[Balance] Slip's Boomkin Theorycrafting (7.2.5+)

[Slippykins]

I don't think its as severe as you imply, since you barely gain secondary stats on ilvl gain for non-jewelry as is. It all goes into main stat / stam.

Here's the results I got for a 920 Jacin's set (which is about a 10-15 ilvl TF in Tomb):



Looks like it's still following the conventional "Jacin's is worth about 20ilvls per slot".

[joltcola1234]

I feel like Blizzard is going to nerf the 2pc/4pc thing anyway

[Slippykins]

I feel like Blizzard is going to nerf the 2pc/4pc thing anyway

That's the hopes anyway. My thread is still chugging along - https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20754357350#1

[Deleted]

you should be able to use ED(head) + 4p(chest,cloak,shoulders,pants) + Jacin's(gloves,boots), but it would still only but ED 2% ahead of 2p/4p looking at those sims.

[Slippykins]

you should be able to use ED(head) + 4p(chest,cloak,shoulders,pants) + Jacin's(gloves,boots), but it would still only but ED 2% ahead of 2p/4p looking at those sims.

Yeah just had someone on the druid discord PM me. I forgot about boots not being a tier slot for a second.

Updated the sim to account for 920 Jacin's with those legendary sets. Still following the typical rule of thumb we had for Jacin's during EN.

[Kluian05]

I feel like Blizzard is going to nerf the 2pc/4pc thing anyway

I don't think they will nerf the ability to equip multiple sets. The latest patch has already nerfed some of the strength of 2pc T19 for some specs, because of how strong it will synergize with T20. This appears the route they are taking, to just nerf T19 2 pc in some regard.

Personally I hope T19/T20 is a viable option because I hate the playstyle of ED, yet I feel forced to use it on ST fights. I raid lead and ED weaving requires too much focus (but perhaps since I'm relatively new to it). As some players have suggested I would much rather have it reduce SS cost by 10 statically.

[Polarthief]

I don't think they will nerf the ability to equip multiple sets. The latest patch has already nerfed some of the strength of 2pc T19 for some specs, because of how strong it will synergize with T20. This appears the route they are taking, to just nerf T19 2 pc in some regard.

Which is a horrible bandage fix, similar to when everyone thought they were nerfing Incarnation when Soul of the Archdruid was revealed because we'd be taking both SOTF and Inc.

[Kluian05]

Which is a horrible bandage fix, similar to when everyone thought they were nerfing Incarnation when Soul of the Archdruid was revealed because we'd be taking both SOTF and Inc.

Most druids probably won't even be using T19 because the bonus doesn't benefit T20, unless you get lucky with some insane titanforge procs. The INT gain from T20 WF/TF gear will probably outweigh the T19 2pc.

There are some classes though T19 2pc synergizes very well with T20 so there's a higher chance they will use it (I know frost mage for one). I don't see the big deal, in the end blizzard will balance outliers after the dust settles.

[Polarthief]

Most druids probably won't even be using T19 because the bonus doesn't benefit T20, unless you get lucky with some insane titanforge procs.

Not directly, but Starsurge is what procs Solar/Lunar Empowerments, and T19 2P does benefit that, so there is some indirect synergy there. There also should be a period where you use T19 4P and T20 2P, and a 15% damage buff on top of a 30% crit damage buff will definitely synergize for that time being, especially on a spell with innate +24% (or higher) crit chance from traits, that already hits decently hard, and is getting another 11% buff in 7.2.5. Should be fun times for ST builds until we get our T20 4P.

[Kluian05]

Not directly, but Starsurge is what procs Solar/Lunar Empowerments, and T19 2P does benefit that, so there is some indirect synergy there. There also should be a period where you use T19 4P and T20 2P, and a 15% damage buff on top of a 30% crit damage buff will definitely synergize for that time being, especially on a spell with innate +24% (or higher) crit chance from traits, that already hits decently hard, and is getting another 11% buff in 7.2.5. Should be fun times for ST builds until we get our T20 4P.

I would not call that synergy. T20 does not cause to you cast starsurge more, which is what you would need to increase the benefit of T19 2pc. But yes T19 4pc and T20 2pc synergize, but most people refer to the reverse in their concerns.

[Polarthief]

I would not call that synergy, but yes T19 4pc and T20 2pc synergize.

I... um... okay.

Hey Slip/Dogekin, enjoy the new maths with ED being 5 per stack but a 5s buff window

[Kluian05]

I... um... okay.

Did you even read what you wrote before coming back with a rude response?

"Not directly, but Starsurge is what procs Solar/Lunar Empowerments, and T19 2P does benefit that". I would not call THAT synergy, like you were implying. We are talking about the combination of T20 4pc and T19 2pc (has no synergy), not the combination of T19 4pc and T20 2pc (has synergy).

[Deleted]

The Emerald Dreamcatcher Starsurge reduces the Astral Power cost of your Starsurges by 7 for 3 5 for 5 sec. Stacks up to 2 times.

ED buff 7 -> 5 AsP 3 -> 5sec duration. Thoughts?

Rip haste breakpoint? Mastery overlords? SS -> SW -> LS until out of juice and then SW until 100 forever?

[Deleted]

The Emerald Dreamcatcher Starsurge reduces the Astral Power cost of your Starsurges by 7 for 3 5 for 5 sec. Stacks up to 2 times.

ED buff 7 -> 5 AsP 3 -> 5sec duration. Thoughts?

Rip haste breakpoint? Mastery overlords? SS -> SW -> LS until out of juice and then SW until 100 forever?

It's a nerf, not a buff (unless you didn't play it right). Basically they're just making completely sure nobody uses it ever again.

[Zan15]

It's a nerf, not a buff (unless you didn't play it right). Basically they're just making completely sure nobody uses it ever again.

i am kinda glad but it also shows they really don't have a direction for this spec and are just throwing out things and see if they stick.
why would they nerf the generation. it was not even OP when used perfectly ignoring all mechanics...etc etc.

/sigh

[Slippykins]

So the changes to ED were interesting. I used Jundarer's new APL and some overrides to whack in the new ED changes as well as the SS 11% buff, and here's the results:



Pretty much exactly the same list as what I posted earlier. Thus, the change looks to be almost DPS-neutral, but importantly the change is a massive QoL buff to ED. Now, you can refresh your DoTs, use OI procs and even move without the penalty of losing the ED buff. I think this is a great change and will make ED much less punishing in a raid environment with mechanics to deal with.

Double edit: If you take SD instead of NB, you only lose about 11k DPS for ED/OI. https://puu.sh/vSow3/dc018385dc.png

[Kluian05]

Yeah thanks for the info! I'm def happy they are moving for a QoL change. It was a very silly design to have to monkey with lag tolerence and hit high haste breakpoints for a legendary to be effective.

[Deleted]

There's no way it should be DPS neutral in simC, you only need to cast an average of 6 starsurges per ED buff for the new one to be a nerf. For reference, good players were averaging about 10. And that's not even taking into consideration that having the reduction loss during Incarnation being extra significant. It might be a minor nerf, but it should definately be a nerf, and you can't really compare pre/post nerf if you're using a different APL..

[Slippykins]

There's no way it should be DPS neutral in simC, you only need to cast an average of 6 starsurges per ED buff for the new one to be a nerf. For reference, good players were averaging about 10. And that's not even taking into consideration that having the reduction loss during Incarnation being extra significant. It might be a minor nerf, but it should definately be a nerf, and you can't really compare pre/post nerf if you're using a different APL..

The new APL takes into account the extended duration.

And I'm just reporting the results with the changes. I agree it could be spurious as these are only quick sims done before I left for uni, but I don't think there's much to leave out.

[Deleted]

The new APL takes into account the extended duration.

And I'm just reporting the results with the changes. I agree it could be spurious as these are only quick sims done before I left for uni, but I don't think there's much to leave out.

Shouldn't the old APL work just fine though? Most of the conditions are just based on duration remaining from what I remember, I could be wrong though. Anyway, doesn't really matter much, not much reason to use ED anyway