confused about ring stats

[Rollatorklm]

So a mate of mine just linked me his new ring on his mage
and randomly i noticed that my pawn said that his ring was a 49% upgrade, which i found weird
Until i looked at the stats his ring had

https://gyazo.com/417231a2fbeb5352d0e0d66f1def4060

thats a huge difference in stats, for basically the same item?

is this intended or is the ret ring just lacking stats?

[killwithpwr]

I'm not too sure about this, but it's pretty safe to assume Blizzard feels that Divine Purpose is one of the more (if not the most) powerfull extra talents on top of Crusade (which you must pick if you are dps inclined)

The reduction in secondaries reflects that.

[Tehterokkar]

They balance the talent rings with secondaries, rather than just the effect. It would be pretty difficult to make sure each talent ring is within the same power spike area as other legendaries otherwise.

The mage class ring is pretty horrible IMO, the talents you get aren't that good. Meanwhile Ret's get a pretty good talent that synergizes well with Crusade.

Also the Hunter talent ring has some insane benefits, especially for Marksmanship. True Aim(talent from ring) and LnL have great synergy and True Aim already was a really strong talent by itself.

[Deleted]

DP has been underperforming since launch.
Every ret has clearly stated that DP is the only engaging proc that is left for the spec and thus they found it reasonable to penalize us even more for picking the ring by reducing the stats.
Anyways their internal testing prove this to be the appropriate amount of stats for proper balance. (btw it sims quite the same as sephuz even without the possible haste procc for me in my 4t20 and cloak leggo - and even worse a 3% difference if i choose to pick aggramars to do my physio outside me wheelchair, which i will gladly do in any heavy movement fight).

[Meiffert]

thats a huge difference in stats, for basically the same item?

is this intended or is the ret ring just lacking stats?

It's not the same item. The mage ring has 40 % more stats (and I assume slightly "stronger" stats according to your pawn string), so it shows as 40-something % upgrade.
Pawn only looks at the stats and ignores the special effects.

Highlord gives a strong talent. Other talent rings for other classes give talents that are not as powerful. This is being compensated by the different amount of stats.

Highlord ring is balanced pretty well. It is very close to cloak/belt/shoulders/Liadrin's legendaries.

btw it sims quite the same as sephuz even without the possible haste procc for me in my 4t20 and cloak leggo

Interesting, I think that for most typical setups the talent ring performs better.

[Deleted]

https://snag.gy/klnAcZ.jpg

That's for a patchwerk 5 min fight. T20, cloak, Zeal-BoW-Crusade.

https://snag.gy/SEaMyK.jpg

That's for a heavy movement fight 5 min fight.

I can only imagine what happens in encounters like harjatan or mistress where there is heavy movement, constant add spawn and sephuz proccs on cd. Maybe sephuz+aggramar's (my personal notorious wq speed set) become even better.

That's why i have given up on deep simming and am only following what top paladins are picking in their ventures and try to copy them.

Point is that with a quick look their internal data are not in line with the tools we have in our disposal. DP is clearly underperforming and we have to pick this constipated talent called crusade.
The only explanation is that they didn't want to make leggos powerful to a point making them mandatory.
Imo the so called synergy of crusade-dp-cloak is not as strong to justify the stat squish in the ring. However my theorycrafting ability is poor to say the least. Personally i run with cloak and highlord since i like the gameplay more and it "feels" like i am not completely screwed if the fight ends in 3:50 mins instead of 5 mins. Apparently i should be penalised for this with a stat squish in the ring.
One more point to make is how the poor design of the class relying heavily in staying connected with the target in melee range all the time affects the output. Mobility, melee range attacks to generate resources and spend, total lack of dots/range attacks etc are core issues that need to be resolved.

[Reith]

What they should have actually done is make legendaries the flat-out best picks in their respective uses. Balancing legendaries against one another is a waste of development resources and this team loves to waste developer time doing useless crap.

[Meiffert]

https://snag.gy/klnAcZ.jpg

That's for a patchwerk 5 min fight. T20, cloak, Zeal-BoW-Crusade.

Those are pretty expected results.

https://snag.gy/SEaMyK.jpg

That's for a heavy movement fight 5 min fight.

I can only imagine what happens in encounters like harjatan or mistress where there is heavy movement, constant add spawn and sephuz proccs on cd. Maybe sephuz+aggramar's (my personal notorious wq speed set) become even better.

Simcraft "heavy movement" means "running" for about 3.5s every 10s, or 35 %.
That's a ridiculous amount of movement way above any real fight. Movement speed effect will outperform anything on that setting.

I know that it sounds very idealistic, but honestly, Patchwerk sim is probably closest to a real fight.

For fights with high priority adds, you might consider HecticAddCleave, but honestly, probably even better to just enter the exact line, something like
raid_events+=/adds,count=4,first=20,cooldown=30,duration=5

[Deleted]

Those are pretty expected results.



Simcraft "heavy movement" means "running" for about 3.5s every 10s, or 35 %.
That's a ridiculous amount of movement way above any real fight. Movement speed effect will outperform anything on that setting.

I know that it sounds very idealistic, but honestly, Patchwerk sim is probably closest to a real fight.

For fights with high priority adds, you might consider HecticAddCleave, but honestly, probably even better to just enter the exact line, something like
raid_events+=/adds,count=4,first=20,cooldown=30,duration=5

Y I understand that but this was not exactly my point.
We all know that rets are locked into crusade talent cause the rest are so weak that they don't make sense.
If one likes the DP gameplay but is also inclined to use utility leggos for some late fights in current tier (am not mentioning the first ones cause although there are mechanics involved there as well, guilds usually brute force them giving some players the opportunity to slack a bit in execution and tunnel a bit more) the stat squish on it makes it a no no. It is more a compliment to the other output leggo than a standalone.
Honestly it is quite late in the expansion and noone would mind giving some more stats to the highlord ring to make it a viable solo output leggo instead of the most popular second leggo.
Cause from a gameplay perspective i would love to keep highlord as my output leggo and use utility ones to complement for fight mechanics. But when u sim cloak+highlord with cloak+aggramar's the difference is around 3.5% and when u sim highlord+cloak with highlord+aggramar's or prydaz or wrists then the difference is a stunning 5.7%+.
That's my main objection with the stat squish of this ring : one can not have it as a standalone output leggo since it is really weak on its own and in fact it is just plain stupid penalizing a gameplay option that everyone finds one of the most engaging for rets in this expansion.

[Rollatorklm]

They balance the talent rings with secondaries, rather than just the effect. It would be pretty difficult to make sure each talent ring is within the same power spike area as other legendaries otherwise.

The mage class ring is pretty horrible IMO, the talents you get aren't that good. Meanwhile Ret's get a pretty good talent that synergizes well with Crusade.

Also the Hunter talent ring has some insane benefits, especially for Marksmanship. True Aim(talent from ring) and LnL have great synergy and True Aim already was a really strong talent by itself.

The ring is BIS for arcane on fights where you cant get full benefit out of lust ring
and some people even argue that lust ring and talent ring is the best pairup

so not its not shit, maybe for fire and frost, but for arcane its mental, especially with those stats

But yeah maybe, i just think its weird it has such a difference in stats its quite high