What a lazy disappointment...

[skannerz22]

every expansion is a dlc for classic wow

[Steampunkette]

Lazy?

Tell me, how many years have you worked in the Game Development industry that gives you this insight on whether or not the devs are lazy? Honestly I'm sick to damned death of hearing "Devs are Lazy" as a rallying cry of people whining about not getting exactly what they want, when they want it, or when they don't have the full freaking story as to what is coming down the pipeline beyond a rough overview given across half a dozen half hour to hour long chats with devs.

The devs aren't lazy. They're working hard to put out as much content as they can and considering the bottleneck that comes with game art they've done a freaking MAGNIFICENT job in providing at least 6 new races (At launch, more possibly coming in patches or future expansions) alongside 6 new zones (again at launch, with more probably coming in future patches) retrofitting systems to old zones, rebalancing the entire game's number-basis, designing a whole new form of AI that thinks more tactically (Or so they have said), developing randomizable island content, putting together the assets to build Warfronts, New Arenas and a New BG, Revamped world PvP rules, community circles and social features, GUI updates that you can see in the player demos, new volumetric lighting and fog, and all while still providing the "Standard" compliment of Dungeons, Scenarios, and Raids that you'd rip your damned hair out if they didn't include.

Holy crap, you guys, there's SO MUCH WORK in just the shit I listed, there, that I don't think you even -realize- and you know that's not -all- they're doing 'cause Blizzard always keeps a card or two close to their vest.

Lazy, my ass! Blizzard has bent over backwards and sideways to provide boatloads of content and new options to the player base.

And no. This is not me being a "Blizzard Fangirl". This is me being someone who failed to get into the industry but still studied and worked with people in the industry closely enough to get a -glimpse- of how massive an undertaking one of these things actually -is-.

[lanesia24]

It's all small.

You padded your lists heavily with traditional things we always have in some way, you could just as well have included "new mobs to kill" and "new instances / raids". They are all expected and we are paying big money for them, so yes, we are taking them for granted.

Once you remove the padding, you will realize that:

Your war campaign is accompanied with only three leveling zones, and the number of quests during leveling will quite likely be *smaller* than even in Legion (which was already short on that front) with that war campaign included.

The islands and warfronts are both mixes of scenarios / instances / invasions, just with the islands being small-size and more random, and the warfronts being large-size. Did you play rifts in D3? That's your islands. They are somewhat interesting, but they don't stay interesting for long, the billions of potential combinations from ten-twenty random choices all become stale after a month or so because you very fast start noticing the differences vs the similarities and then those billions vanish and split into what they are - ten-twenty random choices, which isn't a lot. Did you play LFR? That's your warfronts. Large-group PVE which you can queue for. You will just be silently carrying back and forth some rocks to "fortify" something stupid before going to the enemy, that's it.

What's interesting about the necklace? It's the artifact, just without appearances. It's there to make you grind every week or else your neighbor will empower it more than you do.

Etc.

The amount of interest isn't great. Sure, thanks for leveling improvements and other stuff. But that's just not much, the whole announcement does not amount to much. It's meh.

Why are you even still interested in this game? I mean you've been hating on it for 3-4 years now at least. I don't get some people. You sit on a forum dedicated to a game you don't like and continually talk about how it sucks.

[Exilian]

Lazy?

Tell me, how many years have you worked in the Game Development industry that gives you this insight on whether or not the devs are lazy? Honestly I'm sick to damned death of hearing "Devs are Lazy" as a rallying cry of people whining about not getting exactly what they want, when they want it, or when they don't have the full freaking story as to what is coming down the pipeline beyond a rough overview given across half a dozen half hour to hour long chats with devs.

The devs aren't lazy. They're working hard to put out as much content as they can and considering the bottleneck that comes with game art they've done a freaking MAGNIFICENT job in providing at least 6 new races (At launch, more possibly coming in patches or future expansions) alongside 6 new zones (again at launch, with more probably coming in future patches) retrofitting systems to old zones, rebalancing the entire game's number-basis, designing a whole new form of AI that thinks more tactically (Or so they have said), developing randomizable island content, putting together the assets to build Warfronts, New Arenas and a New BG, Revamped world PvP rules, community circles and social features, GUI updates that you can see in the player demos, new volumetric lighting and fog, and all while still providing the "Standard" compliment of Dungeons, Scenarios, and Raids that you'd rip your damned hair out if they didn't include.

Holy crap, you guys, there's SO MUCH WORK in just the shit I listed, there, that I don't think you even -realize- and you know that's not -all- they're doing 'cause Blizzard always keeps a card or two close to their vest.

Lazy, my ass! Blizzard has bent over backwards and sideways to provide boatloads of content and new options to the player base.

And no. This is not me being a "Blizzard Fangirl". This is me being someone who failed to get into the industry but still studied and worked with people in the industry closely enough to get a -glimpse- of how massive an undertaking one of these things actually -is-.

And this is expected of a multibillion dollar company releasing a game thats supposed to keep millions of people occupied for several years with a monthly subscription of 10-15 euros. But i get what youre saying, perhaps a personal attack on the devs being lazy was inaccurate. Whom do i blame then? The idea team? Fine, the idea team was being stupid, not the devs being lazy. The idea team came up with a lackluster story and gave it to the devs to make. Happy?

- - - Updated - - -

Aszhara is mid tier fodder, uninteresting as a character. If we disposed of her in the middle of a raid I'd be much happier than giving her and the boring Naga a whole expansion. Naga are Murlocs level of threat.

Clearly you know nothing of elven lore to make such an uneducated statement. The naga themselves are a race, granted, no more dangerous than humans, orcs, furbolgs, or nerubians. Its who leads them that counts, and the naga are led by who is possibly the most adept mortal mage in the history of warcraft, surpassing people like Medivh and Aegwynn (without the massive Guardian buff that basically gives them the power of 10 archmages), and she was this BEFORE she sucked the well of eternity like there was no tomorrow AND was blessed by N'zoth AND had thousands of years to hone her skill and make her army. She is literally the biggest threat Azeorth could face right now except for maybe N'zoth and the Void Lords

[Steampunkette]

And this is expected of a multibillion dollar company releasing a game thats supposed to keep millions of people occupied for several years with a monthly subscription of 10-15 euros. But i get what youre saying, perhaps a personal attack on the devs being lazy was inaccurate. Whom do i blame then? The idea team? Fine, the idea team was being stupid, not the devs being lazy. The idea team came up with a lackluster story and gave it to the devs to make. Happy?

Maybe instead of blaming anyone you could recognize that you very clearly do not have the full picture? That you're working off a rough outline and framework of the Expansion rather than actually able to dig into the meat and potatoes of it, and instead of throwing around blame and recrimination you could wait 'til you see what the actual finished product looks like?

I dunno. Different things of that nature rather than crying doom and disgust 'cause it doesn't sound as exciting to you as it does to me and others...

[Infernix]

The autistic screeching in this thread is truly awe-inspiring.

[infinitemeridian]

The new zones look awesome, definitely a huge step up from what they've done in the past. Armour looks very interesting, expecting a lot of interesting sets out of this expac.

As long as it can keep the stuff in legion without the legendaries, annoying fel-theme, and some improvements PLUS the new stuff, this expac will be fine.

[anaxie]

think the best news out of the expansion is that the Heart of Azeroth Armor slots can't Titan forge. So thats 3 Tier pieaces that won't be infinite nightmare.

Do they plan to address proccing completely and add base sockets to those 3 primary armor pieaces too?

Why stop there heart of Azeroth should expansion to the 5 tradiational tier slots. nip Titanforging in the bud and eliminate one of the most tedious features in the game.

[Bigbazz]

The announcement sure didn't have a lot of meat to it, they didn't have a lot to show compared to Legion. But the ideas are good and the direction is in the right place, I thought some of the art and designs looked amazing. I'm done with big WoW investments though, and the general RNG trend only solidifies that... I will play as a tourist and then leave it to rot.

I suspect they have a lot of work to do before this is ready, maybe a late 2018 release say around November being optimistic.

[Arbs]

this website is so salty its unbelievable

That is how it always is though, those who are salty & bitter are always out in full force on here. They want to release the steam & let it be heard, which is alright & leave it there. Those who are excited or have any interest aren't on a forum. There enjoying Blizzcon or talking with their friends in their own social groups about Blizzcon & the annoucements.

This happens every Xpac announcement, the only exception was WoD cause of all the shit that just made it dreadful. I'm sure WoW Devs are disguisted with it too. Like Raids were the only good part of it cause that is all their really was.

I'm excited about Classic WoW, but I already experienced on Live & Private I know what is gunna happen in terms of what I'm getting into. But Battle for Azeroth I'm excited to see where the story goes & what Dungeons/Raid we get.

[sethman75]

That is how it always is though, those who are salty & bitter are always out in full force on here. They want to release the steam & let it be heard, which is alright & leave it there. Those who are excited or have any interest aren't on a forum. There enjoying Blizzcon or talking with their friends in their own social groups about Blizzcon & the annoucements.

This happens every Xpac announcement, the only exception was WoD cause of all the shit that just made it dreadful. I'm sure WoW Devs are disguisted with it too. Like Raids were the only good part of it cause that is all their really was.

I'm excited about Classic WoW, but I already experienced on Live & Private I know what is gunna happen in terms of what I'm getting into. But Battle for Azeroth I'm excited to see where the story goes & what Dungeons/Raid we get.

See the thing is that it's not like this at the announcement of every xpac.

I have seen them all and there is always a massive nerdgasm when the new xpac is announced.

This time around there is a major feeling of apathy and disappointment because it feels more like a DLC than a full blown expansion.

If you are happy with the lack of pretty much any major new features well good for you, you can play it until your eyes bleed but don't expect everyone else to be happy with such a poor showing.

[Arbs]

See the thing is that it's not like this at the announcement of every xpac.

I have seen them all and there is always a massive nerdgasm when the new xpac is announced.

This time around there is a major feeling of apathy and disappointment because it feels more like a DLC than a full blown expansion.

If you are happy with the lack of pretty much any major new features well good for you, you can play it until your eyes bleed but don't expect everyone else to be happy with such a poor showing.

No there is no this time, it is always this way. Cata, MoP, WoD & Legion all of them had the same complaints. An the next Xpac after BFA will be the same thing, even if Classic comes out around than.

Than come Alpha/Beta, it will shift to people wanting access & complaining about Content Creators getting it first.

[Exilian]

Maybe instead of blaming anyone you could recognize that you very clearly do not have the full picture? That you're working off a rough outline and framework of the Expansion rather than actually able to dig into the meat and potatoes of it, and instead of throwing around blame and recrimination you could wait 'til you see what the actual finished product looks like?

I dunno. Different things of that nature rather than crying doom and disgust 'cause it doesn't sound as exciting to you as it does to me and others...

But see the details of the expansion dont matter if the overarching concept is dislikable. I actually do think this could turn out to be a fun expansion, faction lore might be explored, the warfront could turn out cool, a few other small things here and there. But none of that matters if its design, its concept, is bad, and for me personally (and many other people judging by the half-hearted reactions on this and other forums) it is bad.

We were hoping for something great. Fans have created dozens of ideas with interesting and unique concepts, from South Seas stuff, to Void stuff, to underground kingdoms stuff, to Bolvar stuff, and all combinations in between. Instead, we got a bland faction war that MIGHT turn into something interesting by the midpoint, but why do that? Why push back the truly important, interesting stuff to midway instead of focusing on it from the start and letting faction war be an important background thread?

[Stormcall]

I’m not sure what isn’t interesting.

Scenarios coming back in the form of islands isn’t interesting?

RTS-like battlegrounds with 19 other people aren’t interesting?

Sub races that get their own quest lines aren’t interesting?

The war campaign isn’t interesting?

World quests throughout the entire old world aren’t interesting?

The long awaited leveling improvements aren’t interesting? This isn’t BfA specific but it was announced with BfA.

Getting to level up the heart of Azeroth neckpiece as well as 3 other pieces of armor isn’t interesting? It’s a new and improved take on artifacts.

New dailies like bounty hunting/assassination quests aren’t interesting?

Some of this stuff you might not like but to say that none of it looks good or interesting is pretty crazy. There’s a lot of new things here and there’s a lot of things that are big improvements from older systems. Even though we don’t have all the info like class changes, legendary system, etc the info we do have is very interesting.

1)Nope. Scenarios have always sucked, bringing them back is in no way a good thing.
2)I fucking despise RTS, so...still nope.
3)Mildly, but not really. I already have every class I care to play. I'm not interested in the subraces enough to level up a toon class I already have, or to play a class I've not previously had any interest in playing. So really, no benefit. It's like adding a new race for me, kinda cool just not something that really affects me.
4)Not in the fucking least.
5)Maybe. They're WQs so hard to find them that exciting. Putting them in older zones doesn't really count as something interesting though. It's like listing "new zones have daily quests!" as an new and exciting feature, rather than what it actually is, which is just adding an existing feature we've been doing for years to zones that didn't have them previously.
6)Possibly. We'll see. Still won't affect me much as I already have most classes I care to play leveled to 100 or higher.
7)Sounds like a crappier version of artifacts to me, not "new and improved". So no, not interesting.
8)Dailies can be interesting or not interesting, same as any other daily. But no, as first glance, they don't seem overly interesting.

[Niffo]

Hope they really tackle the classes, feels boring without changes.

[Phuongvi]

You know, after all, anything is going to be better than Argus.

[Steampunkette]

But see the details of the expansion dont matter if the overarching concept is dislikable. I actually do think this could turn out to be a fun expansion, faction lore might be explored, the warfront could turn out cool, a few other small things here and there. But none of that matters if its design, its concept, is bad, and for me personally (and many other people judging by the half-hearted reactions on this and other forums) it is bad.

We were hoping for something great. Fans have created dozens of ideas with interesting and unique concepts, from South Seas stuff, to Void stuff, to underground kingdoms stuff, to Bolvar stuff, and all combinations in between. Instead, we got a bland faction war that MIGHT turn into something interesting by the midpoint, but why do that? Why push back the truly important, interesting stuff to midway instead of focusing on it from the start and letting faction war be an important background thread?

Because the War itself is interesting to a ton of players. Do you have any idea how many people on this forum want to gut Sylvanas? And during last night's Q&A the devs were very explicit about how much players would enjoy "Fighting against enemy lore heroes" without flatly stating that the last tier of the raid would be us vs them.

We also -know- that Azshara and N'zoth are a huge part of this expansion. They've already told us she's in the raid tiering and the Sea Priests of Kul'tiiras are worshippers of N'zoth from top to bottom. We'll be going into raids to fight against the "Greater Darkness" beneath the waves that is responsible for the evils that have befallen the kingdom of the waves.

Pirates and Ghosts and Island Hopping and Old Gods and Kul'tiras and Zandalar and Azshara means we're getting a big chunk of what many of us have always wanted from the south seas. Sure we won't get the island of evil bananas, unless it's patch content, but holy shit, my dude...

This expansion is going to be the "Force Awakens" to WC2 and MoP, remixing some of the stuff we love together in a new way. Only maybe instead of everyone joining forces to gank Garrosh the Evil Orcnazi we might just wind up fighting each other's faction leaders in the raid tiers (And probably not N'zoth since I think they can squeeze one more expansion out of him and the Azerite by mingling things with Yoggie). I went into Blizzcon on the 8.0 speculation hype train (My name's on the left side of the final image) and came out of it still riding the hype train because of the very things you're lamenting.

[McFuu]

And this is expected of a multibillion dollar company releasing a game thats supposed to keep millions of people occupied for several years with a monthly subscription of 10-15 euros. But i get what youre saying, perhaps a personal attack on the devs being lazy was inaccurate. Whom do i blame then? The idea team? Fine, the idea team was being stupid, not the devs being lazy. The idea team came up with a lackluster story and gave it to the devs to make. Happy?

- - - Updated - - -



Clearly you know nothing of elven lore to make such an uneducated statement. The naga themselves are a race, granted, no more dangerous than humans, orcs, furbolgs, or nerubians. Its who leads them that counts, and the naga are led by who is possibly the most adept mortal mage in the history of warcraft, surpassing people like Medivh and Aegwynn (without the massive Guardian buff that basically gives them the power of 10 archmages), and she was this BEFORE she sucked the well of eternity like there was no tomorrow AND was blessed by N'zoth AND had thousands of years to hone her skill and make her army. She is literally the biggest threat Azeorth could face right now except for maybe N'zoth and the Void Lords

I'm well aware of the lore surrounding Azshara, but on the whole the Naga are a boring, not very compelling enemy. We've been smacking them around since vanilla, they show up randomly in zones that border the water, and we get a small quest hub to go and kill them.

Aszhara, regardless of her outright power, is completely void of motivation. Story and motivation can turn basically weak characters (power wise) into great enemies. Garrosh is a solid example, Defias Brotherhood in Wailing Caverns is another great example.

The most interesting Azshara had been was because she was connected to Prince Farondis' storyline. But she was way overshadowed by Farondis'.

Aszhara has been a "threat" since vanilla, and no one can really give a hairy ass fuck about her. Faction leaders don't really mention her, she doesn't present herself at all anywhere there are Naga. When there is a raid for Nzoth, guess who we will kill midtier, your girl.

[Otrew]

2 new pve game modes and 3 end zones at 120, im more concerned about having enough time. This forum is mostly salt

[Exilian]

I'm well aware of the lore surrounding Azshara, but on the whole the Naga are a boring, not very compelling enemy. We've been smacking them around since vanilla, they show up randomly in zones that border the water, and we get a small quest hub to go and kill them.

Aszhara, regardless of her outright power, is completely void of motivation. Story and motivation can turn basically weak characters (power wise) into great enemies. Garrosh is a solid example, Defias Brotherhood in Wailing Caverns is another great example.

The most interesting Azshara had been was because she was connected to Prince Farondis' storyline. But she was way overshadowed by Farondis'.

Aszhara has been a "threat" since vanilla, and no one can really give a hairy ass fuck about her. Faction leaders don't really mention her, she doesn't present herself at all anywhere there are Naga. When there is a raid for Nzoth, guess who we will kill midtier, your girl.

On that note i might even agree with you, but wow villains in general tend to be onedimensional. Blizzard is far from a great story teller or character designer, plus the MMO format isnt terribly conducive to telling an interesting, complex, novelesque story. Almost all the final bosses weve faced so far except for maybe arthas were completely one dimensional and most werent even mentioned in the lore before their expansion came, so i dont really thank clumping azshara in that group retracts from her usability as an expansion theme.

One thing which she does do, however, is introduce a biom that has gone largely ignored by blizzard so far, that is to say the ocean. Weve been to forests and jungles and mountains and caverns a million times so far, but only a handful of marine based explorations have happened, vashjir being the main one. That alone puts her as a good candidate for expansion theme.

- - - Updated - - -

Because the War itself is interesting to a ton of players. Do you have any idea how many people on this forum want to gut Sylvanas? And during last night's Q&A the devs were very explicit about how much players would enjoy "Fighting against enemy lore heroes" without flatly stating that the last tier of the raid would be us vs them.

We also -know- that Azshara and N'zoth are a huge part of this expansion. They've already told us she's in the raid tiering and the Sea Priests of Kul'tiiras are worshippers of N'zoth from top to bottom. We'll be going into raids to fight against the "Greater Darkness" beneath the waves that is responsible for the evils that have befallen the kingdom of the waves.

Pirates and Ghosts and Island Hopping and Old Gods and Kul'tiras and Zandalar and Azshara means we're getting a big chunk of what many of us have always wanted from the south seas. Sure we won't get the island of evil bananas, unless it's patch content, but holy shit, my dude...

This expansion is going to be the "Force Awakens" to WC2 and MoP, remixing some of the stuff we love together in a new way. Only maybe instead of everyone joining forces to gank Garrosh the Evil Orcnazi we might just wind up fighting each other's faction leaders in the raid tiers (And probably not N'zoth since I think they can squeeze one more expansion out of him and the Azerite by mingling things with Yoggie). I went into Blizzcon on the 8.0 speculation hype train (My name's on the left side of the final image) and came out of it still riding the hype train because of the very things you're lamenting.

Sure thats all well and good, and your argument basically boils down to "no this IS the south seas we wanted, and its also so much more!" but i cant agree with that. Put it to you this way. Imagine you had been a big arthas fan for ages, having played WC3 and thoroughly enjoyed his development, and now its TBC and youre hoping the next expansion will be about him. Theres datamined stuff to suggest it, theres tons of forum posts that speculate and fanficise about it. Then blizzcon comes, and they announce that the neutral city of shattrath was a bit of a mistake because it dulled down the faction war, so they want you to go back to orgrimmar and stormwind, prepare your troops, and begin waging war across the sea. In that war you accidentally stumble upon northrend in a patch, where you dispose of arthas probably as just an incovenient roadblock, and then get back at each other's throats.

Would ANY fan of arthas be satisfied with that? No box cover, no central story development, no wrathgate plot twists, no contient devoted to him, no argent crusade training grounds, no nerubian uprisings, nothing, just a single patch of content covering his entire wotlk story. Well thats exactly what theyre doing to azshara, so every fan of her has the right to be pissed at blizzard for their decision