Ghostcrawler - "I’m a big fan of exclusive, prestige rewards for the best players."

[Sansnom]

Feel free to disagree.

I personally don't think that catering to baddies is good game design

Feel free to prove people wrong. Submit your game design proposal on how a game should be .

and that rewards should be earned, not given.

That is your blind hatred clouding your vision. All rewards are earned. Some maybe easier than others.

[G3istly]

Wait, you are one of the people who care about achievements?

Aside from the fact that I never said that I wasn't also a baddie, I have plenty of achievements that are/were relevant.

It's also pretty pathetic to bash someone's profile but not link your own, but hey, that might just be me.

You sure got awfully defensive the moment I pointed out your hypocrisy--I love it.

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Honestly I think the removal of Challenge Mode was retarded since you couldn't out-gear it anyway and missed an opportunity for something people can do for fun anytime

Adding to that, they're taking old dungeons and raids and giving us a "Timewalking" variant but apparently, Challenge Modes are somehow beyond that? It would be slightly less annoying if Blizzard were at least consistent with their nonsense.

[Crusch]

You sure got awfully defensive the moment I pointed out your hypocrisy--I love it.

Still bashing people's armory while not linking your own, you are pathetic buddy :3

Please point out the hypocrisy in any raid kill I did in Legion or most of the mythic kills in WoD.

[Daffan]

Of course it's a good thing, in moderation.

Motivation, aspiration and it feels rewarding when you finally get there.

So much welfare makes things boring and have no sense of accomplishment. Everything is handed to you as a casual (I am one now) that there is no sense of achievement. Only if you pick up a Mythic raid schedule.

Honestly I think the removal of Challenge Mode was retarded since you couldn't out-gear it anyway and missed an opportunity for something people can do for fun anytime

Lmao... talents and abilities change my friend.

[Hellrime]

In the latest post by Ghostcrawler, he says that he is a big fan exclusive, prestige rewards for the best players.

He also mentions that there should be content for all types of players, however he is in favor of time-limited and rewards that people aspire to, but are never able to obtain.

I think the reason he feels this way is because having aspirations in the game make players better. It also gives players goals to go try to achieve.

Back in TBC, I aspired to be a raider and clear BT and Sunwell because of the fact that it was prestigious. It was cool because I liked that other players saw my gear and wanted to become like me and try to obtain the gear that I had. It felt good because the gear was unique and if a player had T6 gear, it meant they were good players.

Now that gear is so diluted, especially since the same look is obtainable in different difficulties, just with different color variations, it loses some of its umph and prestige. Blizzard is known for being wishy washy on their stance, but one stance that I really wish they would go back to is the WoD model of gear, where the tier gear looked different from the tourist gear.

Do you agree with Ghostcrawler?

I couldn't agree more, the laziness of the player base is directly tied to how easy the content is to achieve. The second one aspect of the game requires you to be just slightly above average majority of the community complains in droves. It is all part of the "Everyone gets a trophy" world we currently live in. The best guilds in the world aren't racing to server firsts any more because it really doesn't matter, sooner or later Blizzard just makes sure the guy who only has two buttons mapped is able to clear Mythic content. The fact that guilds can gimp themselves even a little to be able to sell Mythic Guldan kills speaks to this.

Gear used to be a badge of achievement, something that inspired or filled players who weren't there yet with awe! I remember being somewhat of a noob in Wrath of the Lich King, I played TBC but didn't raid. When I first saw a player decked out in the full Nax Death Knight set, I immediately took to the forums and sites to actually learn how to play, I wanted that so I learned to raid, I learned about min-maxing, dot uptimes, rotations/priorities, gems, food, enchants, I set out to be the best player I possibly could be. Come to now, someone who can't even survive past a ground AoE is in the same gear as everyone else. The individual player skill no longer improves which imo is what is killing the game currently, not that Johnny Dies Every Guldan phase isn't get his artifact appearance.

[Dug]

Top players never stopped receiving exclusive rewards. They get the best mounts, best gear (with most unique models) and best titles.

[Deleted]

But giving ppl goldmedals for participation aint?

With that said, having exclusive 1% stuff and removing it should not be a thing nowdays. Those days are gone.
But having exclusive rewards that is current is fine.

I am not against 1% drops and limited achievements but I am against removing mounts, weapons and content for the sake of a tiny % of precious egos. I also think said people put too much stock in said rewards, I don't believe many care if random joe has that realm first or mount

[netherflame]

Mounts, achievements, VASTLY different appearances on Tier in Mythic. The top players have exclusive rewards.

LFR has different appearances from Normal, Heroic, and Mythic, the difference with mythic gear is color and something that floats which really doesn't matter especially in a world where people are tmogging things and not even using those mythic set skins as it is.

[Sencha]

A game without exclusive rewards to the top 1% is a dying game as all competitive players will move to another game. Look at subs.

[Lady Dragonheart]

Still bashing people's armory while not linking your own, you are pathetic buddy :3

Please point out the hypocrisy in any raid kill I did in Legion or most of the mythic kills in WoD.

I wouldn't call it bashing, as he makes a standing point. You, yourself, haven't completed the majority of the game when it was relevant. This means that you are for pruning your own account, ability to play, and access to the game for people that don't care about you, at all. It's bootlicking at best and masochistic at worst.

[Lochton]

If you have a linked source, I'll be happy.

IF he said that, then I agree as well.

[Queen of Hamsters]

"I think the reason he feels this way is because having aspirations in the game make players better. It also gives players goals to go try to achieve."

Common logical fallacy right there. The vast majority of the players never "aspire" to shit, no matter how exclusive and prestigeous the rewards. Takes a special kind of mental gymnastics to look at the game as it's been for its entire life and say "Lol hard content makes players aspire to beat hard content!!"...

Hard content makes a minority strive to beat it, and that's fine. Focus should be on making sure that the vast majority always has a reason for playing though, lest the game shall die.

[Crusch]

I wouldn't call it bashing, as he makes a standing point. You, yourself, haven't completed the majority of the game when it was relevant. This means that you are for pruning your own account, ability to play, and access to the game for people that don't care about you, at all. It's bootlicking at best and masochistic at worst.

As I said in the post you quoted, please point out which of my Legion kills weren't relevant or hypocrisy.

I killed Gul'Dan Heroic on 1/23/2017, this is the week he was released.
I killed Xavius Mythic on 11/20/2016
I killed the first 3 mythic bosses of Nighthold in the first week they released.

Guess that content was irrelevant as I only did it in the first week, not on the first day.

[Kazuchika]

people listen to him because when he ran things wow was actually good. or do you prefer rng lottery gearing, rng legendaires and artifact power?

>cata
>good

You almost had me there mate.

[Eats Compost]

It surprises me that so many people have a violently negative reaction to prestige rewards. It's not uncommon at all, across most genres. Even many single-player games have similar concepts, with high-difficulty challenges providing rewards that may be unavailable elsewhere. And when you're looking at competitive multiplayer games, virtually all of them have some kind of way to signal what you've accomplished, readily and visibly.

I mean, people do realize that he's talking about things like icons, skins, titles and stuff like that, right? He's not talking about something like (in the WoW context) gating off whole raids, and he's pretty clear about how anything that's just plain fun should be broadly available.

Overwatch and HotS both have prestige systems like this, too. WoW has some of it, but it also struggles to do it effectively because virtually all content is on a timer towards becoming redundant/easy.

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Limited time awards are a bit extreme. I'm not opposed to the "realm first kill titles" for example, but other than that, keep all rewards attainable. Achievements are marked with a date, I still judge a player on whether he got his TBC achievements the day of achievements release or later.

Achievement dates have a visibility issue. You might go in and look at them, but I can't even remember the last time I looked at someone else's achievements in ANY game, let alone WoW.

If WoW prestige were a badge, a cosmetic reward is a badge you're wearing in your shirt, and an achievement timestamp is a badge in your pocket. They might both prove the same thing, but one of them is only going to be seen if they're actively looking/asking for it.

[Gimlix]

Bullshit. If you get a raid set, you get the stats with it. People who get lower itemlevel items that use the same appearance don't get the same high stats. So good players are still rewarded. Good players have always had better rewards. Giving casual players only shitty looking sets is a terrible idea. Way to make us feel indifferent to new sets when we won't get them anyway. It's a big fuck you to player's faces. "Fuck off and transmog something old you scrub"

Ow hell no. The "Better players get better items" is long but gone. Everyone gets almost the same thing. Heck just a different item color set and a bit higher stats. "wooptiedoe" Nobody cares.
There should be stuff that is limitted time, giving people a reason to do it. This should be with gear, Mounts, Titles etc.
Blizzard is making WoW so casual, that even your grandma can get the best rewards, just by no lifing it.

WoW is not in a good position when it comes to rewarding better players. has been for a bit now.

[Eats Compost]

WoW is not in a good position when it comes to rewarding better players. has been for a bit now.

Unfortunately, that's just a reflection of what 99% of the game is. Virtually all content outside of organized raiding involves the most basic level of combat competence, coupled with time investment & simply showing up. That's what world quests are, that's what professions are, that's what story quests are, and that's what all queued content is. You could even lump normal-mode raiding and +0 mythics in there.

Personally, I think the whole thing is a reflection of how outmoded MMOs are these days. This kind of thing used to fly, because it was new/novel and it was the best stuff out there. Now? Not so much.

[Glorious Leader]

"I think the reason he feels this way is because having aspirations in the game make players better. It also gives players goals to go try to achieve."

Common logical fallacy right there. The vast majority of the players never "aspire" to shit, no matter how exclusive and prestigeous the rewards. Takes a special kind of mental gymnastics to look at the game as it's been for its entire life and say "Lol hard content makes players aspire to beat hard content!!"...

Hard content makes a minority strive to beat it, and that's fine. Focus should be on making sure that the vast majority always has a reason for playing though, lest the game shall die.

Furthermore i would submit that the minority of people who participate in hard content dont give a shit about the reward for the most part.

[Gimlix]

Unfortunately, that's just a reflection of what 99% of the game is. Virtually all content outside of organized raiding involves the most basic level of combat competence, coupled with time investment & simply showing up. That's what world quests are, that's what professions are, that's what story quests are, and that's what all queued content is. You could even lump normal-mode raiding and +0 mythics in there.

Personally, I think the whole thing is a reflection of how outmoded MMOs are these days. This kind of thing used to fly, because it was new/novel and it was the best stuff out there. Now? Not so much.

I just want a MMORPG where gear actually matters, where if you get some sort of items, people will actually be jealous. That feeling is long but gone. Nobody cares if u got mythic gear. Like nobody.

Same goes for leveling, i rather level and get gear along way, to become stronger. Then reach end game and everyone have around same gear. Plane boring :/

[Whitedragon]

Do you know him that well that you know he hasn't played WoW for years? :O

To be fair the post by GC a few days ago pertaining to rogues made it sound like he hasn't played for some time... or at least he hasn't played a rogue...