The True Nature of Elune

[huth]

Don't forget Astral power. Balance somehow encompasses the entirety of celestial bodies for reasons unknown, and it was a deliberate shift compared to what we had before. Keep in mind that the Scythe also contains one of Goldrinn's fangs, though.

Assuming and knowing are two different things. I understand why is it assumed so, but the question was how do we know. It turns out we do not, we only assume. Which is absolutely alright, it's just that you should not present this assumption as a fact.

Still, until Blizzard makes a statement on the topic, the stance that they're like "real" suns holds more weight than that they're something else. It is notable that the sun and "regular" light(e.g. lasers) is generally associated with Nature or Fire spell schools, while the Light is always Holy, though, so Blizzard does appear to differentiate between the two.

[Atelniar]

This is an interesting topic, here is why:

1. A lot of people seem to automatically assume that Elune would be a Titan/Eonar (for some reason the elves would associate her with the moon)... The latter makes no sense. Eonar has little to nothing to do with the moon, and it also seems that most Wild Gods might know of her, but none of them bothered to correct the elves? A bit odd, isn't it? Nor is there any mention of any titan named Elune. A nod to this theory was made with the ruins that depicted Elune amidst the titans on ancient night elf temples, during the ordering.

2. She has been speculated to be a Naaru, mostly because of her connection to the moon (and by extension moonlight, which to some obviously refers to light and by that logic; The Light). The flaws here are many, this theory is mostly based of an in-joke that the name Elune would fit well as a misspelling of: E'lune. The only evidence we have on the matter is that she might actually have created the Naaru. And this somehow was found in a book Khadgar found in his library. Knowledge of the Naaru before the arrival of the draenei was not documented, to my knowledge. OOC'ly this is obviously explained by fractioned lore and retcons, IC'ly this can be easily explained by the fact that the term "Naaru" and the idea of Elune creating such a thing was speculation at best, without evidence. Was it an old tome or recent speculation? I don't think much explanation was done, tbh. But it is evidence that OOC'ly Elune is considered important enought to be vaguely hinted as a being above the Naaru. A sort of confirmation that she is something else. And an excuse to use her as plot point with Xe'ra.

3. Some believe her to be an ascended loa. There is no evidence of that, the assumption is based on a simple thing; she is commonly known in part as the Night Warrior. Which someone assumed made her being supposedly related to some distant female empress of the ancient trolls who ascended the realms of common loa. The only clue that has been given to this "fan theory" is grey gear that contained item description, which hinted to that ancient night elf garbs depicted Elune along with what seemed like loa.

My conclusion: Elune is neither a loa, a naaru or a titan. She is too different from them. She is too caring to be a titan obsessed with order and the birth of Azeroth. Her concern seems to be with the mortal races of Azeroth. Life itself. Be it a dragon aspect, or her avatar Tyrande. Tyrande also is evidence that she is not a naaru. Differently from the naaru, she accepts worship in her name, and anoint a Priestess every other generation as her avatar amidst the night elves. No naaru has done this, as we know of. Be it Xe'ra or any other. As for her being a loa? I find it unlikely, there is no evidence to prove that she is one, except the grey trash items which simply depicted Elune and the loa.

Does Elune wield the light, arcane or druidic magic? She seems to emphasize more than one form of magic, that aren't considered corrupt. Vanilla players probably remember that night elf priests received a spell with offensive capabilities called Starshards, I think it was called that. This was noted in the spell description as an arcane based spell. Which obviously refers to night elf priests and by extension the worship of Elune to have some connection to not only light magic, but also arcane. A blend or mastery of both in Elune's case, as her light differs a lot from the kind of representation we commonly see with "The Light" as in the Church of the Holy Light, which humans worship. It's a blend of silver shades, blue and pure white colour. Which is very different from the naaru as well.

A thing that was noted in this thread and in the past was that Elune might be a reference to Illuvatar in LotR. The creator of Arda and Middle-Earth, by extension. And I can see Elune as the one remaining lore-deity that might fulfill such a role. She is neutral enough, but she differ greatly in that she does intervene indirectly. Frequently. Either through Tyrande, in the voice heard in the old quest in Winterspring or by making Ysera into constellation of stars. A feat which no titan has shown capable of. We know that she is mentioned in accordance with the loa, with the titans and the naaru? Surely this is evidence enough to suggest that Elune might be not just a light lord, but a true deity. The creator of all? Why do I suggest this? Because of Aman'thul. We know, from Chronicles, that Aman'thul helped nurture the other titans, and formed the Pantheon to nurture other titans. But who nurtured him? Elune has been speculated to have a hand in titan affairs, as evident by the murals that depict her amidst other "gods" during the creation of Azeroth (our world). And by the Tear of Elune, an artifact which is beleived to be of titan origin.

Elune is the last remaining mystery in WoW. And a good one, thus far. She has been hinted to in ways that mislead people to assume she might be a titan, a naaru, or a loa. But in reality, she has been referenced almost everywhere. Where titans are not mentioned, she has been; naaru.

Now, most people assume her to be either a) a titan or Eonar, b) a light lord. There are some who still thinks she is c) what she was originally. And has been referenced as, to begin with; a true deity. A goddess. But, a light lord whose colour palette references the moon and with tidbits of arcane relations, that sounds a bit strange. She used to be a part of lore that was largely mentioned but viewed as less important than The Light, titans and even the naaru upon their introduction. Now Elune is the center of attention in lore. She is the last mystery in Warcraft. And she is probably going to be a big part of the lore going onwards, if Legion is to be judged from; flavour text depicting her on grey items with loa. The cut-scene of Val'sharah. One of the more memorable cut-scenes in the last few years. With a lot of attention to facial expressions on the elves (there is no mistake, it is considered to be Elune's presence by them, that was an expression of awe). The artifact known as the Tear of Elune (a tear, not an eye, aegis, etc). That symbolises something. Tears are true symbols and physical manifistations of joy and sorrow, equally. This symbols duality, good and bad. But a teardrop can also be a symbol of water or life. The symbolism chosen for the artificat in itself is very different from what represents the other titans.

[sabrek]

I really dont understand...

Why you guys walking in a circle? Its very clear what Elune is

No one here understands the God that mentioned in christianity islam and judasm?

Elune is simply represents the 1 true God who made the Universe.

[huth]

I really dont understand...

Why you guys walking in a circle? Its very clear what Elune is

No one here understands the God that mentioned in christianity islam and judasm?

Elune is simply represents the 1 true God who made the Universe.

There is no Creator entity. The Multiverse was created by a clash of the primal forces of Light and Void, not through any deliberate effort.

If you compare Abrahamic religions to Elune worship, you'll probably find more differences than commonalities, too.

[Extrakt]

Seems to me that E'lune is a light based Titan, wouldn't be so suprising to me as there is a life based titan and time based titan aswell.
Same as The Pantheon created The Titankeepers, so she created the Naaru.

[Wildmoon]

But we are not told they are giant balls of fire and plasma either?

Have you read the other sentences aside from the first? Also, you can't prove a negative.

[Raetary]

I really dont understand...

Why you guys walking in a circle? Its very clear what Elune is

No one here understands the God that mentioned in christianity islam and judasm?

Elune is simply represents the 1 true God who made the Universe.

we know how the universe got created, there is no creator.
it was the clash between 2 cosmic forces.

now put your stupid religion shit away.

[Wildmoon]

It's flat out said that tauren and priests get their power from the sun. Have a look at http://wow.gamepedia.com/Tahu_Sagewind. Scroll down to the quotes section and have a look at his conversation with Aponi Brightmane. In case those names are not familiar to you, Tahu is the leader of the tauren priests, Aponi the tauren paladins. They flat out talk about the night elves downplaying the sun in their druidic rituals, and wonder if the tauren simply copying what the elves do isn't getting the complete picture. Stating that their people strive for balance, he wonders if there's some way to tap into the power of the sun as druids do with the moon.

PS: I find it very, very rude to dismiss someone else's interpretation of concepts that have not been concretely explained by Blizzard as headcanon.

It's stated and cited that his belief in the importance of the sun led him to be able to channel the light and he became a priest. Priests and Paladins use the light. Druids already use the power of the sun. The culture of the night elves just does not emphasize the religious and symbolic meanings of the sun.

Tahu's philosophy also comes from an unproved premise that the cosmological parts of the religion of his people are actually true. He wants to emphasize the sun more because the night elf put less emphasis on it based on their religion. This presumes that the sun and the moon hold equal importance as the representatives of the actual dieties that exist. His philosophy led him not to emphasize the energy of the sun as a natural phenomenon more but away from it entirely to the light while still believing in the sun.

We also have seen from the nightborne that the power of the celestial bodies are very much there to be drawn by technical practices not faith-based practices. This coincides with the tradition of druidism as mainsteamed Malfurion who admited that his faith in Elune was mediocre at best. This separates druidism from the priestess order. It also separates the light from the sun-based energy.

[Deleted]

It's flat out said that tauren and priests get their power from the sun. Have a look at http://wow.gamepedia.com/Tahu_Sagewind. Scroll down to the quotes section and have a look at his conversation with Aponi Brightmane. In case those names are not familiar to you, Tahu is the leader of the tauren priests, Aponi the tauren paladins. They flat out talk about the night elves downplaying the sun in their druidic rituals, and wonder if the tauren simply copying what the elves do isn't getting the complete picture. Stating that their people strive for balance, he wonders if there's some way to tap into the power of the sun as druids do with the moon.

PS: I find it very, very rude to dismiss someone else's interpretation of concepts that have not been concretely explained by Blizzard as headcanon.

The Night Elves also believe that Elune is their goddess and creator and yet the true is other (dark trolls mutated by the Well and teached by Elune titan knowledge).

In-game believes are not words of god.

[WhiteEagle888]

Access to the Light is dependent on faithfulness and conviction. The Night Elves somehow get it despite believing in the Moon. The Trolls get it despite not believing in any lightsource whatsoever. The Humans don't even believe in any entities, but in a concept. The Tauren draw their powers not from the sun, but from their belief in the sun. As long as you believe your cause is just strongly enough, the Light will grant you it's powers. It has no morality, no guiding influence.

You're the obtuse one, constantly trying to force your headcanon on everybody while not understanding what the Light even is and what it is not.
The only ones that actually use the power of the sun are the Druids. Which mostly manifests in lobbing miniature suns at their enemies.

To simply have conviction is not enough. You actually need to invoke said entity or force to give you the power. moon for night elves, sun for tauren, loa for trolls and so on.
Troll priests in particular doesn't focus on the Light. It's just for gameplay reason every race uses a unified class system and abilities. Seriously you didn't even know this?

Hopefully that changes as well in the future and class fantasy gets mixed with race fantasy in the next xpack so we can have racial class abilities like the ones present in vanilla.
Every priest draws from a source be it direct or indirect - the Light works through that entity or force - be it inside or outside source.

- - - Updated - - -

It's getting tedious replying to you, so not going to reply to what you said. You constant unwillingness to see the Sun has no such a little part is beyond something I want to entertain longer. Your headcanon is not something in game and though it's interpretation - that all it actually is compared to others that give evidence with Blizzard canon.
Considering the topic in hand is Elune you talk about the Sun. That's not Elune. If the Sun God was so apparent, why aren't you calling it by name? Fact is, it isn't there. Return to talking about Elune.

Stuck in the past as always I see.
I told you 3 times already that the sun god isn't introduced yet and you ask why I don't call him by name still? /facepalm
you couldn't answer why Elune is named after the moon in titanic and not something else which encompasses both moon and the stars either so I suppose it was not worth my time to expect any more either.
Just because you don't see it/ fail to make the logical conclusions thereof doesn't mean the sun as an entity doesn't exist.
My are exactly these logical conclusions from Chronicles and you couldn't even muster one excuse as to why it couldn't be true. Bravo

[Deleted]

we know how the universe got created, there is no creator.
it was the clash between 2 cosmic forces.

now put your stupid religion shit away.

Calm the ---- down with your anti-religion thoughts.

[Aquamonkey]

To simply have conviction is not enough. You actually need to invoke said entity or force to give you the power. moon for night elves, sun for tauren, loa for trolls and so on.
Troll priests in particular doesn't focus on the Light. It's just for gameplay reason every race uses a unified class system and abilities. Seriously you didn't even know this?

Hopefully that changes as well in the future and class fantasy gets mixed with race fantasy in the next xpack so we can have racial class abilities like the ones present in vanilla.
Every priest draws from a source be it direct or indirect - the Light works through that entity or force - be it inside or outside source

Without spoiling too much, we can tell you that wielding the Light is a matter of having willpower or faith in one's own ability to do it. That's why there are evil paladins (for example, the Scarlet Crusade and Arthas before he took up Frostmourne). (AskCDev)

Temple Guardian Anhuur

In the final days of the Halls of Origination's use by titanic forces, Temple Guardian Anhuur was endowed with the willpower needed to wield the Light. Thus empowered, he was charged with judging the purity of those who enter the facility. (Source)

is holy of prists and paladin is same energy?'/megics?
Both priests and paladins can wield the Holy Light. However, not all wield it through the same means (e.g., Elune, An'she) (Loreology)
So the end product (Holy Light spells, etc) is the same, just the philosophy that masters it different?
I think for game-related reasons, yes. Examples that come to mind are night elf priests and tauren paladins. (Loreology)

[Evaddon]

Think we are going to get alot of answers for this in Chronicles Volume.3

While it would make sense for her to be our World Soul, I'm kind of thinking she might not be maybe she is like the opposite of what the Void Lords are? The thing that created the Naaru's maybe. A Light Lord lmao.
And she is able to create things in our Universe just as the Void Lords can so she has Naarus, and something that is on our moons to help watch over Azeroths sleeping Titan

[Evangeliste]

Without spoiling too much, we can tell you that wielding the Light is a matter of having willpower or faith in one's own ability to do it. That's why there are evil paladins (for example, the Scarlet Crusade and Arthas before he took up Frostmourne). (AskCDev)

Temple Guardian Anhuur

In the final days of the Halls of Origination's use by titanic forces, Temple Guardian Anhuur was endowed with the willpower needed to wield the Light. Thus empowered, he was charged with judging the purity of those who enter the facility. (Source)

is holy of prists and paladin is same energy?'/megics?
Both priests and paladins can wield the Holy Light. However, not all wield it through the same means (e.g., Elune, An'she) (Loreology)
So the end product (Holy Light spells, etc) is the same, just the philosophy that masters it different?
I think for game-related reasons, yes. Examples that come to mind are night elf priests and tauren paladins. (Loreology)

Thank you. Though I don't think it will convince them.

[Shampro]

At this point it's kinda obvious that she's heading into being the Light equivalent of the Void Lords.

[Aquamonkey]

Thank you. Though I don't think it will convince them.

No power in the verse can stop headcanon.

[huth]

No power in the verse can stop headcanon.

Especially if it is wielded by an ignoramus who refuses to even consider that he might be wrong.

[Evangeliste]

Stuck in the past as always I see.
I told you 3 times already that the sun god isn't introduced yet and you ask why I don't call him by name still? /facepalm
you couldn't answer why Elune is named after the moon in titanic and not something else which encompasses both moon and the stars either so I suppose it was not worth my time to expect any more either.
Just because you don't see it/ fail to make the logical conclusions thereof doesn't mean the sun as an entity doesn't exist.
My are exactly these logical conclusions from Chronicles and you couldn't even muster one excuse as to why it couldn't be true. Bravo

What's facepalm is over 15 years the Sun being ever present have nothing further than a minor role. It's not in the past, even the Chronicles which is the bible of the franchise now makes little effort to exert an existence past a celestial body and not a figurative cosmic being like... the Titans, Naaru, the Old Gods, the Void Lords, the Ancients and more.
I can name Elune and see her sway in the game and even back as the RTS. What cannot be named is your Sun God whom, doesn't exist past a celestial body in outer space as the Sun - a star and a lump of matter. This is the fantasy genre, the entity as a cosmic being like aforementioned personnel won't exist unless it needs to and made to do so. You know like you were saying with daylight? It doesn't need to be explained if it's like real-life so therefore without explanation given with a Sun God, it is just a star. Nothing more. Just because the lack of it's presence now and saying "because it's in the future" doesn't make it canon either. You don't craft the canon, Blizzard does. Unless you're Jaylock who works for the PR Marketing of Blizzard as they said.

The canon I comment on is stuff within the realms of Blizzard at least and is referable to several live sources. Though I theorise and make hypotheses on subject matter, it least already exists in the universe by connecting dot A to B because dot A and B actually exist within the extensiveness of the universe from the the game, books and more. And all are canon. Made by Blizzard and published.

Elune isn't named AFTER the moon, she IS the moon. That cinematic in Val'sharah is actually her. It's been pretty much stated by myself and others. It's why she is also known as the Moon Goddess. You even said you self "encompass the moon and stars"... last time I checked your Sun was a star too. The sun exists as a ball of matter, but not as a cosmic being like a Titan, Old God, Void Lords, Naaru, Ancient and so on you are trying to pass as headcanon. Doesn't matter if "it's in the future". If it was that relevant, that important to be worshipped and followed, with a mind of it's own and a physical being beyond a celestial lump of matter, there be more power in it as an actual physical entity that holds power and exerts it which undoubtedly would actually effect things physically like Elune did then it would be in the past too and as far back as the RTS along with the Titans, Demons, Azeroth and more. All it is is a lump of matter and an ideological scheme for races within the universe.
The Void Lords are enigmatic but they exist because Old Gods are their pawns, it exists because Sargeras is scared of it. It exists because it is in the Chronicles. They exist and have been named.

What is you're going on about muster from the Chronicles? Have you read them at all? Or looked at the RTS's?

Like I said, let's discuss Elune herself. Not your apparent headcanon Sun God.

[Aucald]

I've always viewed the Light as the energy that emanates from the understanding that all things are unified or part of a whole - understanding that aspect coupled with the will needed to connect oneself to the greater whole and draw power from said metaphysical unity. This is why it requires both willpower and a certain doctrine of faith or beliefs - whether it is the foundation of the Church of the Light, the teachings of the Sunwalkers (who seek to reconcile Sun and Moon with the rest of creation), whatever it is the Troll users of the Light believe, and so forth. Beings who value the Self over the All, or who feel divided from the All, are ill-equipped or entirely unable to tap into the luminous energies of the Light. This goes for most entities that are aligned with evil (e.g. self-promoting or seeking fulfillment through the ego) and those who doubt themselves or have been diminished (such as the Broken) by external circumstances. You can still be evil and value the All over the Self, however; if your conception of the All has been suitably twisted - like the Scarlet Crusade's Paladins and Priests.

[Raetary]

No power in the verse can stop headcanon.

we should add it to the cosmic chart.

right under disorder.