Scotland's First Minister, Nicola Sturgeon, calls for fresh independence referendum

[Elba]

Better wording would be if she goes down to the anti immigrant party in Germany. Either way the markets see Merkel as an extremely strong figure in Europe and her getting defeated would send shockwaves.

That's not going to happen, though. Next chancellor will be either Merkel or Schulz. Neither win will make "shockwaves".

[Tennis]

Better wording would be if she goes down to the anti immigrant party in Germany. Either way the markets see Merkel as an extremely strong figure in Europe and her getting defeated would send shockwaves.

Chancellor Merkel is here to stay
Have you not seen the polls.

[Gully Man]

Seems like she didn't take the result on saturday too well.

[Dizzeeyooo]

As it stands the vast majority of Scots either wanted to leave the EU or didn't care either way.

38% of Scots that voted, voted to leave the EU, vs 62% voting to remain - how do you conclude that the vast majority of Scots want to leave the EU from that? lol

[Deleted]

Scotland basically gets the best deal out of every nation in Great britain;

It's local economy is a shambles, with the vast majority of jobs owned by the Scottish Government,

It costs the NHS much more than Wales or England.

Has it's own government and representation in the house of commons, while Ironically, England does not.

An easy way to solve this is to do another independence referendum; But let the entire GB decide. You'd find people don't really like carrying dead weight.

[Deleted]

Let's get it done. Scotlanders deserve freedom.

Yeah it's overdue, but better late than never. Let your people stand on their own 2 feet.

Overdue? They had a chance 4 years ago and voted to stay, even today most opinion polls suggest most people in Scotland do not want independence because it's financially suicidal. This is all about the SNP nothing more

[Rend Blackhand]

Getting in early before this thread gets out of hand. I think we should all keep in mind what we're arguing here, not the possibility of Scotland being able to go independent, but the pros and cons of such. Additionally, lets be very clear about what this means, its not an US v THEM, its a decision on how to govern ones self. There is no animosity.

Now, I like everyone else was patient after the first vote, we voted No, and we let the UK prove us wrong, that we were a valued member, but that hasnt been the case, its an almost indefensible position to say that the UK is listening to our voice. I'm personally a bit worried that the vote might be too soon, however I do hope the vote this time round, will be one thats conducted in a manner befitting a developed country as our own.

Additionally, topics such as EU membership, deficit and others are topics we need more information on to begin discussing, I fully hope that talks will actually take place this time round, so we can have definitive answers.

Nicola Sturgeon demanded special arrangements for Scotland which she knew would never happen. It was always an attempt to engineer a second referendum.

I don't live in Scotland any more and my English accent frees me from the embarrassment that this woman and her party causes.

[Deleted]

Overdue? They had a chance 4 years ago and voted to stay, even today most opinion polls suggest most people in Scotland do not want independence because it's financially suicidal. This is all about the SNP nothing more

Let's not forget SNP have been constantly campaigning off of the back of the University students and blind nationalists, making Scotland worse by the year.

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Nicola Sturgeon demanded special arrangements for Scotland which she knew would never happen. It was always an attempt to engineer a second referendum.

I don't live in Scotland any more and my English accent frees me from the embarrassment that this woman and her party causes.

Her Party is the biggest blight on Scotland than the English ever were.

[caervek]

As it stands the vast majority of Scots either wanted to leave the EU or didn't care either way

how do you conclude that

37.75% of Scots voted to remain in the EU, 23.14% voted to leave, 39.11% didn't care about it enough to vote.

Ergo: As it stands the vast majority of Scots either wanted to leave the EU or didn't care either way, so the idea this will be enough to swing a second vote (or even enough to warrant one) is fundamentally flawed.

[Deleted]

Let me just add I am not against a second referendum simply because if it happens Nicola Sturgeon can finally fuck off when people vote against independence again. Personally I find the woman an opportunistic cow, she always wanted to use Brexit as a catalyst for independence no matter how much she denies it

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37.75% of Scots voted to remain in the EU, 23.14% voted to leave, 39.11% didn't care about it another to vote.

Ergo: As it stands the vast majority of Scots either wanted to leave the EU or didn't care either way.

I made a similar observation

SNP and certain people exaggerate the number of people in Scotland that are actually passionate about the EU. I suspect more are Scotland #1 EU #?.

[Deleted]

[Rend Blackhand]

So blame the Better Together campaign for making promises they cant keep then?

I dont understand why people freak out about the SNP, they were voted in, even after a lost referendum, they are literally doing what their manifesto says they want to do. You might as well just insult the people of Scotland instead, since its technically their fault.

The SNP lost their majority in the Scottish parliament, they have very little right to do this. Ruth Davidson is soaring in popularity because she's he only one who stands up the the Nationalists.

After the referendum, the Scottish parliament was granted a lot of new powers including powers over certain taxes. The better together campaign did keep its end of the deal.

[Deleted]

Right but, and again, the Better Together campaign specifically said, voting No is a vote to stay in the EU, now Brexit is going ahead with no concern for how it affects our future, or our economy, which is fundementally different to South Englands economy.

Scapegoating Nicola Sturgeon like you all scapegoated Salmond is just fucking ridiculous. We voted her in.

It isn't scapegoating when it's her words!

[Deleted]

Right but, and again, the Better Together campaign specifically said, voting No is a vote to stay in the EU, now Brexit is going ahead with no concern for how it affects our future, or our economy, which is fundementally different to South Englands economy.

Scapegoating Nicola Sturgeon like you all scapegoated Salmond is just fucking ridiculous. We voted her in.

What Economy? Sturgeon has done nothing to solve the problems that Scotland is an economic dead space. All she does is blame England for the problems of Scotland, yet Scotland has more autonomy than anywhere else in the UK.

Hell, Brexit is a fantastic opportunity for Scotland to reinvigorate it's own economy; but Scottish farmers are fantastically inept fools who needed the EU to pay for everything for them.

[Rockyreg]

Right but, and again, the Better Together campaign specifically said, voting No is a vote to stay in the EU, now Brexit is going ahead with no concern for how it affects our future, or our economy, which is fundementally different to South Englands economy.

Scapegoating Nicola Sturgeon like you all scapegoated Salmond is just fucking ridiculous. We voted her in.

The SNP white paper also said voting to 'remain in the UK', ' raises the serious possibility that Scotland will be forced to leave the EU against
the wishes of the people of Scotland'

Are you saying the people of Scotland didn't know what they were voting for?

[caervek]

Let me just add I am not against a second referendum simply because if it happens Nicola Sturgeon can finally fuck off when people vote against independence again. Personally I find the woman an opportunistic cow, she always wanted to use Brexit as a catalyst for independence no matter how much she denies it

The thing I find funny is, one of her arguments for the need for another indyref, is that the collapse of Labour means Tories in power until 2030 (which is debatable). This coming from the woman who actively sabotaged labour in England/Wales during the 2015 election causing them to do worse than in 2010. Hell it's because of her that I now have a tory MP instead of the labour MP who held the seat for over a quarter century.

Sneaky, manipulative *****.

[JohnBrown1917]

Chancellor Merkel is here to stay
Have you not seen the polls.

You mean the one where the CDU is close to the SDP?

[Deleted]

I would think being the winning party by a significant number would give the right to do so, additionally Ruth Davidson isnt soaring in popularity, shes absorbing labour seats after they committed ritual suicide. I wont deny she's gaining ground but your wording is just provocative.

Did it though? We've had token tax powers returned as any country should have, yet we still dont control the majority of our economy. Additionally we're now being flung out of the EU against our will.

You don't control your economy because most of it is funded by England, If you want total economic autonomy, stop accepting the tax money you get from England.

[Rend Blackhand]

I would think being the winning party by a significant number would give the right to do so, additionally Ruth Davidson isnt soaring in popularity, shes absorbing labour seats after they committed ritual suicide. I wont deny she's gaining ground but your wording is just provocative.

Did it though? We've had token tax powers returned as any country should have, yet we still dont control the majority of our economy. Additionally we're now being flung out of the EU against our will.

The power to increase or decrease tax is not token. Scotland is not some oppressed colony as you may like to think.

I also find it sad how many people have bought into the EU being automatically the greatest thing ever. The SNP didn't give two shits before Brexit came about.

And even if leaving the EU would be bad for Scotland, leaving the UK afterwards would be catastrophic.

I also find the principle of SNP style independence to be confusing. Why would any country or territory demand their sovereignty and then immediately surrender that sovereignty to Brussels?

[Rockyreg]

I would think being the winning party by a significant number would give the right to do so, additionally Ruth Davidson isnt soaring in popularity, shes absorbing labour seats after they committed ritual suicide. I wont deny she's gaining ground but your wording is just provocative.

Did it though? We've had token tax powers returned as any country should have, yet we still dont control the majority of our economy. Additionally we're now being flung out of the EU against our will.

this is simply incorrect unless ballot papers in Scotland said 'do you want to remain in the EU in an independent scotland'