Iran and The United States

[anywherenotes]

No source, no context.

Sure sounds like you just want to believe it.

Also I'm not saying Ahmedinejad isn't an idiot, but he can't and won't attack either Israel or the US. That's my point basically.

You could have just googled it:
http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/me...6/ahmadinejad/
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/wo...6iht-iran.html

[roflpot]

The "west", and in particular, the US of A and Israel, would give the so called axis of x a hearty shoeing if it ever came to conflict. Occupation of American soil is about as likely as me becoming the king of England.

[semaphore]

You could have just googled it:
http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/me...6/ahmadinejad/
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/wo...6iht-iran.html

He says a lot of things. Whether he will actually do them is a different question. What people tend to forget is that he is also a politican, and like all politicians, he says what he has to to get put in power. His support base hates Israel; so he panders to that attitude. Doesn't actually mean he'll be stupid and/or crazy enough to try. Trying to argue that he will is fearmongering.

Unlike Nazi Germany, Iran is not an industrialised Great Power with remotely close to the sort of military and economic strength to pose a danger to the world. Hell, they couldn't even defeat Iraq.

[Shakadam]

So contradictory as well. If Iran gets a Nuke on its hands with out a doubt it will bomb Israel. There go a million people. By your logic we should do all we can to prevent this....but that would include invading the country. But we cant do that? Jesus sir, you created a paradox.

So you know this for certain then do you?....
Iran is not a country run by terrorists, despite what many americans think. They're decently educated people and know fully well what consequences a nuclear attack on Israel would have (All major players on the political field would have no choice but to condemn such an action and it would probably lead to a NATO invasion). They know this, they aren't stupid. The hate speech against Israel they splurt out now and then is only to soothe the more radical wings of islam, nothing more.
The only reason Iran wants a nuke is to have some form of leverage if it comes to that, I can't imagine living under a constant threat of invasion from the world police (pun intended) is very fun.

[Deleted]

So what we should not be discussing the real political issues but instead predictions what would happen based on video games?

You seem to be forgetting that Iran probablly doesn´t give a shit about Israel, they just need a common enemy for Iran so the people forget about turning against the leaders.

[Deleted]

You could have just googled it:
http://edition.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/me...6/ahmadinejad/
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/26/wo...6iht-iran.html

Funny how you're linking to only american/western media. I can't say it's wrong, as I really don't know. I just think you should not take it as a final truth. Media pick out some lines that fit into their (or their government's) interest, no matter where, how, or in the worst case IF they really have been said and other media just take it over from them aswell. Also don't forget that everything he says first gets translated for you to understand, and these translations are most likely very overdrawn versions of what he really said.

[Vhoosh]

Theoretically speaking should a war with Iran break out they would have no allies except for possibly the Hamas faction in Palestine. They would face a combined force of major NATO countries, Israel, the Saudis, and possibly Japan. Russia and China wouldn't interfere for fear of losing valuable trade partners, and because of big daddy China keeping out N. Korea would also do nothing.

[Primernova]

He says a lot of things. Whether he will actually do them is a different question. What people tend to forget is that he is also a politican, and like all politicians, he says what he has to to get put in power. His support base hates Israel; so he panders to that attitude. Doesn't actually mean he'll be stupid and/or crazy enough to try. Trying to argue that he will is fearmongering.

Unlike Nazi Germany, Iran is not an industrialised Great Power with remotely close to the sort of military and economic strength to pose a danger to the world. Hell, they couldn't even defeat Iraq.

This is why I and others, feel that it is just a matter of time before they put their heads together and pull some crazy move. I live in the 'rust belt' of the US, the place where we turned out the vehicles and aircraft that won many wars. Those factories are rusted relics now.

In a guerilla war, we always lose. In a full scale, "World War" (East Vs West) we would lose to lack of industrial infrastructure.

If the east could pull a surprise out of their hat like we did with a stealth bomber and then used vast manpower, it could get ugly, very quick.

[sdracklryeg]

Funny how you're linking to only american/western media. I can't say it's wrong, as I really don't know. I just think you should not take it as a final truth. Media pick out some lines that fit into their (or their government's) interest, no matter where, how, or in the worst case IF they really have been said and other media just take it over from them aswell. Also don't forget that everything he says first gets translated for you to understand, and these translations are most likely very overdrawn versions of what he really said.

If you put the quote in, with quotation marks so google only looks for that exact quote, you get around 50,000 hits. I'm very confidant you'd find non western sources if you sift through it all.

[Deleted]

It's kinda funny you'd even consider putting China in there - China doesn't do a lot of business with Iran, is in favor of peaceful development and has extremely close economic ties to the US. You're oversimplifying stuff, mate, simple as that. A government often won't simply attack a different government simply because they don't like them. War is nothing to think lightly of.
Also, you left out Israel. If the US has 1 ally in a war against Iran, it's probably Israel. We all know their army is trained extremely well, so, even though their numbers might be low, they are still a force of great power. You also shouldn't underestimate Iran's special forces - they mean serious business.

War is just not an option for many of the nations on your list. Most people still remember WW2 or have heard about it and will simply try to avoid GROUP OF NATIONS A vs GROUP OF NATIONS B scenarios. IF there's going to be a war, I doubt it's much bigger than US/Israel vs Iran. Economic and medical support on the other hand... In case of a war (I don't hope there will and I think both sides are just blowing air), many countries will probably supply things like medicines and money for either side, because everyone still has a favorite, but eh... most countries will just try to stay out of a war like that.

[Heythere]

Actually nevermind, I can't be bothered with another "US is the greatest country on this planet" thread and flamewar.

[minteK917]

Theres no WW3 in the forseable future. The economic situation of every country cannot go along with it, china and russia would be foolish to even take part in it. To start a world war you need an economic power to start it, a country with power to speak of. Iran has none, it has support for now. But once a war start by a small unpowerful country, with nothing to gain the super power will take off and support will be gone, specially china in which is economical power relies so heavily on the west.

The technological situation is also way different then ww2. Germany had access to military technology beyond those of the country around it and where the first to use them fully until middle of the war. Germany was the greatest european power at the time. The economical growth with hitler was staggering, they build the Luftwaffe so big it could rival that of the brits in only a couple of years.

Even with all its might Germany could not hold an attack and occupation over sea(failure in uk).

Iran does not have shit to start a war. Just like ww2 was not initiated by italy or japan. These lesser countries will follow super power in their wars, not the other way around.

[Tripl]

I am sorry but you are a moron. I original post is only beaten by your own ignorance.

Shall i post a link on wars italy have been involved in going back 2500 years? Or shall i post a link of Greek and Macedonian wars going back 3000 years?

I am not American, I have no more love for them than any other contry in the world but you are just as ignorant or more ignorant than the OP.

No, you should link wars of Italy, Greece or what ever country in the same era as that of the U.S. He was not being ignorant, at most incomplete for not referring to another country to compare with. I think he is trying to make his point for the US to be a 'Warmonging' country.
Making a comparison, since the WOII:
France: 14 wars
US: 30 wars. (counting 'The War on Terror', including the Iraq and Afghanistan invasions as 'one' war)

The US has done more wars in the past 50 years then any other country, however, it is for us to discuss wether this is normal behaviour of a superpower or not. Is it called a superpower if it doesn't intervene constantly?

[ati87]

Iran already has nukes they just can't build them.

Enough country's that either sells those things or place it in other countries.

[Primernova]

It's kinda funny you'd even consider putting China in there - China doesn't do a lot of business with Iran, is in favor of peaceful development and has extremely close economic ties to the US. You're oversimplifying stuff, mate, simple as that. A government often won't simply attack a different government simply because they don't like them. War is nothing to think lightly of.
Also, you left out Israel. If the US has 1 ally in a war against Iran, it's probably Israel. We all know their army is trained extremely well, so, even though their numbers might be low, they are still a force of great power. You also shouldn't underestimate Iran's special forces - they mean serious business.

War is just not an option for many of the nations on your list. Most people still remember WW2 or have heard about it and will simply try to avoid GROUP OF NATIONS A vs GROUP OF NATIONS B scenarios. IF there's going to be a war, I doubt it's much bigger than US/Israel vs Iran. Economic and medical support on the other hand... In case of a war (I don't hope there will and I think both sides are just blowing air), many countries will probably supply things like medicines and money for either side, because everyone still has a favorite, but eh... most countries will just try to stay out of a war like that.

China has it's hand around the throat of the US, it's growth is 100% on the backs of our jobs and instead of telling our rich, corperate Dbags to stop dealing with them, we just keep pumping them up...

The Chinese are not stupid and using greed aginst the citizens of the US that are only out for quick money, is a good plan. I just don't want to be on the short end of the stick.

Trading plastic crap for cash and national debt with an obvious enemy is very dangerous.

[Mavett]

Theoretically speaking should a war with Iran break out they would have no allies except for possibly the Hamas faction in Palestine. They would face a combined force of major NATO countries, Israel, the Saudis, and possibly Japan. Russia and China wouldn't interfere for fear of losing valuable trade partners, and because of big daddy China keeping out N. Korea would also do nothing.

Add Syria and Hezbollah to the allies list, granted syrian army is a joke, the only mild threat is Hezbollah with the sheer amount of Grad rockets.
you're correct about Russia and China, they condemn any military action against Iran in Public but all for it behind closed doors, in order to keep trade relations.

the conflict is kind of unavoidable it's just a matter of time now.

[lolo855]

So contradictory as well. If Iran gets a Nuke on its hands with out a doubt it will bomb Israel. There go a million people. By your logic we should do all we can to prevent this....but that would include invading the country. But we cant do that? Jesus sir, you created a paradox.

---------- Post added 2011-11-13 at 12:44 PM ----------


And Israel will get hit by missiles from Iran.

You are a complete idiot, Iran will never nuke US or Israel, you think some idiot will really just throw one bomb on a country when they know they just get thousands back ??

<Infracted> Don't flame other users

And I never said we should do all we can neither did I say we should invade them, certainly not, so no paradox for you sir...

Your saying without a doubt they will bomb israel while you don't even know shit, The only reason Ahmadinejad is 'taunting' the US is to prove they can't decide whatever they want anymore, and the only reason the would want a nuke is to prevent US from attacking them, forcing them into diplomacy. Unlike you may think Ahmadinejad is a very smart man and very well educated.

And like I said before the way he reasons is why should US be allowed to have nukes and they don't, and there he is absolutely right, why should one country which have a history of violence and war be allowed to have a weapon so powefull to decide over entire humanity's faith.

[Eduardo]

No. There is no interest at all in completely destroying whatever remnants of our economy currently exist.. China go to war with the west and destroy 2/3 of their economy? For what reason exactly?

Things are a lot different today then at any other time. I really dont see this global war scenario realistic any longer. We are all in this together now.

[semaphore]

This is why I and others, feel that it is just a matter of time before they put their heads together and pull some crazy move. I live in the 'rust belt' of the US, the place where we turned out the vehicles and aircraft that won many wars. Those factories are rusted relics now.

In a guerilla war, we always lose. In a full scale, "World War" (East Vs West) we would lose to lack of industrial infrastructure.

If the east could pull a surprise out of their hat like we did with a stealth bomber and then used vast manpower, it could get ugly, very quick.

Depends on who you mean by "east". Since you were quoting me talking about Iran being weak, I'll assume you mean Iran, in which case there is no conceivable scenario where Iran militarily defeats the United States. The power disparity is simply too great.

If you mean China, then it's harder to call. The United States is still an industrial powerhouse, and more importantly, maintains the most sophisicated arms industry in the world. China's ability to cheaply manufactuer low tech consumer goods does not guarauntee a Chinese victory when a US-Chinese war will be fought in the seas and in the skies, where American technological advantage is decisive. The exisitng F-22 fleet is capable of decimating the entire, and heavily aged, Chinese Air Force. The US 7th Fleet can wipe out the few Chinese warships even capable of operating on the high seas.

Not to mention the strategic advantage the US possesses. Any war will be fought on China's doorsteps, and can bring overwhelming air power to bear against China's vulnerable coastal cities. China knows this and won't risk a military confrontation when it is effectively defenceless in the air.

It's a bit of a moot question though since China and the US are both nuclear powers and so will hardly be suicidal enough to risk a direct military confrontation.

[LoLcano]

some ppl here play too much call of duty i think...
and lol at put Japan on US side ..like they can ever forget hiroshima xD

I dunno but as far as i know ppl in Iran are against their government..u heard of Green Movement and those stuff...so there wont be real war...ppl not gonna fight for the government they hate and oppose