Legion feels like an Alliance expansion

[Xarathan]

I take it you don't remember us having to talk to and Help Vol'Jin in 5.2? Escalation? The alliance were just an afterthought in that entire storyline. That raid was about the HORDE taking back Orgrimmar, if you did it as the alliance, you know how it felt like you weren't even supposed to be there. All of WoD was us talking to orcs about helping other orcs fight some orcs because the other orcs are being mean to the good orcs. We do know what it's like, to talk to and help the other faction. Better than you do.

so much of this. thank you

[Honik]

After shitton development of horde characters (Garrosh, Thrall, Nazgrim, Lul'jin who sadly did nothing in the end, Sylvanas and hell even Lor'themar in MoP) ppl can still bitch about little light Alliance got?
Let's see what Alli got in meantime... Crazy bitch Jaina, little Anduin in MoP, bombed Theramore, Tyrande's cameo in SoO, Taylor and Maraad - last two good alliance characters and guess how they ended.
The only upper hand Alliance got was knowing that Wrathion wanted alliance to win in MoP.
Not to mention Anduin is supposed to be leader of Army of the light according to Velen, so yea he needs to come up

And no I'm not alliance player

[Ashelin]

I take it you don't remember us having to talk to and Help Vol'Jin in 5.3? Escalation? The alliance were just an afterthought in that entire storyline. That raid was about the HORDE taking back Orgrimmar, if you did it as the alliance, you know how it felt like you weren't even supposed to be there. All of WoD was us talking to orcs about helping other orcs fight some orcs because the other orcs are being mean to the good orcs. We do know what it's like, to talk to and help the other faction. Better than you do.

Tried to edit the original post, 5.3 was escalation, that's all I tried to change, and it deleted it. Not very good at the whole forums thing I guess.

[Andromedes]

Remember when Alliance players were called whiny, because they were complaining about all that shit that happened to Alliance during Cata?
As some horde players were saying:''Stop whining, there cant be faction balance. Sometimes you gain, sometimes you lose.''

Anyway OP, tell me how Anduin is thrown everywhere.

[Deleted]

Thing I think a lot of people are missing is what the focus has been. It's not about "It's fun to kill orcs" or "Malfurion and Thrall are the same lulz", it's about where the time and effort are put in.

Vanilla: Can't fairly say, I joined in BC

BC: Arguably leaning a little towards Horde. Horde get their specific big lore moment with Thrall meeting Garrosh and talking about his father, as well as a lot of blood elf focus with the Sunwell being the grand finale. Illidan was there, I guess, but Illidan has never been a member of the horde nor the alliance, is not a hero for either, and is also barely there.

Wrath: Unquestionably alliance focused. We were dealing with an ex-alliance hero, regained the king of Stormwind, a small token thing with the Forsaken which, although horrifying, didn't amount to much in the grand scheme of things, and some personal character stuff with Saurfang. An alliance hero becomes neutral to take over one faction later down the line, and the horde has Garrosh yell like a dumbass and cause problems.

Cata: Horde focused in a really, really bad way. The 1-60 experience becomes "Horde gain ground and act awesome under their awesome new warchief", while the Alliance struggles to hold ground. Malfurian comes back, which people count as an alliance hero. Here's the thing though, he's not, has never been, and seemingly never will be. He's so damn neutral he fucking stands around while the horde murder his wife. Meanwhile, Thrall "goes neutral" seemingly for balance, but after years of being the face of the horde he's difficult, if not impossible, to seperate him from the horde.
Think of it this way. Malfurian sits around in one zone for a bit, has some dialogue with a neutral threat, then has a big part in Firelands. Thrall decides the new warchief, decides the goblins are part of the horde, then gets to have a big wedding, then goes on to save the world. The two aren't even close to comparable.
This is all even further compounded with the Twilight Highlands. I can't remember where, but I swear I read that Blizzard ran out of time for the Alliance side because they were focusing on Horde. Therefore Horde gets a big badass entrance where they fly in on zepplins, and Garrosh gets to act like a badass. Alliance gets some vague old god stuff and then get thrown in out of, basically, no where by some insane dwarf in a plane. You speak to red dragons. They tell the Horde they will help them even though the dragons were once enslaved by them. They tell the alliance...the exact same thing even though that never happened.

Mists: This expansion started out so well. People only remember the SoO, but the start was well handled. Even conflict, nice equal sharing of the blame, it was so good.
Theramore was a huge shock which affected both the Alliance in a "Holy shit our town exploded" way, and the Horde in a "Holy shit our leader is going off the deep end" way. We got development for Varian, we got Garrosh slipping deeper and deeper into paranoia and villany, and if it wasn't for Siege of Orgrimmar I honestly think this would have been the most balanced expansion ever.
But the problem is we can't just discount Siege. It happened. It was huge. And anyone who says that it's "fun" for horde players to attack their own city, kill one of their best heroes, and ultimately fight their leader is an idiot, but you really can't deny that the focus of the story was on the Horde, Garrosh's madness, Vol'jin working to stop him, and Thrall's guilt in letting things get that far [and again, as the face of the horde since WC3, Thrall's supposed 'Neutrality' doesn't really work. He even decides the next warchief for crying out loud]. The best the alliance gets is getting to help, then a brief "Now don't you do that again." There was a lot of potential for the expansion to be more equal, but it all had to get fucked over by that one raid. And I love SoO, but it ruins any kind of faction balance.

WoD: I hate this expansion. And a gigantic reason is "orcs orcs orcs orcs orcs orcs orcs orcs." This is the expansion which kills any kind of enjoyment I have for the race.
What is the focus? "Here is a bunch of old orc heroes from lore. These are the origins of the orcish horde, and we get to experience so much orcs." Draenei FINALLY get a little bit of story focus, and introduce Yrel, and it's nice having a female alliance hero who isn't insane [Jaina], Shady as fuck [Moira], useless [Tyrande, A.K.A I'm gonna play second fiddle to my husband who stands around and lets me get murdered, and get lectured on tactics by a man thousands of years my junior and thousands of years less experienced than me] or a combination of the three. But that doesn't change the gigantic orc focus.
But here's the thing I have to concede. It's an "ORC" focus, not in and of itself a "HORDE" focus. I still stand by that all of the Warlords in and of themselves a huge figures in the horde's history, but I can more than understand when horde players who don't play orcs don't like it when WoD is called a "horde" expansion. I will say that finally dealing with Garrosh, a huge part of the Horde storyline, and Thrall stealing the limelight once again, is horde focused however.

Legion: Alliance leaning. Highmountain dropped the ball gigantically in general, we could have had a lot more horde focus there and have it still be reasonably neutral. Val is very night elf focused [not nessecarily Alliance focused, I still stand by Malfurion being infuriatingly neutral]. We kill off Ysera, a heavy night elf involved figure, and no matter how you slice it Tyrande is now an Alliance hero, and a big part of the zone is helping her.
7.1 was good and balanced from what I saw, then again I switched to playing Horde pretty much exclusively this expansion so I might be missing something. 7.2 is...awkward. People like to put Illidan and Maive as "Alliance" heroes. Neither have been part of either faction, ever, and if we can't count WoD's "ORCSORCSORCSORCSORCSORCSORCSORCS" as being about the Horde, we can't count either of them as being Alliance. Khadgar is a good example of an arguably Alliance hero turning neutral, as he's consistantly stood up for and worked with the Horde. Meanwhile Velan is alliance, and 3 neutrals and an alliance hero is still aliiance leaning.

I tried to stay as unbaised and objective as I could, but no matter how I look at it, the Horde has had a much bigger hand in the story for the last few expansions, and it's nice having a little bit of alliance leaning here.

[Lillyth]

The draenei on Draenor are the fucking same as the draenei on Azeroth, only 30 years younger. (Admittedly not much of a difference in Velen's case.)

Again, they have no connection whatsoever with the Draenei on Azeroth. There was no story impact apart from poor Maraad dying for nothing.

[Nero Stormchester]

During Cata Horde had the whole Garrosh uprising, during MoP he developed and the last raid was literally IN Orgrimmar.. During WoD you got reminded every. single. day. about the Horde.. but NOW you complain about too much Alliance?

Alliance just has better and more relevant leaders when it comes to a GLOBAL threat, that's just a fact

How is RAIDING Ogrimar Horde centric? if anything it's Alliance bias. I mean you guys got to raid and pillage our capital. To do this to Stormwind was basically Garrosh's wet dream

[Deleted]

What I find most amusing is that Legion is essentially meant to be the "We share a common enemy that is much greater than either of us, let's put aside our differences for now and join together to fight it!" expansion, and yet we have threads like this.

[Honik]

How is RAIDING Ogrimar Horde centric? if anything it's Alliance bias. I mean you guys got to raid and pillage our capital. To do this to Stormwind was basically Garrosh's wet dream

how about RETAKING IT BACK, gosh

What I find most amusing is that Legion is essentially meant to be the "We share a common enemy that is much greater than either of us, let's put aside our differences for now and join together to fight it!" expansion, and yet we have threads like this.

finally someone who knows whats up

[Zazajin]

Remember when Alliance players were called whiny, because they were complaining about all that shit that happened to Alliance during Cata?
As some horde players were saying:''Stop whining, there cant be faction balance. Sometimes you gain, sometimes you lose.''

Anyway OP, tell me how Anduin is thrown everywhere.

Issue for me isn't that we're losing, it's still story. It's that there isn't any Horde story in Legion besides Sylvanas' questline in Stormheim. Losing's fine, but no story whatsoever is a bit rubbish.

[Deleted]

I mean I haven't finished all the storylines in all the zones yet, but the only time it hasn't been a case of Azeroth vs The Burning Legion was in Stormheim, but that was basically because Genn wanted to make Sylvanas pay for abandoning Varian during the initial attack and you happen to be helping her at the time.

[socialmaker]

WoD was definitely not Horde centric, Orc and Human? Yes.
MoP was definitely not Horde centric, Orc and Human? Yes.
Cata was definitely not Horde centric, Orc and Human? Yes.

What are you smoking ahahahhah all of them were horde oriented ESPECIALLY WOD =))))

[Honik]

I mean I haven't finished all the storylines in all the zones yet, but the only time it hasn't been a case of Azeroth vs The Burning Legion was in Stormheim, but that was basically because Genn wanted to make Sylvanas pay for abandoning Varian during the initial attack and you happen to be helping her at the time.

there isnt much burning legion influence while exping tho. Maybe in Azsuna with the demon hunters camp, as you said in stormheim , Valsharah is all about nightmare and Hull flashbacks + some fel tauren camps in Highmountain
Whole leveling is pretty much us chasing the pillars of creation

[ItachiZaku]

That's why you're welcome in Exodar and all that.

Well, After Velen attacks us to TRY and stop of from curb stomping his son, I went back to Exodar to kill Velen. I was very much not welcomed in there, but any hack class can stroll into The Ex and push that entire alien goat races shit in.

Every expansion is an alliance expansion, hell WoD is very much an alliance expansion, what do we do? We follow fuck boi human mage around the whole time with the mission of killing as many orcs as possible. fuck is that shit about?

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How is RAIDING Ogrimar Horde centric? if anything it's Alliance bias. I mean you guys got to raid and pillage our capital. To do this to Stormwind was basically Garrosh's wet dream

You won't convince them. Those faggots will say some shit about it was a joint effort to take down some crazyed god infused guy. Which is shit, cuz #TrueHorde, but it was clearly an alliance expansion as well, since... oh yeah, they killed every fucking name Orc not named Thrall, Varok or Eitrigg. When that wasn't enough, they had us go to another timeline to go and kill every goddamn legendary orc not named Broxigar. The ones we didn't, they made them out to be little bitches (Hi Orgrimm, sorry bruh). fuck I had blizz and their alliance bullshit.

[Irian]

Sometimes the story focuses on one faction or the other. Wrath was Alliance-focused, MoP was Horde-focused, WoD was Horde-focused, Cataclysm was Thrall-focused etc.

Yes, Legion is Alliance focused. And as a primarily Horde player, there's nothing wrong with that. It's a story, not an elementary school pizza party, everyone doesn't get equal treatment all the time.

Can these threads die already?

[Deleted]

there isnt much burning legion influence while exping tho. Maybe in Azsuna with the demon hunters camp, as you said in stormheim , Valsharah is all about nightmare and Hull flashbacks + some fel tauren camps in Highmountain
Whole leveling is pretty much us chasing the pillars of creation

Pretty much all of that is leading up to sealing the Tomb of Sargeras, which is currently what's making the Legion such a dire threat to begin with.

[Daevelian]

Well, After Velen attacks us to TRY and stop of from curb stomping his son, I went back to Exodar to kill Velen. I was very much not welcomed in there, but any hack class can stroll into The Ex and push that entire alien goat races shit in.

Every expansion is an alliance expansion, hell WoD is very much an alliance expansion, what do we do? We follow fuck boi human mage around the whole time with the mission of killing as many orcs as possible. fuck is that shit about?

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You won't convince them. Those faggots will say some shit about it was a joint effort to take down some crazyed god infused guy. Which is shit, cuz #TrueHorde, but it was clearly an alliance expansion as well, since... oh yeah, they killed every fucking name Orc not named Thrall, Varok or Eitrigg. When that wasn't enough, they had us go to another timeline to go and kill every goddamn legendary orc not named Broxigar. The ones we didn't, they made them out to be little bitches (Hi Orgrimm, sorry bruh). fuck I had blizz and their alliance bullshit.

You're welcome to pilot a robot cat in a westfall farm when the siege of stormwind kicks around brah. Hell, we will even let you tag along for the ride when we retake stormwind in our own little civil war!

Remember, SoO was and always will be a horde centric moment, the entire thing was essentially one giant horde civil war where the alliance tagged along for the ride because both factions needed to partake in the raid. If Varian didnt tell the horde to keep their shit together in the end cinematic, horde players would likely not even know the alliance was there at all.

Complain all you want, but that's the sad truth. SoO was a horde civil war story, not an alliance destroying an enemy capital city story.

[Snes]

Cata was definitely not Horde centric, Orc and Human? Yes.

Wow, you have a VERY selective memory.

[Deleted]

I feel like a Alliance slave this exp pack.
Making my Troll mage part of the mage order of Dalaran is the worst lore they could give my mage.
In RP they are my biggest enemies because of the past it stands for.

[Deleted]

Yeah it totally felt like an Alliance expansion when Sylvanas became the warchief or when half the Stormheim story focussed on Sylvanas trying to enslave the Val'kyr.

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I feel like a Alliance slave this exp pack.
Making my Troll mage part of the mage order of Dalaran is the worst lore they could give my mage.
In RP they are my biggest enemies because of the past it stands for.

Play a mage.
Don't like mage lore.