when you don't like something it instantly has to be all doom and gloom.

"Worst expansion in wow's history"
"Final nail for raiding community"
"So many people quit"

Why do you always have to project your opinion as if it was the opinion of everyone else too?

Is it really that hard to just say "i don't like this" without bringing it as if the entire wow playerbase has no option but to agree with your opinion?

[Dracullus]

Blizzard's so far gone outside of what is ACTUALLY wrong with their shitty AP grind that they fail to realize the entire reason people hate it is because they want to be DONE with it. Are there SERIOUSLY people out there who find the idea of grinding AP all expansion (AKA for another year and a half or longer) a fun concept?

It's progression system for whole expansion, end of story. It's only a problem for small minority, and game isn't designed around them. For most it isn't grind, because it comes from every major max level activity in WoW.

When you log in to WoW right now, you have always choice what to do and everything is worth time, thanks to AP and legendary (it need fixes, but it's first implementation of the system, nothing is perfect first time). Imagine your gameplay without AP: your login only on raid nights, so basically second WoD, but with more dungeons or raids.

Most important fix that AP and legendary need, is alt gameplay. I know, they want WoW to be about one character. But after Cata, MoP and WoD, when having multiple alts was easy and lucrative, Vanilla times of having only 1 char are gone. AP and legendary on main character keep you subed (if you like the game, of course) whole expansion, so there is no need to repeat this in the scale 1:1 on alts. They have taken many great ideas from D3, but forget about most important - how D3 treat alts.

My idea for improving AP/legend on alts:

- exponential system for regular traits with AK to back it up - they are implementing this. It is really cool feeling when you get traits that you farmed monts on your main in few days
- account wide paragon traits - but 1) you must earn single paragon trait on same char 2) when you get new paragon trait, progress reset on every char, it is to avoiding farm from non repeatable content on different chars
- free legendary for alts, they could use that BoA tokens for them - your alts have always 1 less that your main - so you will not farm for bad luck protection on many characters.

[Flurryfang]

Yes, it is putting a cap in.... without actually just, you know, capping it. Seriously, can they stop this bullshit "we don't want a cap" while clearly putting a cap on it? Just put a real cap on, call it a cap, be done with it.

In a capitalistic world, people don't like to be limited. The word "boring chore" often gets pulled up when devs put in a real cap. From a dev standpoint, you are gonna get better feedback from the community by simulating endless possibility and freedom, while still keeping up a soft cap to keep the community from going wild.

[Okacz]

You don't "NEED" to do any of this. If you do it it because you choose to. If you CHOOSE to be a mythic raider you're making a choice to be a mythic raider and all that comes with it. If you choose to be casual then you do all that comes with that choice. Blizzard to not force anyone to do anything. Its all choice. So in theory you don't "need" to do anything unless you choose a certain path

Mythic raiders mostly chose to play the game their way - tackling the most difficult content in a well-organized group. Not many of them signed up for all the busywork that comes with it - which is why we see guilds dropping left and right.

Honestly, the introduction of another grind is nothing suprising, it's in line with what Legion has had up till now. Changing it to RNG - well that's another story. Blizzard seems more concerned about the fact that the grind gives you obvious, measurable benefit, and instead would like it to be tied to randomness yet again, so little Todd never feels bad.

[Deleted]

What is it with you kind of people that when you don't like something it instantly has to be all doom and gloom.

"Worst expansion in wow's history"
"Final nail for raiding community"
"So many people quit"

Why do you always have to project your opinion as if it was the opinion of everyone else too?

Is it really that hard to just say "i don't like this" without bringing it as if the entire wow playerbase has no option but to agree with your opinion?

What I said is my opinion, you are the one "projecting" things in you head. But nice to see that MY OPINION triggered you to respond, it must bother you a little after all...