What do you want pvp to be after legion ?

[Neversage]

Just like it is, but without gear RNG, and with some actually interesting/useful wPvP areas.

[Dawon]

That DH's drop the flag whenever they jump-fly-fly-jump-backflipfly-fly-fly... everything else is dandy!

[Lightbull]

I seriously don't understand the "remove stat templates" argument. I for one enjoy being able to just jump into PvP and play instead of grinding for exactly the same thing the templates are providing.

On topic, some melee are a bit overbearing right now in terms of the amount of utility they bring to the table, namely WW Monk, Havoc DH, Arms Warrior, Unholy DK, Sub/Assa Rogue. I'm not saying make every class like these melee, I'm just saying give casters more options to deal with them, and remove some of the utility from these classes.

I also low key miss being a MoP duel hero. Add more 1v1 areas pls blizz

[ilik2345]

I seriously don't understand the "remove stat templates" argument. I for one enjoy being able to just jump into PvP and play instead of grinding for exactly the same thing the templates are providing.

The argument generally goes, the previous systems were fairer (as in more of a level playing field). The previous system basically controlled how quickly you could get a full set of bis items for pvp, if you were casual in play time and did little rated it was possible to end a season in the same gear as people in R1, it was completely flat only how fast you got there was defined by rating and participation.

You might argue the upfront time of getting a complete honor set in the old system was a barrier, but they allowed pve gear to be equal to it so you could skip that step entirely, and 4-6 hours of grinding honor gear is a heck of a lot less then a new player has to face now to get full 52 points in ap and 900+ ilvl gear.

[Kagthul]

Mediocre. Ill settle for mediocre.

I'd really love for "decent".

[Kryptoon]

There were many players who enjoyed pvp only. Lacking real progression in pvp (prestige is an empty shell, progression wannabe) removed the reason for them to stay and as a result we have the current state of pvp.
What would happen in pve if you take out progression and let all the players to do all content with any gear? .. you have your answer in actual pvp.

[Razion]

I'd like to get rid of the last bit of scaling off gear from instanced PvP, and for PvP templates to be enforced in the open world.
I want to see some effort put into balancing low-level PvP.
I want to see level scaling for PvP so low levels vs high levels don't just "always miss" or "just gets one-shotted".

[PePeNinja]

4v4
5v5
6v6

3+ new BGs

Solo Queue arena/rbg

[schwank05]

Bring Back BC PVP and it's reward system, that is when it was perfect, at least for me anyway. You could get the Gladiator S4 set and be better than someone who Raided and collected T4 set.

[MrCool]

I seriously don't understand the "remove stat templates" argument. I for one enjoy being able to just jump into PvP and play instead of grinding for exactly the same thing the templates are providing.

There are at least 4 reasons why removing templates would be a good thing in my opinion:
- Removing them would give back the ability to fine tune your secondary stat distribution.
- Removing them would unify the game PVP once more. Nowadays WPVP is a separate trainwreck because they only care about templated PVP balance.
- Removing them adds room for progression through gear power upgrades that serves some purpose (don't you love earning PVP trinkets that don't work in instanced PVP? Blizz logic at its finest).
- Removing them would force Blizzard to only use spell modifiers to balance PVP. Tuning stat templates is a lazy way to tune a spec. Here's an example: Feral is set to 87% Agility on live. Feral players complain about their survivability. By nerfing Agility to 87%, Blizzard has reduced their overall damage (intended), but left them with shit healing spells (hence complaints to survivability). Meanwhile, Rogues are also set to ~85% Agility, but their survivability is left intact, because their self-healing is percentage-based.

[MicroMax]

1. New world pvp zone.
2. Solo queue rated arenas.
3. Timewalking Wintergrasp and Tol Barad.

[twistedmynd]

I don't understand all the parroting on this forum. It seems that across the first page every poster unanimously agrees that bg's are the best pvp. Myself and many others just don't see that as "truth".

I'm okay with the sometimes silly pacing from cooldowns, underperforming/overperforming heals, plethora of interrupts, gap closers, disparity between rotations, class viability imbalance, lack of freedom class templates, or anything else that get's complained about.

My 1 gripe about legion is that there's no participation. Maybe those aforementioned issues are causing some of the loss. But frankly, when we had the highest participation, it only gear that encouraged people to grind. People wanted their toons to be stronger in general and pvp gave purples.

Thus we have the term "welfare epics". The badge system that was later introduced was a similar grind, but you could always get better pvp rewards from casual bg's. I think that was the draw for a lot of people.

===

Just please incentive players to play pvp again. We need more participation.

[Mafic]

The argument generally goes, the previous systems were fairer (as in more of a level playing field). The previous system basically controlled how quickly you could get a full set of bis items for pvp, if you were casual in play time and did little rated it was possible to end a season in the same gear as people in R1, it was completely flat only how fast you got there was defined by rating and participation.

You might argue the upfront time of getting a complete honor set in the old system was a barrier, but they allowed pve gear to be equal to it so you could skip that step entirely, and 4-6 hours of grinding honor gear is a heck of a lot less then a new player has to face now to get full 52 points in ap and 900+ ilvl gear.

Template system needs to be removed.

It is so bad.

[Kagthul]

My 1 gripe about legion is that there's no participation. Maybe those aforementioned issues are causing some of the loss. But frankly, when we had the highest participation, it only gear that encouraged people to grind. People wanted their toons to be stronger in general and pvp gave purples.

===

Just please incentive players to play pvp again. We need more participation.

Its not the balance issues that cause participation to plummet.

Its the lack of rewards.

The rated ladder collapsed because there's now now point of any kind for about 90% of the players that used to inflate it to even bother.

They literaly will not EVER get gear good enough to matter. So they dont participate.

That simple.

The current system is garbage. It doesn't reward players for being part of the ladder.

Ergo, they dont get on the ladder.

And while you dont agree that BGs are the best PvP - the game was always healthiest when BGs were the focus or at least not utterly ignored in favor of Deathmatchbawks.

The number of people who care about Arena as a form of PvP is MINISCULE in comparison to the number of people who used to PvP daily in BGs.

[Deleted]

I think people enjoy battlegrounds more simply because this is an MMO and not an FPS/MOBA.

There's a little bit of roleplayer in all of us and we wan't to be part of epic big battles more than small scale tiny environment battles. I don't know for sure though I'm just assuming but I never got the appeal of arenas at all. An MMO can't be about individual skill like a moba or fps can so why pretend? Skill can come on a large scale as organizing raids etc.

I agree that there's low incentive to play. The prestige awards aren't appealing to me. I don't have the time or energy for rated pvp. So I kind of want to play but i'll probably just stop now like so many others.

I has soooo high hopes for Ashran in WoD and was imagining a new and ever better old school AV. Instead we got a f*cking piece of garbage sh*t fest. So so so dissapointing.

1. Epic battlegrounds (new or old school AV).
2. Better rewards.

[jontunnel130]

Remove artifact weapon, and the ap system in general. bring back pvp power although I think it could use a name change. It sounds too much like +gooder at pvp. Raid gear should never be used in pvp. make pvp weapons and trinkets that much better in pvp than raid trinkets used for pvp. Balance classes. Its sad that that one has to be mentioned but yes. Tweaking (buffs and nerfs) should happen within the first 2 weeks of any expansion/patch. BUYABLE gear. Theres nothing more rewarding than finally buying that piece of gear you've been grinding for. I don't mind the current prestige system but their thinking has been so millennial driven lately I await whatever this current team of "masterminds" puts out next.

and for those of you wanting to remove rated pvp...seriously? what kind of pvp do you deem "real"? because as it is non rated bg pugs are at the bottom for a reason. hardly any skill is involved and multiple people can get carried. Now if you're crying about the better gear from rated pvp because you cannot, have not or will not reach it. that is sad indeed. just take the parable of mythic raiding to someone who only clears normal difficulty. should they really be getting the same gear for about 1/3 of the skill

[Kryptoon]

Pvp pugs reached this stage as current pvp setup encouraged all pve players to join and farm hk, same as farming pixels in any dungeon. Doing dmg (for them) is pretty much the same rotation so no need to bother learning any class counters, when all bunched together at mid. If this fails, then blame the team.
Back in time when we had gear progression nobody wanted to lose a match as the points were important for progressing, while now it doesnt matter whether you win or lose in pugs, thus ppl spend more time ganking than doing objectives.
You can remove rated once you bring back real purpose for winning and make/group teams based on the gear lvl/mmr or other criteria that consider pvp expertise.
I dont see the need of two tiers bgs once you decrease the number of ppl that come into pvp for wasting time and bgs are populated by players who enjoy pvp-ing.

[Deleted]

Back in time when we had gear progression nobody wanted to lose a match as the points were important for progressing, while now it doesnt matter whether you win or lose in pugs, thus ppl spend more time ganking than doing objectives.
You can remove rated once you bring back real purpose for winning and make/group teams based on the gear lvl/mmr or other criteria that consider pvp expertise..

That's a good point. Winning did used to be sweeter and losing more infuriating. I still want to win of course who doesn't, but it's not quite the same as before.

I don't think it should be brutally punishing though. You don't want to spend 20 minutes in a BG and get 0 honor for losing for example.

I think PvP gear is a good idea and should be better for PvP than PvE gear. But it should be accesible for casuals too, I don't mind it taking time if I can get it eventually but I don't like it being locked behind ratings etc. I don't enjoy rated PvP at all and there's a lot of people in the same boat. Maybe just allow rated people to get it faster and casuals to grind it out but in the end get the same good PvP gear. Maybe vanity items like mounts etc for the rated people? That always seemed to work well I think.

[Deleted]

After legion, i would like PVP to be like it always has been before legion destroyed it: fun and a viable way to play the game. Any previous expansion version would do, they were all good. I d like to see

Artifact weapons and templates gone
World pvp supported again
Pvp gear again, so you can gear doing pvp only, enjoy the whole game afterwards, and be on an equal playing field with all pvp players. Also enjoy outperforming non-geared players in pvp, the same way i expect to be underperforming if i try to say raid in pvp gear
Some new pvp content, world pvp area or bgr would be good also

[Deleted]

back to the wrath model. so remove templates bring back buyable pvp gear as well as sone gear locked behind rating. so for example 2.2k rating for wep.