How Did the Navy Get Space - and not the Air Force

[cubby]

Space Marines is just a byproduct of Warhammer 40k giving Space to the Navy instead of another branch.

Lol, it's not - but that is awesome. Space Marines are typical of what you see in syfi stories. @Sydanyo hit the nail on the head, as did many others. His post, btw, isn't irrelevant - it's just what you were discussing.

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Ships in the navy, ships in space. You make landfall with a ship, you make planetfall with a space ship. You have marines in the navy, and you need space marines in space. Ships at sea navigate by relying on the stars, ships in space navigate through the stars.

Also, you fly in atmosphere. You do not fly in space.

Very solid point - we won't be anywhere near the point of planetfall or full on ships for probably a 100 years - at least in the way I was thinking. Obviously we'll have ships before then.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

No. You're saying that space marines are "just a byproduct" of WH40K and so on. However, since the realm of space obviously should be under the navy, logically there would obviously have been space marines, whether WH40K existed, or not. Hence, your comment I replied to, was wrong.

They are just a byproduct of W40k giving Space to the Navy. If Warhammer had giving space to the Air Force...Space Marines would be called something else.

Again, I'm not arguing that Space should go to the Air Force or the Army...just that the fact that there is a force called "space marines" is not a reason why Space should be giving to the Navy...it is an example of Space being given to the Navy.

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Lol, it's not - but that is awesome. Space Marines are typical of what you see in syfi stories. @Sydanyo hit the nail on the head, as did many others. His post, btw, isn't irrelevant - it's just what you were discussing.
.

My Post was about how Space Marines are an example of The Navy in Space...not the Reason why the Navy has Space.

[Deleted]

They are just a byproduct of W40k giving Space to the Navy. If Warhammer had giving space to the Air Force...Space Marines would be called something else.

Well, no. See, in the real world, not in WH40K world, there will be space marines. There will be space marines, because out of all the military branches, the navy is the logical choice to have governing space warfare. There would have always been space marines, whether WH40K existed or not, or whether WH40K "gave space" to fucking bakers. WH40K is irrelevant.

Also, WH40K came out in 1987. Aliens came out in 1986. Aliens had what? That's right. Motherfucking space marines. We're done here.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Also, WH40K came out in 1987. Aliens came out in 1986. Aliens had what? That's right. Motherfucking space marines. We're done here.

Yes but the image provided with "Because Space Marines" was this:


Does that look like a Motherfucking Space Marine from Motherfucking Aliens to you?

My point was that "because Space Marines" is not the reason the Navy has Space...it is just an example of the Navy having Space. I was not ever suggesting that the Navy isn't the best fit for Space. Space was given to the Navy long before the term "Space Marine" was used in any genre. Star Trek was using the Navy in space 20 years before "Aliens",

[Bryntrollian]

Yes but the image provided with "Because Space Marines" was this:
Does that look like a Motherfucking Space Marine from Motherfucking Aliens to you?

I was with you at first but now you've gone too far.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

I was with you at first but now you've gone too far.

How exactly have I "gone too far"?

[procne]

The only thing that comes to my mind is the link to colonialism.
While technically spaceships are more similar to aircrafts than ships there is still some resemblance to the ships in colonial era. As in ships were the vehicles on which we discovered new lands and colonized them. Planes came when we already had discovered most of the Earth - they just allowed us to get to places faster. But spaceships, much like ships in the era of discovery, allow us to reach out further, outside known lands - outside our planet.

edit: And when space travel travel is mentioned in sci-fi, it comes with the tint of colonialism - new planets discovered and colonised

[shadofall]

airforce is to busy with the stargate and their secret space ships to deal with other scifi :P

[procne]

Ships in the navy, ships in space. You make landfall with a ship, you make planetfall with a space ship. You have marines in the navy, and you need space marines in space. Ships at sea navigate by relying on the stars, ships in space navigate through the stars.

I don't buy it, that's no reason why space travel is associated with the navy. As Sicari said, it's the outcome of space travel being associated with navy. It's associated with navy SO (and not "because") the space vessels are called spaceships, and their crews - spacemarines. And together with this come all the terminology you mentioned.

Also, you fly in atmosphere. You do not fly in space.

When people talk about reaching Moon or Mars, do they talk about sailing there or flying there? Did Apollo 11 fly or sail to the Moon? Do we have spaceflight or spacesailing? You sail/swim on the surface of something, you fly through something (be it air or vacuum), and the implicit meaning is that you don't need water / land as support.

[Machismo]

Think of it this way, the large ships would be the Navy, as the main focus of the expeditionary force. That's one of their main functions in our military. Basically, it's their job to move people and shit around.

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Because large space ships have a lot more in common with ocean going ships than atmospheric planes, the "fighters" in space are often flying from said larger spaceship (aka aircraft carrier), and the deployment of troops from spaceships onto a planetoid is more akin to the marines hitting the beach from amphibs.

Plus, the Navy is just better than the Air Farce in every aspect!

Not in living quarters and air conditioning they aren't.

[Hammerfest]

How Did the Navy Get Space - and not the Air Force?

Early Starfleet, as depicted on the Star Trek: Enterprise episode "First Flight," started out as more of a NASA/Air Force service, but as it grew it became more like a Navy.

(But, if it makes you feel better, neither the Navy or the Air Force "got space.")

[Kellhound]

Think of it this way, the large ships would be the Navy, as the main focus of the expeditionary force. That's one of their main functions in our military. Basically, it's their job to move people and shit around.

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Not in living quarters and air conditioning they aren't.

I have seen USAF living conditions in Iraq and Afghanistan, I will take my A/C, hot meals, etc over that!