Titanforged and a casual

[Mirishka]

You cant do good mythic dps without Bis legendarys and titanforges which are RNG. If you dont want to be bis then this game isnt for you and you should quit asap.
Try to prove your BS to mythic semi/hardcore guilds.

Your posted started out sensibly, then veered off the path right into eyerolling levels of stupid.

I know that people like you can't stand the idea of 'casuals' playing your game, but here's the thing: it isn't your game. It's Blizzard's. And people don't have to measure up to dumbass standards like yours to play it.

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I don't get fucked by Titanforged RNG though. Since anytime my gear Titanforges, it is an upgrade and I give Zero shits about what gear other people have in the same game. Mostly because I'm not a little bitch.

Brilliant post, and I couldn't agree with it more. I'm honestly staggered by the amount of people who flail and bitch over gear in video games. Its like they forget this shit isn't real sometimes.

As far as TF goes its great when it happens, but I don't dwell on it when it doesn't. Skill goes further toward dps than the same trinket, 10-15 ilevels higher.

[Vichan]

it's fine for the majority of the playerbase, it's only a very small part of the community(a much smaller portion than most of them are even willing to admit)

[NatePsy]

I think it should cap out at atleast 905-910. It's a bit ridiculous to see RF gear forged to 920+ It's more for consistency than anything, that high an item level on gear in the lowest difficulty is a bit crazy. To get items forged 10 ilvls shy of Mythic from the lowest form of difficulty of that particular raid instance is a bit much.

[Trickname]

I also enjoy it as a casual player.
I remember my time as a raider though and I would have been annoyed by it back then if it was a thing.

I just don't see why there can't be a grinding / collection system to upgrade gear to titanforged level (i.e. drops from mythic + chests and raid bosses). This would mean it's still a bonus if something rolled WF/TF as it saves time and resources but you could still upgrade your gear to the same level as someone who rolled WF/TF.

...Actually we kind of had that didn't we and it was dropped for this 100% RNG system.

Another issue which comes to mind is this system inflating player item levels which leads to people asking for stupidly high item levels for trivial content.

Hats off to anyone who claims to not care at all about it though! Your profanities and and over aggressive comments really help prove this is how you feel and totally don't make it seem like you really do care but just want to sound like mr cool.

[MasterHamster]

If people feel like they *have to* do every WQ, clear every dungeon, clear every raid on every difficulty, just for chances of high TFs, it's their own f'ing problem.


HOWEVER, I think it is ridiculous that it can TF to the absolute cap. Mythic raiders should always receive the highest level gear by a margin, not be inched by heroic gear.

For the vast majority of players, TF is a welcome bonus. A pleasant surprise now and then while they do their content as usual. Don't buy into the illusion that just because the most vocal players are more likely to be "negatively impacted" by it, means that a majority hates the system as a whole. Same with legendaries. No, you having BiS trinkets or not isn't really having a real effect in your Top 50k-100k world guild.

[HeiAggra]

I understand that a lot of the Mythic raiders hate the TF system.

I'm on the opposite end of the end of the spectrum. I love the TF system as a casual player and I hope it is always in the game in some form.

The fact that I have a chance as a casual player to get something really really good. (yes even better than Mythic drops)is just awesome and has a real impact on retaining me as a player everyday.

there should always be a chance that you will get something really really awesome and powerful in game even though you dont have the interest or time in working in a very structured group and commitment to get it that lvl of gear normaly. No I'm not saying i should be able to get a full set of 955 gear as a casual player but that I should have a chance at 1 or even 2 piece of that lvl gear just from doing normal and heroic content.

The TF system is really great and keeps me playing knowing that if luck is on my side one day I may get something really awesome.

I hate the TF! I makes ppl run all diffs possible and leads to burnout on raids.
I would have loved it if for example would be WF +10 top. would help retain the gear rising to lvls that are stupid.
Dungeons would have been 820 with WF +5 or +10. First raid EN LFR: 830 with +5 +10 EN N: 840 with +5 +10. EN HC: 850 with +5 +10. EN M: 860 with +5 +10!
This logic would follow the next raids also.
With the diff that from one raid to another Normal from the new raid would be same lvl HC the old one.
EN HC: 850 with +5 +10 and TOV N: 850 with +5 +10 and so on.

[Redroniksre]

Titanforging needs work that is for sure, and i think the idea the Bellular had was on the right track with the ability to upgrade the items to cap. My issue with lowering how high they can cap is that the lower the cap is, the easier it is to hit, and the sooner "casual" or non raiders quit the game. Its been proven time and time again, people cant be coaxed into raiding, not from higher ilevel gear, not from transmog, so nothing about Mythic raiding is really devalued because nobody wanted it in the first place.

[Deleted]

I am casual and I hate TF, because it usually procs with items which are of no use to me. I would rather have an upgrade system which rewards playing the game, and gives better / more upgrades from harder content, not for randomly playing any content. And a system where I can chose which items I want to upgrade. I don't want TF versatility gear for my fire mage, but I constantly get this. It's insulting.

[Cronovey]

To be blunt: There are many, many more casual players than mythic raiders. Blizzard has, for the first time in a while, prioritized and started listening to what casual players enjoy.

With any luck they will continue to do so while also providing mythic raiders the content they want.

Don't disagree with this at all, but as someone who disliked having to run previous content as a mythic raider, I think there needs to be a happy medium here as well.

I think the easiest way to "fix" the system would be simply capping the TF of an item at the maximum item level for when that content was current. So for example, instead of every hunter in the world farming Ursoc on Normal, Heroic, Mythic, and LFR every single week for that lucky TF on a Bloodthirsty Instinct when they were trying to get it to 925, make it cap at 895 which was the item level cap on non-legendary items during Emerald Nightmare. Same thing with the launch world bosses so you don't have people wasting bonus roll seals for that chance at a supremely lucky Unstable Arcanocrystal that they want to get to like 920; it should be capped at 895 to keep current content more attractive while still offering potential upgrades for some players.

This offers people doing current content the time back that they spent grinding out for TF pieces but also allows natural gear progression for players who are coming back to the game, leveling an alt, or just starting the gearing process from a low item level. As each patch comes out, the gear from the previous patch would be capped again, so anything from Nighthold would be capped at 925 (looking at you, Draught and Convergence) to prevent people from having to farm endlessly for that TF Convergence on their rogue or whatever they're playing. This keeps current gear more relevant (because there's no chance of people going back to TF some tier pieces up to like ~930 and keeping their old tier sets) but still rewards players doing any content in the game that is relevant to their character's item level. Doing something entirely trivial (for example, Normal EN) shouldn't be rewarding a trinket or relic that is of current mythic ilvl, but doing LFR of ToS which is current content should let you be rewarded appropriately when you're lucky enough to see that epic TF.

[cuafpr]

its a good start but maybe a way to bring up non-TF drops via badges or something would work as well, as i'm not a fan of RNG on top of RNG on top RNG.

[FelPlague]

And this is different then any other point in Wow how? A select part of the high end player's have always felt they got to do all the content and have bitched about it non-stop.

so back in WOTLK icc 25 heroic raiders had to do uld 10/25, toc 10h/25h and nax 10/25+ all the single boss raids? are you serious?

this is the first time EVER people are doing raids 3 raids old, and world bosses that have been in the game since launch, for BIS items

[Hinaki]

MELONS. I don't like it personally.

[Jtbrig7390]

so back in WOTLK icc 25 heroic raiders had to do uld 10/25, toc 10h/25h and nax 10/25+ all the single boss raids? are you serious?

Nope but Heroic 25man raider's in ICC had to do TOC 25man (due to The trinket dropping that was better until u got the one from ICC) and 10/25man Normal/Heroic ICC.

Its almost like they had to do things outside current content to keep ahead of the game. Once again this isn't a new concept and it has been happening long before LFR and the current system.

They also had to max professions and craft profession gear to make up slots (like the plate chest in wrath) until the raid one dropped.

Bottom line if u can't hack it then ether A) Top Raiding isn't for you or B) Wow isn't for you. Systems like AP/TF/WF are not going anywhere because it keeps the vast majority of the player base playing.

Blizzard cares more about keeping as many people playing as they can, over a small minority getting pissed they got to play with the "scrubs"

[Ulfric Trumpcloak]

A casual player shouldn't be able to obtain the same or better gear than a hardcore player. It doesn't make sense, it's unfair to the people putting more time, effort, and skill into the game.

[Deleted]

Cap it 5 iLvls below heroic raid loot. It solves every problem for the hardcore raiders and still keep the gambling aspect for the casual crowd. I don't feel that I need or am entitled to gamble my way any higher than that.

It's ok IMO if you cap it at heroic+5... but the current way it's just too high.

[Deleted]

I do find it odd that is goes so high. But as a firmly casual player, the idea I can pug a EN, ToV, NH or see if I can go with my guild for ToS for a crack at an upgrade across the board it works for me.

To clarify, I never really did the raids in MoP and WoD bar LFR, but it was always capped yes prior to Legion?

[kamuimac]

If people feel like they *have to* do every WQ, clear every dungeon, clear every raid on every difficulty, just for chances of high TFs, it's their own f'ing problem.


HOWEVER, I think it is ridiculous that it can TF to the absolute cap. Mythic raiders should always receive the highest level gear by a margin, not be inched by heroic gear.

For the vast majority of players, TF is a welcome bonus. A pleasant surprise now and then while they do their content as usual. Don't buy into the illusion that just because the most vocal players are more likely to be "negatively impacted" by it, means that a majority hates the system as a whole. Same with legendaries. No, you having BiS trinkets or not isn't really having a real effect in your Top 50k-100k world guild.

what you desribing is a completly unlikely scenario - i have 12 alts and out of world content highest TF i have recived was 925 - i have never peronaly seen highest TF than that - is it possible from HC ToS ? maybe but again its completly unlikely

anyone who is claiming how lfr players are runing around in TF 930-955 gear is straight runing - is there 1 out of milion players who was so lucky ? maybe but i have yet to encounter such person

[FelPlague]

Nope but Heroic 25man raider's in ICC had to do TOC 25man (due to The trinket dropping that was better until u got the one from ICC) and 10/25man Normal/Heroic ICC.

Its almost like they had to do things outside current content to keep ahead of the game. Once again this isn't a new concept and it has been happening long before LFR and the current system.

They also had to max professions and craft profession gear to make up slots (like the plate chest in wrath) until the raid one dropped.

Bottom line if u can't hack it then ether A) Top Raiding isn't for you or B) Wow isn't for you. Systems like AP/TF/WF are not going anywhere because it keeps the vast majority of the player base playing.

Blizzard cares more about keeping as many people playing as they can, over a small minority getting pissed they got to play with the "scrubs"

yes, but current mythic ToS players need to do all dificulties of ToS, all dificulties of NH, all dificulties of EN, and world bosses to have the optimal chances

[kamuimac]

, there seems to be enough hate towards it for it to go away. .

you mean those 50-100 people here on mmochampion whinging the same bs in eveyr single thread about this ? ye blizzard couldnt give less f... about them

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yes, but current mythic ToS players need to do all dificulties of ToS, all dificulties of NH, all dificulties of EN, and world bosses to have the optimal chances

no they do not - and if they feel like they do , they shoudl go straight to psychiatrist because their sever ocd is acting up again and they need strong medication

[Kedemel]

yes, but current mythic ToS players need to do all dificulties of ToS, all dificulties of NH, all dificulties of EN, and world bosses to have the optimal chances

They don't need to do this. Once the current tier is out, you can quit the EN and NH runs if you want to. This is something that Mythic raiders put on themselves. In no way is this a necessity. Using "need to" in this situation is silly and totally player driven.