Netherlight Crucible - disappointed

[Jaylock]

No, because BIS now is having two BIS relic traits, which is bound behind RNG. So a shit relic remains a shit relic.

Why do you insist on lying out of your ass?

Did you not hear blizzard's explanation of how the fucking system works?

If you have a "shit" relic, it can potentially become a good relic because you can *GASP* get your bis trait as your second trait!

How hard is that to understand?

[Nurasu]

That's all this thing is actually doing, making it possible for a shit relic to become good, and guaranteeing that in some way a good relic will become even better.

This is such a flawed statement, because all relics are compared to BiS the same as before. What other metric would you use to determine something is "good" or not? Shit relics are still shit. They don't magically become good with this. Good relics very much have the potential to become bad though.

[Jaylock]

I have a 945 Titanforged relic with my best trait that rolled awful t2 traits and the only decent tier 3 trait is tied to the worse of the 2 t2 traits. That relic is no longer useful to me and will be replaced with another that I have that is 15 ilvls lower but has 2 good traits. It's mathematically better, but that feels pretty shitty to me.

This is just diatribe to the highest degree. You obviously take the 945 relic over the 930 relic any day. Because 1, you get 5 automatic ilvls on top of the 945, and 2, you get a decent tier 3 trait. Its the better relic.

And so what, who fucking cares? Are you trying to min/max your character? Literally does 2% more dps really matter to you in the long run?

Get off your fucking high horse.

[Aliven]

There is no class in this game that get's a hugely massive performance boost out of extra traits. They were before and will continue to be marginal upgrades at best.

In competitve race like Mythic Raids on launch, or hardcore pushing it is enough to warrant farming like idiot. Look a broad spectrum.

[Nurasu]

Why do you insist on lying out of your ass?

Did you not hear blizzard's explanation of how the fucking system works?

If you have a "shit" relic, it can potentially become a good relic because you can *GASP* get your bis trait as your second trait!

How hard is that to understand?

Because it still has a bad first trait by definition, or it would have already been BiS. Now add in the fact you can get fucked on T2 too! It's now worse than a now (with NC) comparable relic. How is that hard to understand? Power relative to 7.2.5 increased, which is all you're looking at for some reason; power relative to other relics in 7.3 most likely, based on statistics, decreased.

[Dizzeeyooo]

You obviously take the 945 relic over the 930 relic any day. Because 1, you get 5 automatic ilvls on top of the 945, and 2, you get a decent tier 3 trait. Its the better relic

right now, I will be replacing my 955 average trait + trash crucible rng relic with any 945 above average trait + non trash crucible rng relic that drops

is the 955 relic still the better relic?

[Armourboy]

Why do you insist on lying out of your ass?

Did you not hear blizzard's explanation of how the fucking system works?

If you have a "shit" relic, it can potentially become a good relic because you can *GASP* get your bis trait as your second trait!

How hard is that to understand?

So if I hand you a cake made of shit and cover it with great icing it's no longer a shit cake? Thats essentially what this system is.

It may not taste as bad, but that doesn't mean it's good, despite how many times Blizzard tries to convince people of it.

Now if you want to argue it takes one that was sub optimal ( but was a DPS gain still ) and can turn it into ok, I'll buy that.

[Nurasu]

This is just diatribe to the highest degree. You obviously take the 945 relic over the 930 relic any day. Because 1, you get 5 automatic ilvls on top of the 945, and 2, you get a decent tier 3 trait. Its the better relic.

And so what, who fucking cares? Are you trying to min/max your character? Literally does 2% more dps really matter to you in the long run?

Get off your fucking high horse.

You have no clue what you're talking about, and it's pretty obvious. I play a healer, leech is worth more than 15 ilvls on my gear. I already experience this shit, so no you don't take the higher ilvl "any day". You do the math and take what's best for your output.

[Jaylock]

So if I hand you a cake made of shit and cover it with great icing it's no longer a shit cake? Thats essentially what this system is.

It may not taste as bad, but that doesn't mean it's good, despite how many times Blizzard tries to convince people of it.

Now if you want to argue it takes one that was sub optimal ( but was a DPS gain still ) and can turn it into ok, I'll buy that.

Why do you only insist on seeing if it doesn't start with a bis trait, and rolls bis t2 and t3 in the NLC then its a shit relic? Why the fuck do you people do this to yourselves? Its a BONUS SYSTEM, whos PRIMARY purpose is to help turn potentially unwanted relics into WANTED relics.

Don't you understand?

Do the math.

[Nurasu]

It's not an argument, it's a point that people that complain about it because "MUH NUMBERS OMG RNG!!!" aren't the people it would even affect.

Basically, the only people that complain about power progression are people that think they need absolutely all of the possible power their character can get to beat content that is tuned much lower than it I.E- Bads.

This is also bullshit, because this, just like any other game like it, is about optimizing your character. That seems like a pretty simple point. Not that I even think this is an argument that should be made in this thread, but how does power progression not affect every single player in the game, whether they need it or not?

[Jaylock]

You have no clue what you're talking about, and it's pretty obvious. I play a healer, leech is worth more than 15 ilvls on my gear. I already experience this shit, so no you don't take the higher ilvl "any day". You do the math and take what's best for your output.

So I should expect that you are some god king mythic raider then? I mean even if you are a mythic raider, why do you FEEL the need to have everything PERFECTOID BIS BIS PERFECT!!!!?

1-2% increase is nothing, the system is working as intended to *GASP* make bad relics good, and potentially good relics better.

[Nurasu]

Why do you only insist on seeing if it doesn't start with a bis trait, and rolls bis t2 and t3 in the NLC then its a shit relic? Why the fuck do you people do this to yourselves? Its a BONUS SYSTEM, whos PRIMARY purpose is to help turn potentially unwanted relics into WANTED relics.

Don't you understand?

Do the math.

Again, higher power relative to 7.2.5 relics; lower or the same power relative to 7.3 relics. It's not a "bonus".

[Super Kami Dende]

This is also bullshit, because this, just like any other game like it, is about optimizing your character. That seems like a pretty simple point. Not that I even think this is an argument that should be made in this thread, but how does power progression not affect every single player in the game, whether they need it or not?

And NLC doesn't stop you optimizing your Character. If anything it allows you more options to do so. It's an extra bonus to player power progression and the only people butthurt about it are pseudo-elitists that are scared other people might do high DPS as well.

[Nurasu]

Surely everyone in here can agree that there's still a "best". This system only gives "second best" a chance to become "best" and "best" a chance to stay "best". It does nothing for all of the other ones, which is why it's simply disappointing as the thread title states. I'm not nearly as worked up about it as Jaylock seems to be, for whatever reason. Off to more productive things.

[Ysho]

I really dont think more RNG-based optimization is what players wanted...
How about customization where players have the reins?
But I guess it keeps people grinding relics like there's no tomorrow. "Content"
Also funny how this seems to be Reforging in the most glorious state, except it is based on RNG and works on one item slot.

The problem with this that none of you snowflakes can seem to remember from the million times Blizzard has caved to your whining is that "giving you the reins" ultimately means cookie cutter. And then all of you are whining that you're being forced into a cookie cutter model, that there really is only one option, and it's boring, blah blah.

You want Hello Kitty Adventure Island where the outcome of your time played is 100% guaranteed before you start playing, but unfortunately randomness in gearing/character power is the FOUNDATION of this type of game. Personally, I don't see the former as fun. At all. Engaging entertainment, be it a movie, TV show, board game, or MMO video game is about surprise > disappointment > frustration > failure > success. Classical drama essentially.

I'm 100% convinced that almost everything you millennials bitch about is not what you'll actually be happy with, if given.

[Deleted]

The Argus campaign was wonderful, the end result a dud. The Crucible is simply boring and another push in the direction of playing more to farm AP and get relics that might roll better, on top of the existing TF system and the existing main trait slot.

Now we want a high ilvl relic with a good base trait, a good second tier bonus and a good third tier trait. All of these are variables, meaning we are realistically never done with the search for a better relic. Times 3.

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[Spoonman]

im with u op on this one
This is gonna make people whore around even more for relics even tho there are clear different in ilvl
I'm hoping for a rework on the system where players can choose

[Deleted]

So I should expect that you are some god king mythic raider then? I mean even if you are a mythic raider, why do you FEEL the need to have everything PERFECTOID BIS BIS PERFECT!!!!?

1-2% increase is nothing, the system is working as intended to *GASP* make bad relics good, and potentially good relics better.

As if someone like you, who considers LFR the pinnacle of raiding, would ever understand. It's a pointless discussion, you're fundamentally not capable of understanding.

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[Deleted]

im with u op on this one
This is gonna make people whore around even more for relics even tho there are clear different in ilvl
I'm hoping for a rework on the system where players can choose

It simply needs to allow a live preview of the crucible path of the relic without making it soulbound.

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[Jaylock]

As if someone like you, who considers LFR the pinnacle of raiding, would ever understand. It's a pointless discussion, you're fundamentally not capable of understanding.

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LFR isn't the pinnacle of raiding, and i think ive made my position clear on LFR over the years.