Trumpcare 2017 already causing higher uninsured!

[Zan15]

Pres. Trump Oct 2017: "Obamacare is finished, it's dead, it's gone...There is no such thing as Obamacare anymore."

So now that is out of the way.

Trumpcare is already having its intended effect. Make the system collapse, blame democrats....

Still waiting for the actual Trump plan, we still have not seen his great plan???

https://www.yahoo.com/news/uninsured...070148470.html

The national uninsured rate has started climbing back up amid higher costs for health insurance and uncertainty about the future of the Affordable Care Act, according to survey findings Gallup released Friday.

In the three-month period that ended Sept. 30, 12.3 percent of American adults had no health coverage, a 0.6 percentage point increase from the prior quarter and a 1.4 percentage point rise since the end of last year, the Gallup-Sharecare Well-Being Index shows.

That represents 3.5 million fewer Americans with health coverage between Dec. 31, 2016, and Sept. 30, 2017, according to Gallup, and continues a trend that started earlier this year.


In addition to those underlying issues in the market regulated by the Affordable Care Act, Trump and the GOP Congress have created uncertainty about the state of the exchanges and the future of the health care system that likely depressed enrollment.

[Mafic]

Actually the system is collapsing because of rising premiums.

In the yahoo article:

Premium increases on the Affordable Care Act’s health insurance exchanges rose sharply in many parts of the country from 2016 to 2017, putting coverage out of reach for households that qualified for little or no financial assistance. Those who are eligible for tax credits to reduce their monthly insurance bills generally are shielded from rate hikes because their subsidies increase to compensate, but those who must pay full price bear the brunt of the rate hikes. Even so, the uninsured rate rose slightly more last quarter for low-income households than for higher earners.

If Trump did nothing it would still collapse. What Trump has done is accelerated the process to force a political solution from both sides of the aisle. This strategy is diametrically different from Obama where he seeked consensus via cooperation and encouraged voters to voice feedback to reps. Trump is using force so both sides make compromises due to building pressures from the public.

If I had to guess why the sudden uptick it is most likely young adults that no longer are part of parent health care plans. ACA was enacted in 2010 and it has been seven years, so any 18 year olds that were on their parents plans are now starting to be disqualified as they turn 26. This makes sense because the article cites an uptick of uninsured in the lower income bracket which is usually young adults in their early to mid 20's. Just my opinion.

[Trifle]

Actually the system is collapsing because of rising premiums.

...

If I had to guess why the sudden uptick it is most likely young adults that no longer are part of parent health care plans.

There's a sudden rise of premiums because Republicans are sabotaging the system, eg by delaying or stopping payments of subsidies to insurance companies that are part of the ACA. This causes uncertainty for the insurance companies, and thus they have to put the prices up because their financial risk has increased.

There's a bunch of other stuff too, but a large part of the clusterfuck is Republicans screwing around with the system.

[masterhorus8]

There's a sudden rise of premiums because Republicans are sabotaging the system, eg by delaying or stopping payments of subsidies to insurance companies that are part of the ACA. This causes uncertainty for the insurance companies, and thus they have to put the prices up because their financial risk has increased.

There's a bunch of other stuff too, but a large part of the clusterfuck is Republicans screwing around with the system.

AKA: "You break it, you buy it."

[Breccia]

Actually the system is collapsing because of rising premiums

And why are the premiums spiking?

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/...ums-study-says

http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare...rance-premiums

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-n...518-story.html

http://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/tru...surer-profits/

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...-20171016.html

https://www.vox.com/2017/5/30/157019...acare-premiums

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1AV24D

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...officials-say/

And of course, the CBO report.

Gross premiums for silver plans offered through the
marketplaces would be 20*percent higher in 2018 and
25 percent higher by 2020

Sorry, but insurer after insurer, qualified expert after qualified expert, all disagree with your "if I had to guess".

[Deleted]

It's a bit like Obamacare is an orange, and you're being told that eating an orange is good for you, which it is, and then the Trumpsters start spreading a false rumor about how vitamin C causes cancer. You think people are going to keep eating oranges?

[Dontrike]

It's a bit like Obamacare is an orange, and you're being told that eating an orange is good for you, which it is, and then the Trumpsters start spreading a false rumor about how vitamin C causes cancer. You think people are going to keep eating oranges?

If both sides of their brain works they will.

[Spectral]

Sorry, but insurer after insurer, qualified expert after qualified expert, all disagree with your "if I had to guess".

I think that's fine for assessing proximate causes, but let's be clear that the long-term motivations for experts in insurance and medical care is emphatically not in the direction of mitigating cost increases. It's pretty hard to get anyone that's presently getting wealthy off of the current system to agree to anything that could plausibly diminish spending in the long run.

[Felya]

I think that's fine for assessing proximate causes, but let's be clear that the long-term motivations for experts in insurance and medical care is emphatically not in the direction of mitigating cost increases. It's pretty hard to get anyone that's presently getting wealthy off of the current system to agree to anything that could plausibly diminish spending in the long run.

If only someone had the balls to cap insurance administrative costs and profits.

[Spectral]

If only someone had the balls to cap insurance administrative costs and profits.

Administrative costs and profits as a percentage of total cost is one issue, but not really the major driving factor for cost. Until there's a serious proposal to stop throwing insane amounts of money at hospitals and doctors, it's pretty hard to take seriously the notion that any actual cost control is on the way.

[Ripster42]

If only someone had the balls to cap insurance administrative costs and profits.

If I remember right the ACA does this to some extent, but it actually pressures to move the ball in the wrong direction. IIRC it caps insurance profits as a % of revenue which leads to a conflicting pressure against the the need to keep premiums low to capture clientele. The ACA was a huge improvement over the old system, but it still has some glaring flaws.

[Cthulhu 2020]

I think that's fine for assessing proximate causes, but let's be clear that the long-term motivations for experts in insurance and medical care is emphatically not in the direction of mitigating cost increases. It's pretty hard to get anyone that's presently getting wealthy off of the current system to agree to anything that could plausibly diminish spending in the long run.

Something that might diminish spending in the health care market in the long run: Less insured people.

Just a shot in the dark.

[Jastall]

I think that's fine for assessing proximate causes, but let's be clear that the long-term motivations for experts in insurance and medical care is emphatically not in the direction of mitigating cost increases. It's pretty hard to get anyone that's presently getting wealthy off of the current system to agree to anything that could plausibly diminish spending in the long run.

While true, that doesn't change the fact that Trump's actions address none of the issues you brought up, and makes other issues worse as well.

I'm not sure if any politician in the US will actually have the clout to have a real talk about cost control, in the foreseeable future at least, because as soon as they do so everyone's going to go muh socialism on them.

[Spectral]

While true, that doesn't change the fact that Trump's actions address none of the issues you brought up, and makes other issues worse as well.

I'm not sure if any politician in the US will actually have the clout to have a real talk about cost control, in the foreseeable future at least, because as soon as they do so everyone's going to go muh socialism on them.

Correct, Trump's handling of healthcare is pathetic, cowardly, and incompetent.

Every other politician else is merely pathetic and cowardly - some of them are competent.

[Cyberowl]

Actually the system is collapsing because of rising premiums.

In the yahoo article:



If Trump did nothing it would still collapse. What Trump has done is accelerated the process to force a political solution from both sides of the aisle. This strategy is diametrically different from Obama where he seeked consensus via cooperation and encouraged voters to voice feedback to reps. Trump is using force so both sides make compromises due to building pressures from the public.

If I had to guess why the sudden uptick it is most likely young adults that no longer are part of parent health care plans. ACA was enacted in 2010 and it has been seven years, so any 18 year olds that were on their parents plans are now starting to be disqualified as they turn 26. This makes sense because the article cites an uptick of uninsured in the lower income bracket which is usually young adults in their early to mid 20's. Just my opinion.

Insurances (just like stock etc) being influenced by speculation, politics and weak signals is nothing new.

[Mafic]

There's a sudden rise of premiums because Republicans are sabotaging the system, eg by delaying or stopping payments of subsidies to insurance companies that are part of the ACA. This causes uncertainty for the insurance companies, and thus they have to put the prices up because their financial risk has increased.

There's a bunch of other stuff too, but a large part of the clusterfuck is Republicans screwing around with the system.

The rise started well before Republican obstructionism.

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Insurances (just like stock etc) being influenced by speculation, politics and weak signals is nothing new.

I agree. But people being blind to the weaknesses to the ACA surprise me.

[DarkTZeratul]

The rise started well before Republican obstructionism.

Yes, premiums have been rising since the ACA was put into place. But premiums had been rising even before the ACA was a thing, and the ACA actually slowed the rate of increase. Premiums didn't start spiking until this year, when Trump and the Republicans started making the future of the ACA extremely uncertain by trying to dismantle it, threatening to stop subsidy payments, and then actually stopping subsidy payments.

I agree. But people being blind to the weaknesses to the ACA surprise me.

People point out all the time that the ACA is not perfect and is really more of a bandaid than an actual fix. The trouble is that absolutely nothing the Republicans are doing is even remotely better.

[Mafic]

And why are the premiums spiking?

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/...ums-study-says

http://thehill.com/policy/healthcare...rance-premiums

http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-n...518-story.html

http://www.factcheck.org/2017/10/tru...surer-profits/

http://www.philly.com/philly/busines...-20171016.html

https://www.vox.com/2017/5/30/157019...acare-premiums

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1AV24D

https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle...officials-say/

And of course, the CBO report.



Sorry, but insurer after insurer, qualified expert after qualified expert, all disagree with your "if I had to guess".

I can copy and paste links too.

https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcom...ww.google.com/

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/04/u...-for-2016.html

https://www.kff.org/health-reform/fa...-marketplaces/

http://www.npr.org/sections/health-s...family-budgets

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-you...l-keep-rising/

Unlike your links my links range from 2014-2016 well before Trump's presidency.

Obama has known for a long time that the ACA would be reworked due to the ticking bomb nature of it and how premiums started to rise sharply as early as 2012.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/11/pf/i...ums/index.html

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Yes, premiums have been rising since the ACA was put into place. But premiums had been rising even before the ACA was a thing, and the ACA actually slowed the rate of increase. Premiums didn't start spiking until this year, when Trump and the Republicans started making the future of the ACA extremely uncertain by trying to dismantle it, threatening to stop subsidy payments, and then actually stopping subsidy payments.

Nope.

The largest spike happened the start of 2016 when Obama was still President.

[DarkTZeratul]

Obama has known for a long time that the ACA would be reworked due to the ticking bomb nature of it and how premiums started to rise sharply as early as 2012.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/11/pf/i...ums/index.html

Did you even read that article? It says that the premium increase was much lower than usual, and that they expected premiums to rise slower as a result of the ACA.

[Zan15]

If only someone had the balls to cap insurance administrative costs and profits.

See and that is the problem, trying to fix the system by going after just 1 part of the problem


Once you finish doing that what are you going to do about the other 85% of the problem in cost, Profits and Waste.
You know the biggest drug maker had 3x the profit of the top 5 insurance companies right??

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I can copy and paste links too.

https://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcom...ww.google.com/

https://www.nytimes.com/2015/07/04/u...-for-2016.html

https://www.kff.org/health-reform/fa...-marketplaces/

http://www.npr.org/sections/health-s...family-budgets

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/why-you...l-keep-rising/

Unlike your links my links range from 2014-2016 well before Trump's presidency.

Obama has known for a long time that the ACA would be reworked due to the ticking bomb nature of it and how premiums started to rise sharply as early as 2012.

http://money.cnn.com/2012/09/11/pf/i...ums/index.html

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Nope.

The largest spike happened the start of 2016 when Obama was still President.

The best part about you randomly posting links is you did not even bother to read them.
Half of them are employer related insurance articles which has next to nothing to do with the ACA.
a third of them don't support even what you are saying.
You talk about 2012 but the ACA was not even selling plans in 2012 and most rules did not take effect till 2014.
One talks about deductibles and not even premiums

One point blank says "Regardless of where you get your health insurance, one thing is for sure: Your premiums for 2015 and the next several years are set to rise significantly." which points out that ACA or not rates are going up...




if you are going to make a counter argument at least read them first.