My Only Concern for BfA: Lack of class changes

[MagusHenosis]

For the last 3 years the class design team has lost their minds. I felt the same disappointment as most posters here when they said there would be no big changes and that they liked the number of rotational abilities most classes had.

WoW is the only MMO I've played that has sweeping class changes every expansion, and from every perspective it's retarded. You risk losing the current players for a slight chance that a new player will come along and like the new design.

As someone who only PvP's, MoP was the best iteration of class design. Each class had 25+ unique buttons, with most having multiple ways to use them. Complexity abound. The skill gap between a 2200 and rank one player was crystal clear. Players who mastered their class could take on multiple players at a time and win.

Aside from removing abilities, removing playstyles is also really fucking dumb. I'm looking at you, SMF warrior, 2h fDK, glad warriors, and ranged survival hunters.

They really do keep messing shit up, but if you ask them???

The game is better than ever!!!

The fact that people are getting "free kills" on other specs, and that there is basically no balance at all???

Again, they think it's better than ever lol!!!

Lacking awareness much there Blizz???

Just saying YO......

[shaunika123]

For the last 3 years the class design team has lost their minds. I felt the same disappointment as most posters here when they said there would be no big changes and that they liked the number of rotational abilities most classes had.

WoW is the only MMO I've played that has sweeping class changes every expansion, and from every perspective it's retarded. You risk losing the current players for a slight chance that a new player will come along and like the new design.

As someone who only PvP's, MoP was the best iteration of class design. Each class had 25+ unique buttons, with most having multiple ways to use them. Complexity abound. The skill gap between a 2200 and rank one player was crystal clear. Players who mastered their class could take on multiple players at a time and win.

Aside from removing abilities, removing playstyles is also really fucking dumb. I'm looking at you, SMF warrior, 2h fDK, glad warriors, and ranged survival hunters.

to be fair, amidst all the shitstorm of class redesign, they occasionally strike gold.

like making combo points not stick to targets was one of the best things they've ever done to rogues, and that was in WoD lol.

if i had my choice of "expac to pvp in" I'd always choose Wotlk.

MoP had all that pvp power bullshit that just makes me vomit still.


but if we're talking strictly pve, MOST of what they're doing is actually going in the right direction., like for example as a rogue 2/3 of my specs became more complex in pve. and the third (sub) is more or less the same (maybe a tiny bit less complex, but much more versatile in return)

and if I'm honest i stopped caring about how they design pvp after wotlk has ended because, it was just one continuous downward spiral for me. They overbalance the game instead of creating a perfect imbalance like they had before, which makes all the classes shallow, and pvp has basially became about who pops the bigger cooldowns.

[Stickinator]

THey have said they are going to look into the tanking abilities and changes are coming to talents/spells.
Looking at the artifact, finding out what stays and what goes. Etc etc.

Not sure where you actually got the info about NOTHING will change.

Classes dont need MORE things. They need to fix the classes so the gameplay is good overall.
Just adding spells/talents willy nilly is a terrible choice.

But no, it wont just be the same spells etc as in legion.

[reimmi2016]

Wish they stopped their sweeping changes after mop then, almost every class i play was more fun then (hunter, rogue, monk)

[amishjello]

We will most likely not see any huge reworks (Like we saw for demo, surv, combat, etc) But they would be fucking dumb NOT to make tweeks to certain classes to make them smoother and not a huge mess. A lot of talents just need to be baked in, Like clawing shadows for unholy.

For example, Demo, I like the spec as it is, but demonic empowerment is just a huge cluster fuck. Just make it a buff you have to cast every 20 seconds or some shit, if that happened, I feel the spec would play a lot smoother.

[digichi]

Wish they had decided to not make sweeping changes after MoP instead of now. I actually liked pretty much any class I played back then and now its like something is just missing all the time. They went a little too hard on removing abilities across the board in the last couple of expansions.

Yeah, they've pruned too many abilities and some of the classes are feeling lackluster. I used to love all the hunter specs from wrath-mop. Survival is gone, which would be ok i guess, but BM/marks is just so different that i dont have fun playing hunter anymore :\

The most fun for me has been druid now (because cat plays almost literally the same since WoTLK and resto druid is in the same boat.)

I know its all 'don't fix it if it aint broke', but i like it when they shake things up for every expac. I wonder if we're gonna be left playing legion 2.0 for all of BfA or if they'll gradually make some changes.

[madokbro]

Then I'm guessing they'll tweak m+ numbers, otherwise there is no reason to run normal or hc.

[Khrux]

As someone playing Hunter this xpac, the lack of major class changes for BfA is pretty disheartening as I wasn't happy with the state of all 3 specs.

I think its fair to say they failed all 3 major overhauls at legion release - Outlaw, Demonology and Survival.

However over the course of the expac they created a pretty slick Subtlety spec and did some good work on Mage specs. My fear is that we'll just get more basic balance adjustments like what we get in a X.5 patch when some specs are just flawed from a design point and numbers won't fix them. Its not acceptable in my eyes that specs with 2-3 button rotations are allowed dominate entire tiers or multiple tiers, with overly complex classes are dumpster tier. They need to find a way to balance the scales in terms of rotational difficulty and balance everyone accordingly, nobody wants to be punished with les dps for playing an easy spec but at the same time who the fuck wants to play Survival, Windwalker or Feral if you getting rekt by Arms warriors or Havoc Dhs that are watching Netflix during raids.....

I'd love to say for the first time since Wrath, I'm not class changing in any xpac because there is less major changes coming, but in reality there is no chance I'm playing my Hunter in BfA with the clownfiesta that survival is, the brainless and shallow BM, with the vulnerable aimed mish mash of MM.

[Nyel]

If they're keeping most of the specs as they're now BfA will be dead on arrival. Most specs are so bland that I don't see any chance that they can be fun for another 2 years when they can't even offer fun in Legion anymore.

- - - Updated - - -

THey have said they are going to look into the tanking abilities and changes are coming to talents/spells.
Looking at the artifact, finding out what stays and what goes. Etc etc.

Not sure where you actually got the info about NOTHING will change.

Excuse me but what kind of changes should that be? Removing artifact traits and skills (or making some of them talents) doesn't change anything. Either it's going to stay as it is now or it's becoming worse when they remove all of your artifact gameplay.

[Deleted]

I'd hold out for beta before making assumptions, there will be class changes just not on a major scale (like the Survival revamp). Artifact abilities and traits will be baked into the spec either by passives, damage boosts, talents, etc and also the new gear system will add additional game-play options.

*nonsense*

FYI if you want people to take your opinions seriously then don't advertise your bias with that childish signature

[Coldfrostzero]

The rotation feels great right now, yeah. I love it. I have 4 piece. I have SotH. It's pretty fun. But what happens when we switch to T21 that basically gives a crappy version of TFoJ. Which, atm, doesn't even work with SotH? I don't want to turn this into a discussion about Retribution because the Paladin forum has threads for that but when you have to rely on a temporary tier set bonus and legendary for your gameplay to feel complete that is a problem to me. Without those the spec feels broken and maybe they should consider making some things that feel baseline... baseline...

They have in the past, and stated that they are considering on whether or not to make the change to BoJ (3 HP) a permanent thing since it does heavily fix the rotation, they have used set bonuses to test a change before (Remember Art of War proc?). This wouldn't be a major class overhaul, it would be a minor change and one that people at Blizzard agree with. What won't change is something like Holy Power going away or Spriests reverting back to orbs. I don't have every class to 110 yet, but of the classes I do, Arms warrior feels a little clunky in the rotation to me, it was bad in WOD when it came to execution phase, and its only gotten more awkward with so many spells playing off of each other.

[Athaldor]

exactly. /10 char

[Deleted]

Its my first concern too.
They have to bring back overwoper baseline with old sound effect with useful damage.

[Phyon]

If they can bring what the artifacts are doing for most classes into them I think most will work out ok. I like not having a huge class upheaval for once. It seems like every expansion has had to completely redo every class into something vastly different.

[shammypie]

As someone playing Hunter this xpac, the lack of major class changes for BfA is pretty disheartening as I wasn't happy with the state of all 3 specs.

I think its fair to say they failed all 3 major overhauls at legion release - Outlaw, Demonology and Survival.

However over the course of the expac they created a pretty slick Subtlety spec and did some good work on Mage specs. My fear is that we'll just get more basic balance adjustments like what we get in a X.5 patch when some specs are just flawed from a design point and numbers won't fix them. Its not acceptable in my eyes that specs with 2-3 button rotations are allowed dominate entire tiers or multiple tiers, with overly complex classes are dumpster tier. They need to find a way to balance the scales in terms of rotational difficulty and balance everyone accordingly, nobody wants to be punished with les dps for playing an easy spec but at the same time who the fuck wants to play Survival, Windwalker or Feral if you getting rekt by Arms warriors or Havoc Dhs that are watching Netflix during raids.....

I'd love to say for the first time since Wrath, I'm not class changing in any xpac because there is less major changes coming, but in reality there is no chance I'm playing my Hunter in BfA with the clownfiesta that survival is, the brainless and shallow BM, with the vulnerable aimed mish mash of MM.

shamans need an overhaul as well. The current iteration is clunky af. Elementals abilities are all over the place, Enhancement feels like an arcade game, and resto has always been feast or famine.

[Nyel]

FYI if you want people to take your opinions seriously then don't advertise your bias with that childish signature

I don't care if you can't discuss with me because of my signature. Disagree with what I wrote in my comment and not with anything else surrounding me because it has nothing to do with the discussed topic.

My signature is not biased and it's not childish. It clearly describes my feelings towards BfA and it's (abysmal) announcement + panels on Blizzcon.

[Taeldorian]

I don't care if you can't discuss with me because of my signature. Disagree with what I wrote in my comment and not with anything else surrounding me because it has nothing to do with the discussed topic.

My signature is not biased and it's not childish. It clearly describes my feelings towards BfA and it's (abysmal) announcement + panels on Blizzcon.

Well now we know they left out a lot of stuff at blizzcon for whatever reason.

They just now announced tier sets being removed which is a pretty big change. Maybe they were undecided about it until now but who knows what else there is that’s unannounced.

I’m assuming we’ll learn a whole lot more at gamescom/next blizzcon and interviews/dev posts in the next few months.

However, if they are undecided about certain things or don’t know if a certain system will make it into the expansion I’d rather they keep it unannounced. If they announce it people will expect it and then if it does get scrapped they’ll freak out like an idiot.

[gushDH]

If they don't change many aspect of the hunters, I am not coming back to wow. :/

[Teri]

Class changes can still come, they haven't gone into very detail of Azerite levels and Armor slot powers yet.

I just really hope the Azerite armor powers aren't 100% the same as old artifact traits.

[doot]

I just want Dispell back on Shield Slam.