Is a harder WoW better?

[Lilija]

none of that means anything in the current game. typing this out was easy, but then again i didn't use only my pinkies and write each letter in alt key codes so i guess i wouldn't know if it was easy or not.

I kinda don't get what you were aiming here at but let's assume...

So you want to say clearing the hardest content doesn't mean anything in game? As someone who is doing that all the time since Vanilla, I can tell, it's get more aprreciation in game nowadays than it used to get in Vanilla and TBC. At least I'm getting much more whispers about the gear I have or how well my performance is if I happen to pug something. In Vanilla and TBC there was far too much unhealty competition between people and completly pointless elitism that made it impossible for people to actually enjoy someone else's acomplishements. The funny part was that it's always the casuals and bad players that acted in the most elitist way back then :> Because they thought that having access to "exlusive" content makes them somehow special. Shame, skill wasn't needed for that...

[Lilija]

The community burns through content way too fast and people get bored too quickly.

After 10 years of experience, we are getting better much faster than devs can produce more difficult content. Even difficulty has its limits. I mean 10 years... that really long time to get really good at a computer game

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i certainly like difficult content, i like challenges... i mean what's the point of playing easy game?

to be honest, this game has been going downhill ever since sunwell plateau patch came along with welfare epics.

Becuase playing in TBC was somehow harder... eh... I'd love people opened their eyes and understand what challenge and difficulty mean. TBC offered nothing harder than some of the most difficult encounters in WotLK, Cata or MoP.

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A good argument for why things in WoW should be more difficult are those fucking blazing wings. Now that they've hotfixed it so that everyone has their own set of rings, half the people in every capital are walking around with the damn things on, and they just look awful.

I don't have them... Am I special?

[Revi]

I want WoW to be faster, harder












Scooter.

[Deleted]

I think it's fine as it currently is. Little Timmy can play for 4-5hrs a week and still clear LRF and get some crap gear and feel like he has accomplished something. Better players can walk around in their shiny mythic gear and look down on plebs.

[sfeeney37]

What's more difficult, mechanics requiring faster response times or coordinating the actions of a large group? Is it harder to farm resist gear for a month or to watch boss vids and remember the phases? Do you struggle more to get to max level or to max out your professions?

Do you enjoy your time spent playing?

[meheez]

I feel like theres so much chill content out there that it wouldn't hurt if the game went back to having some super hard raiding content exclusive to top raiding guilds. I'd love to see that.

[Azerox]

Make everyone see the content.

I like the new way of Mythic gear looking difference. In BC there was also T6 and the 'others' in T4/5.

So now everyone can see content, and u can see the difference in armor better between normal and hardcore players.

[melodramocracy]

After 10 years of experience, we are getting better much faster than devs can produce more difficult content.

No, you're getting content from devs who cater to a playerbase that demands things to be easy and / or quickly consumed. The prevalence of alts proves as much.

Actual challenging content tends to get screamed about, nerfed, and then it's onto the next topic. Place your bets now on silver PG requirements either being lowered or removed entirely, and a round of nerfs to heroic 5 mans by the time the first patch rolls in. They might actually stand their ground on the flying thing a bit longer.

But given that so many people seem more than satisfied with over a year of TI, (timer on Huolon?) and grinding frogs for tokens ad nauseam even 2 weeks before the next expansion drops, it would appear that casual players need far less content to keep them happy than initially thought.

[Lilija]

No, you're getting content from devs who cater to a playerbase that demands things to be easy and / or quickly consumed. The prevalence of alts proves as much.

I'm not speaking about below mythic content. That content isn't aimed at the most experienced players. I am speaking here about the hardest things there are in WoW. With each expantion they are harder than the previous one. Yet the best players in WoW will still storm thru that cause not much can really surprise them. Besides, those are people who learned how to adapt fast.

Actual challenging content tends to get screamed about, nerfed, and then it's onto the next topic.

Except for prepatch which always nerf content to the ground, since DS we haven't seen any nerf to whole Heroic content. There might have been single nerfs but they were more about tunning annoying mechanics (like some combination of Klaxxi abilities would one shot people no matter what if they were unlucky). So I dunno what are you talking about...

Place your bets now on silver PG requirements either being lowered or removed entirely, and a round of nerfs to heroic 5 mans by the time the first patch rolls in. They might actually stand their ground on the flying thing a bit longer.

1) No flying isn't a part of difficulty. It's a minor inconvinience. And the real reason for delaying flying in Draenor is that it gives Blizzard more time to finish fly only zones :P Not to mention that blocking it by a patch is highly anticlimatic. I would love flying in Dreanor to be reward of some lengthy and epic quest chain. Those who finish it fast should have it early. That would also make sense lore-wise.

2) If heroics aren't needed for people to enter LFR then they won't get nerfed. However, the ilvl of various gear I've seen so far is a bit worrying. I think heroic 5mans should give the same ilvl as LFR making it an option for additional gear for people who actually plan to raid. Then, there won't be any need for a nerf. Normal 5mans should be aimed at LFR audience.

3) You can get silver in PG with closed eyes so you know. Silver isn't supposed to be a challenge but only to check if you know your class. Tho I really hope Blizzard actually starts thinking about teaching new players their class :P

But given that so many people seem more than satisfied with over a year of TI, (timer on Huolon?) and grinding frogs for tokens ad nauseam even 2 weeks before the next expansion drops, it would appear that casual players need far less content to keep them happy than initially thought.

Last content was too long, sure. And noone denies that it was a mistake. Many people unsubbed somewhere in that time. Grinding frogs is a temporary thing. Noone really grinded those before 6.0.2 changes. I myself don't have to grind them cause I've spend months on the island trying to finish one of the most hardcore grinds in last content - http://www.wowhead.com/achievement=8728 (stupid crab!). I joke that 6.0.2 is a hidden reward for everyone who did that achie - I had 10k coins when the patch hit

Sidenote: for people who think there is no more time sinks and grind in WoW; there is plenty but it's mostly optional - and that makes them great. If I feel like grinding I do that. If I don't I just don't and have fun in raids.

[Aqueous]

I personally think it's a detriment and I've raided top tier until I quit (MoP).

The problem with difficulty in WoW is that for the vast majority of players it simply means the game demands more time of them. More planning, more gear, stricter raid composition (both in terms of classes, roles and players), pots, food, etc. And it's a game that already demands alot of time.

I personally don't think difficulty meshes well with MMOs. A raid group only ends up as strong as its weakest link and since there's a minimum of 10 players and a maximum of 30, that's alot of potential slots for a "weak link".

[DeadmanWalking]

Wildstar called, wants its subscribers back...

...and it's employees.

[bobo333]

if you've been playing since before wrath, go level a new toon. no hierlooms. go quest, go do lowbie dungeons, go farming for for mats in zones that are above your level. now tell me the pve game hasn't been dumbed down to insulting levels. why is there only a challenge inside of structured raid content? if i was a new player i'd be wondering what all the fuss was about and quit out of sheer boredom. the whole world flashes by until you hit cap, where you join a queue to aoe for loots. most of my favourite wow memories were from the learning process. now 95% of pve is snorefest, the last 5% you will have already beaten on a lower difficulty by the time you and your guild are ready for it.

that's why i haven't taken pve seriously in this game for years.

[DeadmanWalking]

Everyone wants the game tailored to thier wants and needs, you always want what you want and since you are you it seems logical that you should get what you want until you realize that nobody else is you and frankly doesn't give two shits about what you want.

The day that you realize that the universe does not revolve around you is the day you grow up and become a member of society.

[Lilija]

if you've been playing since before wrath, go level a new toon. no hierlooms. go quest, go do lowbie dungeons, go farming for for mats in zones that are above your level. now tell me the pve game hasn't been dumbed down to insulting levels. why is there only a challenge inside of structured raid content? if i was a new player i'd be wondering what all the fuss was about and quit out of sheer boredom. the whole world flashes by until you hit cap, where you join a queue to aoe for loots. most of my favourite wow memories were from the learning process. now 95% of pve is snorefest, the last 5% you will have already beaten on a lower difficulty by the time you and your guild are ready for it.

that's why i haven't taken pve seriously in this game for years.

When was the last time you leveled? After squish leveling content feels totally different. It's actually quite demanding without heirlooms now.

As for learning process. Throwin annoying stuff at people at low level won't work nowadays. It worked in Vanilla because it was still easier than other mmos on the market. To learn it's good to be able to figure out what you're doing wrong. WoW never even gives you a hint. You think people in Vanilla knew what they were doing at max level? I've actually lead a raiding guild back then I trust me - vast majority had no idea what they are doing. But the raiding content was easy enough that banging your head against the wall eventually worked.

The way leveling was back in the day would never work now for many reasons. It ain't perfect now. However, fixing leveling content to get more smart challenges would requre a lot of resources, which Blizzard recently seems to lack in terms of such a big project as an mmo. And we've seen what happened when they focused on leveling content at the cost of end game - it was called Cataclysm: the most hated expantion in WoW. Even tho there are many aspects that could be improved in non end game, it's the end game that is expected by most of people therefor it's where Blizzard's focus mostly lies.