New WoW (or new game) - A Raiding MOBA?

[Ratyrel]

Well, I didn't mean a "pure MOBA" but rather a "instant-raid" game where you skip RPG elements. I can't find a single game like that on the market, which makes me wish I was a programmer, I could make serious money with that idea :P

And I never wanted it to REPLACE wow, just an additional MODE.

There are entirely instanced mmos around. It's not as fun as it may seem; having the contrast of the open world is what makes instanced content special in WoW and other MMOs. Purely instanced/dungeon-based MMOs 1) constantly break immersion through loading screens 2) make you farm the same instance dozens and dozens of time non-stop. The model very quickly exposes that the game is just a big wheel crushing your will to live.

[Deleted]

So basically a forced multiplayer Diablo? It has been done before. There are Asian mmos like that on the market right now. Not doing too well, though.

[Rafoel]

Just let people jump right into the content they want to do anyway.

They "want to" do it? Hmmmmm...

Nobody likes running dungeons. They do it once to see the content, they do it more times to get the gear.

Nobody likes doing raids. Some do it for feeling of competition. Some do it for their relations with other players. Some just want to get best epics.

Nobody likes playing battlegrounds or arenas. They do it because they like to test themselves against other players. To prove their skill. To get their gear.

Don't believe me? Imagine this:

The dungeons have all no story, full random layouts, and they award you no gear. Would you run them?

Nobody else in the world cares about raids, or even WoW. You can participate in raid only with group of 19 AI human-like characters. They play, but they don't talk. There is nobody to compete with, just farm it over and over for no reason, as there is no gear too. Would you do that?

Characters in battlegrounds and arenas have completely random abilities. Instead of using specific skill, there is only one button - random skill. And that random skill still deals completely random damage, from 0 to one-shot. On a random target in range, but the range is also random. And the flags in WG? Each second you get completely random buff or debuff to speed, and also have the chance to automatically return the flag to base.
It sounds retarded? Because it is! It's the scenario in which it's completely impossible to test yourself against other players and prove any skill you might have, because everything is random! Te graphics and goal of battlegrounds and arenas stays the same though. Would you play it?


The essence of MMORPGs is progress of character, especially in comparison to other player's (if all players have same progress, there is no progress). So please, if you don't give a fuck about MMORPG genre, and find it irritating, because the only reason you play this game is:

1) being spoon-fed interesting story, like movie you can be part of
2) socializing with other people, but in WoW instead of club or even facebook
3) clashing with other players in pointless skirmishes, proving that you, Jack Duck, is better at mashing buttons than Bob Hob 2 streets away

at least stop trying to take away the MMO-specific content because it forces you to sometimes to something else than 3 points above, while playing an MMO.

[Deleted]

Isn't DnD online somewhat like that?

The thing here is; gamification is present in MOBAs just as well it is present in MMOs.
LoL has leveling and so does HotS... and DotA2... well that's just a russian infested shithole the way i see it.

Thing is; you are asking for something that is just not sustainable and will probably not happen.

[Sencha]

Looks like a giant LFR where you choose the difficulty. No thanks.

[Lillyth]

"and I though the game peaked at Cataclysm"

I stopped reading there.

[randomnamegenerator16]

No. Go away with such ideas. You want to play moba? Play them. But don't push this miserable genre into everything else, it already destroyed RTSes, we don't need it in WoW.

[Spiral Mage]

They "want to" do it? Hmmmmm...

Nobody likes running dungeons. They do it once to see the content, they do it more times to get the gear.

Nobody likes doing raids. Some do it for feeling of competition. Some do it for their relations with other players. Some just want to get best epics.

Nobody likes playing battlegrounds or arenas. They do it because they like to test themselves against other players. To prove their skill. To get their gear.

Don't believe me? Imagine this:

The dungeons have all no story, full random layouts, and they award you no gear. Would you run them?

Nobody else in the world cares about raids, or even WoW. You can participate in raid only with group of 19 AI human-like characters. They play, but they don't talk. There is nobody to compete with, just farm it over and over for no reason, as there is no gear too. Would you do that?

Characters in battlegrounds and arenas have completely random abilities. Instead of using specific skill, there is only one button - random skill. And that random skill still deals completely random damage, from 0 to one-shot. On a random target in range, but the range is also random. And the flags in WG? Each second you get completely random buff or debuff to speed, and also have the chance to automatically return the flag to base.
It sounds retarded? Because it is! It's the scenario in which it's completely impossible to test yourself against other players and prove any skill you might have, because everything is random! Te graphics and goal of battlegrounds and arenas stays the same though. Would you play it?


The essence of MMORPGs is progress of character, especially in comparison to other player's (if all players have same progress, there is no progress). So please, if you don't give a fuck about MMORPG genre, and find it irritating, because the only reason you play this game is:

1) being spoon-fed interesting story, like movie you can be part of
2) socializing with other people, but in WoW instead of club or even facebook
3) clashing with other players in pointless skirmishes, proving that you, Jack Duck, is better at mashing buttons than Bob Hob 2 streets away

at least stop trying to take away the MMO-specific content because it forces you to sometimes to something else than 3 points above, while playing an MMO.

But the problem is that I enjoy all the things you say no one wants to do. I enjoy dungeons, I enjoy raids. And I enjoy doing them more than once, and if you don't think that's true of people, remember, that is the basis of literally >every< MMO in existence and they are still an extremely popular genre of game. So what you're implying doesn't quite work.

And nearly every player I've met over my many, many, many years on the game and in the community, also enjoys the same activities, though for quite a range of various reasons but in the overwhelming case, they do enjoy it and many of them enjoy it more as a social activity, and are more disheartened with the current game because it supports and has even move strongly toward "I just PUG with strangers". With so many cross-realm features, the sense of being able to run a dungeon and make a new friend, or run it with groups of people you know, has been on a serious decline and is largely the source of people feeling more like now it's just a grind.

Sadly, the cross realm features were a necessary evil in the wake of the many evolutions the game has undergone since launch and for better or worse, I support all these features.

So while you may not enjoy playing anymore, it is absolutely not true for everyone else.

[l33t]

No. Go away with such ideas. You want to play moba? Play them. But don't push this miserable genre into everything else, it already destroyed RTSes, we don't need it in WoW.

I second this, and want to add: no character progression/gear = absolutely no reason to run content once you've beat it. I'm amused that you don't understand that, OP.

Also: you don't "main" characters in Overwatch, at least if you're playing the game a little bit better than a cat prancing on a keyboard. The game is based on switching characters all the time during match. If you don't do that, you're seriously gimping your team.

Also #2: On the contrary to Overwatch, MMORPGs are not supposed to allow players to switch class on the fly. They are designed around people playing one main, once and forever. Speaking about raids, playing your main instead of switching to fotm classes every next patch is a part of the challenge. I do agree though that achievements in wow should be made truly account bound.

[Battlebeard]

There are entirely instanced mmos around. It's not as fun as it may seem; having the contrast of the open world is what makes instanced content special in WoW and other MMOs. Purely instanced/dungeon-based MMOs 1) constantly break immersion through loading screens 2) make you farm the same instance dozens and dozens of time non-stop. The model very quickly exposes that the game is just a big wheel crushing your will to live.

You can defenitly make it replayable, if you add many difficulties. As well as new raids and bosses.

- - - Updated - - -

Yes but whats the satisfaction in killing it over and over again once you know and can kill him in one go? Then the ony satisfaction is the gear.

Yeah, farm raids sucks, but this game mode could allow all raids from vanilla to legion, with multiple difficulties, would offer many many hours of fun