Egypt new problems

[sam86]

http://www.shorouknews.com/news/view...5-484cc3b9290b
Arabic Link
The tyrant council captured and tortured members of the famous 6april youth movement, one of main movements that was against the old (current still :/) tyrant
25Jan is the day we live or die, but we will be free

[sam86]

A complete army assault on an engineer living next to me who NEVER went to any protest or anything because he parked his car in place of an army officer, they used the drop troopers from sky on the roof and balcony where he live because he ONLY took parking slot of an army officer.
Can't wait for judgement day of them
Muslims Brotherhood - probably the organization that suffered the most from the tyrants of this system - are now unofficially anti revolution after promised of ruling that a 3year old know the tyrant council will NEVER keep it, I regret that I one day was one of their big supporters

[sam86]

Sunday an attack with white weapons (knives, daggers, etc.) was made on group of protesters who were showing video in streets of the lies of the tyrant council, 3 were hurt
Sunday an attack with fireworks (of festivals, not bombs) was made on a conference of protesters discussing what they should do against tyrant council
Muslims brotherhood deals are more and more known, their trash is shown to - sadly - only the public who follow the news up to date (ie: rebels)
Stage not clear at all what will happen, but most people agree if 25jan pass without any action, it is the death of what was the dream of freedom
25Jan I'll go Tahrir square, what will happen there I'll share them the fate

[sam86]

Our current (very old) prime minister, Kamal El Ganzory, his son in law is the agent of Hussein Salem, the worst business man in Mubarak era
So now he has 11minister who should go to jail in his credit list from his ex-era during Mubarak days (9 in jail, 2 escaped country), and now his daughter's husband must go to jail to add to his achievements

[Deleted]

You know, the more I read about your revolution and about what your leaders do... I can't not think about my leaders who do similar things only much more hidden, I mean they don't shoot people on the street or throw poisoned gas. However they do arrest and frame people who are not on their side, beat them, put their people in key positions, get the money to them by funding fake firms who build parks (the ones with trees) in forests and gyms in agriculatural old people villages.

Yesterday there were demonstrations against the president, a guy who's more and more authoritatian. People got on the streets and the law people, the jandarmerie(not sure how it's called in english, sort of like the french have too) beat the people who protested peacefully and let the violent people destroy the middle of town so that today the minister of foreign affairs, who is considered the negociator, to say everyone is a hooligan who protested. Fortunately no people died (yet, during the protests yet I mean, as because of their reforms many died already of hunger and cold and not having hospitals anymore) so our situation is not exactly the same... but I do understand it somewhat.

Also, what's with 25th january there? I saw you mentioned it.

[Iron Dome]

You know, the more I read about your revolution and about what your leaders do... I can't not think about my leaders who do similar things only much more hidden, I mean they don't shoot people on the street or throw poisoned gas. However they do arrest and frame people who are not on their side, beat them, put their people in key positions, get the money to them by funding fake firms who build parks (the ones with trees) in forests and gyms in agriculatural old people villages.

Yesterday there were demonstrations against the president, a guy who's more and more authoritatian. People got on the streets and the law people, the jandarmerie(not sure how it's called in english, sort of like the french have too) beat the people who protested peacefully and let the violent people destroy the middle of town so that today the minister of foreign affairs, who is considered the negociator, to say everyone is a hooligan who protested. Fortunately no people died (yet, during the protests yet I mean, as because of their reforms many died already of hunger and cold and not having hospitals anymore) so our situation is not exactly the same... but I do understand it somewhat.

Also, what's with 25th january there? I saw you mentioned it.

Which country? Romania?

And January 25th is the anniversary of the Egyptian Revolution, I believe, and they want to fight for their freedom again on January 25th to replace the Muslim Brotherhood.


By the way, it appears to me that the leading Egyptian president Amr Moussa has some common sense. what do you think?

[sam86]

What I think? I won't tell you my opinion, I'll tell you the words of one of 6april co-founders who was at Mohamed Mahmoud street during the bloody events
"I'll vote for Hazem Salah Abo Ismail, I don't care if he will make us islamic country, I don't care if he will make it Secularism or Christian country, that man was with us when we took the chemical gas, shared his fate with us, when others were sucking it up for military council or best of them was only "twitting" (twitter message, he meant Baradey btw) to his boys while he was sleepy comfy in his warm bed at his luxury home"

[vizzle]

I haven't read this thread in a while, but I'm glad to see that you're still alive sam.

[Iron Dome]

What I think? I won't tell you my opinion, I'll tell you the words of one of 6april co-founders who was at Mohamed Mahmoud street during the bloody events
"I'll vote for Hazem Salah Abo Ismail, I don't care if he will make us islamic country, I don't care if he will make it Secularism or Christian country, that man was with us when we took the chemical gas, shared his fate with us, when others were sucking it up for military council or best of them was only "twitting" (twitter message, he meant Baradey btw) to his boys while he was sleepy comfy in his warm bed at his luxury home"

Thanks. I really don't know any of the candidates running, and only knew Amr Moussa because he was the leading one, so looked into some of his views.

The Media Line takes a look at Egypt's military's strangehold on the economy:

Concrete information on the extent and holdings of the army’s business operations is difficult to come by. The armed forces are secretive but have portrayed themselves and the government generally as poor and hemorrhaging money. In the case of the government, that is certainly the case, but in the case of the army that is less evident.

In one of the most unusual intra-government transactions of the year, the military loaned the central bank $1 billion to help support the sagging Egyptian pound last month. The transaction not only pointed up the relative wealth of the two institutions but also the extent to which the army has access to money beyond the reach of the civilian authorities to whom it is supposed to be reporting.

Amr Hamzawy, a political analyst and newly elected member of parliament, estimates that the military controls as much as a third of Egypt’s economy. Paul Sullivan, a U.S. National Defense University professor and expert on Egypt’s military, told Time magazine last year that the military accounts for some 10% to 15% of the economy.

Mohamed Kadry Said, a retired general and a military analyst for the Al-Ahram Center for Political and Strategic Studies in Cairo, puts the figure at 8% of gross domestic product, a seemingly small percentage but, in Egypt’s $180 billion economy, one that puts the annual turnover of Egyptian Army Inc. at more than $14 billion.

As Egypt moves on its rocky road toward democracy, observers say the army’s efforts to preserve its business interests are likely to be a major barrier. More democracy will almost certainly entail more accountability and perhaps a direct assault by the country’s civilian politicians and economic reformers on the military’s economic power and privileges.

Many doubt that the generals will relinquish power so quickly. Among those is Mohamed ElBaradei. who announced over the weekend that he had dropped out of the presidential race, saying he saw no hope that the election due by the end of June would bring a real end to the military's rule.

“They use their businesses to maintain their power now more than ever. They own restaurants and tourism companies, so for the leadership today, stability and crushing the opposition to their rule is paramount to maintaining their wealth,” Ahmed, a former general who asked that his name not be used, told The Media Line.

...As an institution, the armed forces own and run much of the food industry, including plants manufacturing olive oil, milk. bread and bottled water – all of which are subsidized by the very government they are in charge of.

They also run a number of cement factories, gas stations and refineries, clothing and kitchen facilities, vehicle production – one local newspaper reported the military is in partnership with Jeep to produce Cherokees and Wranglers – as well as resorts and hotels.

Since February last year, the role of the military and business has become more visible and controversial. All these industries, says economic analyst Gamal Abdel-Salam of CS Securities in Cairo, lead to a conflict of interest.

“The military runs all these companies, factories and tourist destination spots, and now is in charge of the government, so it means they are giving money out and supporting industry that in essence they are already in charge of,” he says.

Topping it off, military businesses are free from government oversight and are not required to pay taxes, which Abdel-Salam says means that as the government gets poorer, “the military and its leaders are getting wealthier, so why would they want to leave power if they are winning on all sides?”

Abdel-Salam contends that the generals “see an opportunity to push forward without fear of government oversight, because they are the oversight and that is why they are silent on their role in the economy.”

....Overcoming wealth and power in Egypt may be difficult to achieve, even if a new constitution – which the military wants to ensure contains no oversight over its budget and income – is established in the next few months. Indeed, for the former general the revolution that toppled Mubarak is starting to look like the one that toppled King Farouk in 1952 and inaugurated nearly six decades of military rule.

“What we are seeing,” he says, “is Egypt’s military taking a very Soviet-style approach to things and one we have seen before, in the 1950s with Nasser and look how that turned out for the country.”

The military is also looking into propaganda, according to Al Masry al Yasoum:

Egypt’s military leader Field Marshal Hussein Tantawi has ordered the formation of a committee of high-ranking army generals tasked with ensuring the Egyptian armed forces are given positive media coverage.

The new body — to be called “The National Military Media Committee" — will be comprised of 11 generals, and will be responsible for providing information about the military to journalists to counteract what the armed forces considers “biased coverage.”

Sources told Al-Masry Al-Youm that part of the role of the committee will be to give the military's account of any future events that take the media spotlight, particularly those that involve armed forces personnel.

The sources, however, didn’t elaborate on how the new body would be different from the existing Morale Affairs Department of the Egyptian military, which is currently headed by Major General Ismail Etman.

---------- Post added 2012-01-17 at 01:26 PM ----------

By the way what exactly are you guys planning on January 25th, as I haven't read anything about it.

[Deleted]

Which country? Romania?

And January 25th is the anniversary of the Egyptian Revolution, I believe, and they want to fight for their freedom again on January 25th to replace the Muslim Brotherhood.

Yes, Romania. And thanks for info, didn't know.

What I think? I won't tell you my opinion, I'll tell you the words of one of 6april co-founders who was at Mohamed Mahmoud street during the bloody events
"I'll vote for Hazem Salah Abo Ismail, I don't care if he will make us islamic country, I don't care if he will make it Secularism or Christian country, that man was with us when we took the chemical gas, shared his fate with us, when others were sucking it up for military council or best of them was only "twitting" (twitter message, he meant Baradey btw) to his boys while he was sleepy comfy in his warm bed at his luxury home"

I don't know the candidates, but you should take care of this, because some people like to try and help not by being on front lines but by diplomacy and as such they won't be seen amongst protesters and whomever will be voted might change things for better or for worst. When my president was voted, he promised more work places, more funds for health system, a reform of education, more liberty. He was there amongst the people when we voced our concerns against the gouvernment at that time (which wasn't perfect, no gouvernment is perfect, but still was better then this one) and so people voted for him... now what happened is the exact opposite of what he said, and he hides in his Palace with his ruling party while members in power call us worms and filth for going to protest, while the geandarmerie throws tear gas and beats people who were peaceful because they can't(or don't want to) catch the hooligans.

This might happen there too, from a place where they beat you on the streets to a place where they frame fake crimes on you if you're against them and nothing will change... so take care who gets to rule.

[Iron Dome]

Yes, Romania. And thanks for info, didn't know.

Tragic, Romania is one of the European countries I actually like. it's a great country with clear headed rational people. I wish you the best.

[sam86]

I haven't read this thread in a while, but I'm glad to see that you're still alive sam.

Thank you, but my date may be next Jan25

Hazem was shot by the toxic CR gas, he literally was going to die with the rest of us, tbh if I could, I'd invite all world scientists to study the egyptian men and women who were shot by chemical gas and are still alive (while it sound funny, it is really very weird we are still alive), no one is ready to die in order to be a tyrant ruler, Mubarak "air strike" was actually in Sudan, he never went in 73 war in Egypt, he never fought any real enemy, his air strike was against peaceful protesters as usual, it seems our army men are very "manly" against weaponless protesters
Iron Dome where are you from and where you live now pls? If you don't want to publish it pls pm me then, you know too much for what I assume a eu-us forums

What we plan? Exactly the same as last year, except this time no come back until civilian ruling council take leadership of Egypt (the 2nd request of 2011 jan25 revolution)
What I plan? Ahmed Harara, a protester who got blind (lost his right eye jan25, his left nov18) said if you see Tahrir square full of people I'm between them, if there is only one I'm this one, if there is no one I'm dead
I'll make sure he won't die before me

It may sound weird but I feel guilty I'm still alive, many died all around me and I'm still alive, they died for a goal I didn't achieve it yet for them, I'm not better than them to stay alive and they die

Last year during Jan25 events many died burned alive (the camel combat), I hope I'll have to luxury when I die to just die by gunfire, one shot one kill

Our tyrant ruling council is far dirtier than I thought, every 3 months they brake all toilets in the military college to get renewed by a ceramic factory, "surprisingly" it is owned by none but the wife of one of the generals who is ruling Egypt now

[Iron Dome]

Iron Dome where are you from and where you live now pls? If you don't want to publish it pls pm me then, you know too much for what I assume a eu-us forums

What we plan? Exactly the same as last year, except this time no come back until civilian ruling council take leadership of Egypt (the 2nd request of 2011 jan25 revolution)
What I plan? Ahmed Harara, a protester who got blind (lost his right eye jan25, his left nov18) said if you see Tahrir square full of people I'm between them, if there is only one I'm this one, if there is no one I'm dead
I'll make sure he won't die before me

It may sound weird but I feel guilty I'm still alive, many died all around me and I'm still alive, they died for a goal I didn't achieve it yet for them, I'm not better than them to stay alive and they die

Last year during Jan25 events many died burned alive (the camel combat), I hope I'll have to luxury when I die to just die by gunfire, one shot one kill

Our tyrant ruling council is far dirtier than I thought, every 3 months they brake all toilets in the military college to get renewed by a ceramic factory, "surprisingly" it is owned by none but the wife of one of the generals who is ruling Egypt now

Yeah I'll PM you, I don't want to disclose that info here.

And who are you protesting against? The military council? The Muslim Brotherhood? Or both?

[sam86]

I'm protesting against injustice and tyranny and anyone who helping that to stay
I'm not protesting against military council and muslim brotherhood, i'm protesting against anyone who agrees on their ideas, to name some others: some (not all) leaders of the Salafy movement, some of liberal people who try to kiss tyrant council feet to get anything, the pop Shnoda who is with the tyrant council (that mass slaughtered lot of christians in one of worst combats in 2011, Maspero events), the azhar leader El Tayeb who said Mubarak will go to heaven

Anyone who try to bring injustice I'll be against him

[Iron Dome]

Apparently, the military council thinks they never beat protestors.

Jimmy Carter: The military council hasn't beaten protestors.

"Tuesday morning we received detailed analyses by experts on the election process and political affairs, and then had a thorough discussion with Field Marshal Mohamed Hussein Tantawi, head of the SCAF and acting as de facto president of Egypt.

I was received with a friendly welcome as I congratulated the military leaders for what seemed to be a successful election, and then asked a number of questions. It seemed that the SCAF had full confidence that there would be accommodation to their demands by the Muslim Brotherhood and their coalition partners as the new government is formed. Instead of the reported 12,000 mostly political prisoners being held for trials in military courts, the Field Marshal stated that there were no more than 3,000, all of whom were guilty of criminal acts and being tried in civilian courts. He stated that the widely promulgated videos showing military attacks on demonstrators and a woman "with the blue brassiere" were all falsified. He said the soldiers were actually helping the woman re-clothe herself with what was provocative attire."

If this is true, which it is not, then the are some very very good video animators to make the event look so real!



Carter, of course, continues with his reign of idiocy and foolishness, and doesn't doubt the military council.

[sam86]

I'm sure the muslims brotherhood won't do any good short term or long
About 100000 christian who run away from Egypt, I'm thinking there is a lot of death happened, specially to christian, we are talking about the tyrant military council, the rulling party, the president, IS anti-christian and used all his power to make them hated in Egypt, while it was for me the key point that something is wrong (before it I stopped caring for politics and went home, like many, stupidly believing everything will be all right), my best friend is christian, my neighbor is christian, they never were going out in streets trying to kill anyone who oppose them, on reverse, Egypt has black history of muslims doing that (not christians) back in 1990 era, also many people say that it was government doing that in order to control the rising muslims brotherhood (and I believe that)
Well our system is anti anyone who want justice, and don't even think about freedom

[sam86]

Tomorrow may be the restart of last year's dream
Our congress started today, with many weird situations that aren't important, the important thing, they thanked our tyrant military council for "protecting" the revolution, and thanked Tantawy in name
Now I feel at edge of defeat
They thanked the people who abused, raped, tortured, killed, squashed, electrify, burned us, blinded us.
Well they did do a lot to be "thanked" for.
Tomorrow our birth as free country or my death

[Kissoon]

What about the gang raping of the news journalist ?

With all the protests over here for the G20 and occupy events most of the brutality was by the police, and no females were gang raped in contrast to that place.

[Elenion]

how can rubber bullets be forbidden? One would think that they are preferred to the sharp ammunition that was used in Libya

Rubber bullets can still kill people

[sam86]

What about the gang raping of the news journalist ?

With all the protests over here for the G20 and occupy events most of the brutality was by the police, and no females were gang raped in contrast to that place.

Sorry don't understand what you typed? Can you rephrase it please ?