Trump's Immigration Policy will deport Veteran's Wives

[Zeta333]

I suppose my point is that it should not matter what your race, creed, or color, are - if you bleed for America and marry someone, they should be with you no matter what. Trump is ending a policy even green lit by GW Bush - who is a conservative.

You still have to fill out the proper paperwork, marrying a vetran doesnt negate that.

[Stacyrect]

How is it a circumvention of the law and process? They still have to apply for citizenship proper in order to get into the program. The only difference is that they do not have to be uprooted into a country they barely know during a time when their spouse is not there for them in service of the US. They are willing to become citizens and willing to do what is necessary to achieve that. They follow the laws (unless you count having been brought to the US by their parents illegally). They registered with offices and had interviews and paperwork to join the programme. These are not undocumented illegals. They made a conscious choice to come to the government, apply properly and are simply waiting for the government to process them.
The only limbo and grey area here comes from Trump stopping the programme. Now they are in limbo they might simply be deported along with all the bad hombres that the US apparently have so many of because kicking someone out is apparently faster and easier than the process of acquiring a green card. Before the change, they were properly integrated in the process.
(note that, as with any program, there is a chance that some might seek to abuse it. Those people are not included in the 'they'. But the person from the article most certainly is)
Tell me, how is it healthy to remove people that do no harm, are productive members of society, and are waiting for the government and dump them somewhere in the desert in a country they barely know? What is gained from that?

Their is a lawful way to gain legal entry into this country. That program is not apart of the law, it was a program that made an exception to it, which now no longer exists. The program, by its very nature, is a circumvention of that process, particularly in this case because the person was already here. Now, can totally agree, this sucks for her, she's been here for years, didn't willingly come here, was raised here, but she is not a US citizen, or at least yet. She's 20 years old and had plenty of time to complete her N-400 and naturalization process. It's not like she suddenly just discovered she wasn't a US citizen, she knew for years and didn't apply or did apply and was turned down, the article didn't specify. In either case, ample time has been give for her to come forward, become naturalized.

To answer why this is healthy for this country is to ask why wasn't this program implemented as law? I'm fairly sure we are both in agreement that this lady poses no real risk to anyone and it would be rather ridicules to kick her back to timbucktoo only for her to come back in a few months. It invokes anger and sadness and rightfully so. Issues like this SHOULD be serving as a guiding marker to how he want to have our immigration laws. This person is a victim twice through both action and inaction of politicians. People should be angry and demand their legislatures do something about this. People should expect a resolution to this from their lawmakers. It's cases like these which should spur our government to action to right a wrong, instead of bandaiding it. Like it was. This is why shit like this is healthy for our country. The type of shit flying in our government the last 20 years shouldn't be acceptable to anyone.

[Theinquisition]

You still have to fill out the proper paperwork, marrying a vetran doesnt negate that.

Yeah, ive met a lot of soldiers who met their wives in east europe or korea and spent thousands of dollars getting their paperwork straight.

I also knew a few who would bring girlfriends to the states, marry them, and try to exploit the system to allow thrm to stay.

Soldiers are held to the same legal accountibility as anyone else, including immigration.

[PosPosPos]

Lets not pretend Bernie ran on Transgender rights. The rest of it, you can barely see anyone save from some few posters opposing it.

Like this thread right here
There is only three at most five people actually defending tax cuts.

There are at least 8 I counted.

Half of them defended it by making the ridiculous claim that Trump will close all tax loopholes, and/or started bashing liberals on not-even-tangentially related topics because they probably know their stance is indefensible in non-alternative reality.

[jimboa24]

First of all, the article is extremely misleading and tantamount to clickbait shitposting. Secondly, if you start to enforce the law after the law has been ignored for years, you are GOING to get sob stories that make for great bleeding heart fodder. So what? If you want to live here, do it legally. Fill out the forms, pay the fees, take the damn test. Why the fuck are people insisting on coming here, refusing to leave, and throwing a fucking fit when they inevitably get deported because they deliberately, purposefully didn't become legal citizens? If you want to live here, awesome! Come on in - but fill out your fucking paperwork you special fucking snowflake.

I'm also getting sick of people on the left who are deliberately, intentionally trying to make it sound like Republicans are against immigrants and immigration when they conveniently forget to add the qualifier of "illegal" before immigrant. You know why this shit pisses me off? Because there are LEGAL immigrants who are busting their ass working 80 hour weeks so they can afford to bring their families over to the United States legally, and whenever someone overstays their green card or hops the fence and hopes the government doesn't notice, they are basically spitting in the face and giving a giant middle finger to immigrants who came here legally. Fuck illegal immigrants - deport them all and if they really want to live here, they can fill out their fucking paperwork, pay their dues, and come here legally.

But what about people who were brought here by their parents as kids illegally? We put them on the spot - give them a set amount of time to start the process of immigrating legally. If they refuse to complete the process, deport them. Give them a chance to do the right thing and if they refuse, kick them out. No more of this bullshit about pretending the U.S. doesn't have sovereign borders.

Oh, and don't get me started on the businesses in the United States that knowingly hire illegal immigrants. If you ask me, the government should shut down all businesses they can prove that either knowingly hired illegal immigrants, or blatantly turned a blind eye to hiring illegal immigrants. And fuck the farmers who cry foul - they can and should be hiring legal immigrants or citizens.

[NED funded]

There are at least 8 I counted.

Half of them defended it by making the ridiculous claim that Trump will close all tax loopholes, and/or started bashing liberals on not-even-tangentially related topics because they probably know their stance is indefensible in non-alternative reality.

Thanks for proving my point. See @Wells?

[GreenJesus]

At least make up clever shit.

a non-liberal poster here would have been banned for saying something like this. GG MMOCHAMP..

[Auxora]

Well there are 2 parts to this. One is the fact that she was already technically in the country illegally *before* getting married, which is key as far as how the law deals with the situation. It's not the same as some have described if a US citizen married someone not a US citizen, who had not entered the country illegally, where then the spouse could simply go through the normal citizenship application process as some have suggested. The law on the other hand is not nearly as friendly to someone entering the country illegally and then getting married. So that situation already put her in hot water. Then combine that with Trump rescinding all of those types of orders which then included PiP, without expressing saying PiP was excluded, lead to her being at risk for deportation. Now whether that omission of an exclusion for PiP was an oversight or intentional by Trump's administration is an interesting question, but considering they've had time to clarify and did nothing to communicate that PiP still stands, it appears intentional. Legally unless Trump adds an exception I'd say she's probably out of luck.

The second part is the moral question of Dreamers and veteran's spouses that had broken the law but were staying in the US under PiP and whether they should now be deported with that rescinded. That's a tough call, part of me says it's a no-brainer to have veteran's spouses be given an exception. But, it does already seem like every illegal where the possibility of deportation comes up every single one has a sob story whether it's a veteran connection, school, work, family, children, health, elder parents they are caring for, etc. A person could probably come up with a sad title for a thread like this for every one of those. This situation is always sad. But I think if you start trying to make those calls on who stays or goes, before long no one would go. So either immigration plays those games where the illegals that come up with the best excuses stay, or take the approach that it looks like Trump is wanting them to do which is to treat all illegals the same. Whether that's more fair to them or just cold-hearted, I guess is a question of perspective.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

a non-liberal poster here would have been banned for saying something like this. GG MMOCHAMP..

A non-liberal poster posted that all liberals hate soldiers...no infraction.

Dat Victim Complex though

[Wells]

Lets not pretend Bernie ran on Transgender rights. The rest of it, you can barely see anyone save from some few posters opposing it.

Like this thread right here
There is only three at most five people actually defending tax cuts.

Don't need to pretend anything, nor do I need to address a single given thread when the topic of the thread isn't even one of the things I listed.

[kail]

Sauce for this pretty ludicrous claim? Or is this one of those, "feels" things?

I've lost expectations of him in backing any of his claims. It's a pattern with supertony.

[Kiri]

Their is a lawful way to gain legal entry into this country. That program is not apart of the law, it was a program that made an exception to it, which now no longer exists. The program, by its very nature, is a circumvention of that process, particularly in this case because the person was already here. Now, can totally agree, this sucks for her, she's been here for years, didn't willingly come here, was raised here, but she is not a US citizen, or at least yet. She's 20 years old and had plenty of time to complete her N-400 and naturalization process. It's not like she suddenly just discovered she wasn't a US citizen, she knew for years and didn't apply or did apply and was turned down, the article didn't specify. In either case, ample time has been give for her to come forward, become naturalized.

To answer why this is healthy for this country is to ask why wasn't this program implemented as law? I'm fairly sure we are both in agreement that this lady poses no real risk to anyone and it would be rather ridicules to kick her back to timbucktoo only for her to come back in a few months. It invokes anger and sadness and rightfully so. Issues like this SHOULD be serving as a guiding marker to how he want to have our immigration laws. This person is a victim twice through both action and inaction of politicians. People should be angry and demand their legislatures do something about this. People should expect a resolution to this from their lawmakers. It's cases like these which should spur our government to action to right a wrong, instead of bandaiding it. Like it was. This is why shit like this is healthy for our country. The type of shit flying in our government the last 20 years shouldn't be acceptable to anyone.

I reckon Obama, who simply formalized something that a Republican president implemented, did not believe anyone would be against protecting the spouses of soldiers. Before Trump, I don't think anyone would have seen a need to do so.Bush likely implemented it that way because he needed a solution quickly, before the spouse of that MIA soldier got deported.
Making something a full law, rather than an executive order (remember, EOs allow a president to amend how a law is applied, making them akin to law as well - just one that the next president can unilaterally repeal), is a lengthy process. Even if it is something that both sides agree on, the other party might want to bundle it with something else, some random concession you have to make in order to get it through. Or, in Obama's case, they just generally seek to oppose anything you wish to implement for political gain.
The people _are_ currently angry and demand their legislatures to do something about such things. Just look at what is happening in many townhalls. But their voice seems to be pretty much ignored by their congressmen and senators. At the moment, congress is pretty much marginalized - the democrats, whom you so, ahem, hilariously compared to children throwing a tantrum, can't get anything through, though they are fighting for what their constituents want. The Republicans, yeah, they don't do much outside of waving through a conservative agenda which frankly does not care about immigrants all that much. At the same time, the president just throws EOs out, ignoring congress whenever he can.
It would be healthy if this would spur lawmakers into properly implementing this, but it is highly unlikely via that channel. Given Trump's hard line stance against immigration, a law specifically assisting immigrants will have no chance to be implemented - that base of his will go after Republicans that support it. It needs media and protesters to become a big enough issue to come onto the floor atm - which is why it is unhealthy to tell people to shut up about it. A lot of Americans, likely many in this forum, are currently disillusioned by the US political system which has led to such a polarizing policy to be implemented to begin with.
In summary, the US political system appears to be in an unhealthy state at the moment. Just allowing it to be continuously used in such a way is unhealthy as well, so putting attention on something like this happening is a good thing, not superfluous outrage. If this thread has a chance to get even one person to actually tell their congressman to do something about it, it is worthwhile.

The second part is the moral question of Dreamers and veteran's spouses that had broken the law but were staying in the US under PiP and whether they should now be deported with that rescinded. That's a tough call, part of me says it's a no-brainer to have veteran's spouses be given an exception. But, it does already seem like every illegal where the possibility of deportation comes up every single one has a sob story whether it's a veteran connection, school, work, family, children, health, elder parents they are caring for, etc. A person could probably come up with a sad title for a thread like this for every one of those. This situation is always sad. But I think if you start trying to make those calls on who stays or goes, before long no one would go. So either immigration plays those games where the illegals that come up with the best excuses stay, or take the approach that it looks like Trump is wanting them to do which is to treat all illegals the same. Whether that's more fair to them or just cold-hearted, I guess is a question of perspective.

Well, that is why we had PiP, isn't it? It's not like it applied to all spouses everywhere. They had to get recommendations and paperwork to apply for PiP, following regulated guidelines. It was not about excuses to stay, it was to protect those that are likely to get a dreamcard and had a non-malicious reason for coming to the country (i.e. children that were just brought here). So it is not really about sob stories, but about repealing a government program that worked being repealed for no apparent reason outside of "now we can deport more people more easily". Don't think Trump wants to treat all illegals fairly. Otherwise he would have said something about his own wife illegally working in the US before getting her Green Card.

[Zeek Daniels]

So, active duty military servicemembers spouses are now some of the "bad hombres" that Trump wants to deport, and while the servicemember may be deployed on the other side of the world, no less.

MAKING AMERICA GREAT AGAIN.

law breakers are law breakers.

[Wells]

Military worship at a fevered pitch? To the point where a fellow vet of your thinks all soldiers are above insulting? Also, for being so "murican" it's odd you guys would be in the Trump camp, or do you really like North Korea?

Honestly, the best part is he's telling other people to get out of the 60s while bitching about people spitting on soldiers or some such shit.

[Themius]

I suppose my point is that it should not matter what your race, creed, or color, are - if you bleed for America and marry someone, they should be with you no matter what. Trump is ending a policy even green lit by GW Bush - who is a conservative.

I wouldn't mind Bush right about now... I thought he was a decent president.

[Theinquisition]

Maybe his free coffee at Starbucks was cold? Clearly a liberal conspiracy against the vets. Meanwhile, in the real world you can look to each and every time those Vet loving republicans have tried to attack their benefits.

Oh you mean when democrats attach unrelated riders to vet bills then whine abour it when they dont get passed?

We get it, this isnt new, folks like you and wells hate servicemembers and hide behind claims that we expect hero worship.

No, we expect basic respect and to be left alone.

Its fine...because most veterans hate folks like you on the left and are the butt of many of our jokes, just like we are of yours.

There's a whole new generation of war vets who are conservatives and are flooding universities and colleges throughout the U.S. your unchallenged dominance of the post secondary education is at an end. This upcoming generation is expected to be the most conservative n decades, we are going to be a part of that by challenging folks like you at every opportunity and showing this new generation just how hateful you are.

[Theinquisition]

What the fuck are you even on about now? You and your victim complex started this nonsense. No one came in here attacking you. And please, stop talking about things you have no idea about, like who my friends are.

Lol

The only victims around here are the ones that your ideology tells to acknowledge. Better go check your privilege.

Its fine, hate veterans. We hate you too.

[Theinquisition]

Me- Not all liberals hate vets.
You- I hate you. Baseless claims about people I hang out with. Toss in some "check your privilege". And then some nonsense about how hateful we are.

Are you okay?

Youre right, not all liberals hate vets....leftist bernie supporters like yourself hate vets.

We hate you and your ilk to, and will vote accordingly.

[Turaska]

It still boggles my mind the amount of absolute imbeciles that believe a word that comes out of this mans mouth.

Slightly NSFW, some strong language

[Zecora]

Oh you mean when democrats attach unrelated riders to vet bills then whine abour it when they dont get passed?

We get it, this isnt new, folks like you and wells hate servicemembers and hide behind claims that we expect hero worship.

No, we expect basic respect and to be left alone.

Its fine...because most veterans hate folks like you on the left and are the butt of many of our jokes, just like we are of yours.

There's a whole new generation of war vets who are conservatives and are flooding universities and colleges throughout the U.S. your unchallenged dominance of the post secondary education is at an end. This upcoming generation is expected to be the most conservative n decades, we are going to be a part of that by challenging folks like you at every opportunity and showing this new generation just how hateful you are.

You need to get a grip. You accuse others of being "hateful", but YOU are the one throwing wild accusations (accusations that honestly makes me sick) around. Go sober up before you post any more, because you are giving the "vets" you seem to think you speak for a bad name.