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  • Sargeras

    364 58.80%
  • Old God forces

    255 41.20%
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  1. #281
    Quote Originally Posted by Dasani View Post
    Sargeras has been way too overhyped by people who really know nothing about him.

    It's been said that the old gods are stronger than any of the titans, the only reason the titans could do anything with the old gods in the first place is because they worked together to deal with each one and the old gods didn't work together. Sargeras may be the strongest of the titans, but he is no match for an Old God.
    Old Gods have been way too overhyped by people who really know nothing about them.

    It's been said that the Titans are stronger than any of the Old Gods, the only reason the Old Gods could to anything to the Titans in the first place is because they worked together to deal with a common enemy.

    Joking aside, you need to read up on Sargeras and Old God lore.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    There are different kinds of strength besides combat capabilities. One could say Sargeras was the weakest Titan because he fell into a brooding depression and doubted their mission.
    I think it needs expanded upon that Sargeras' skills are strictly combat-based (along with being able to manipulate fel energies due to his transformation, allowing him to empower people). If we are talking about pure destructive power, Sargeras is the most powerful. If we are talking about intellect and magical ability, Norgannon is the strongest.

    I think it also needs to be said that the Pantheon only had two members that were versed in combat, the rest had aptitudes in other areas (generally pertaining to the creation of something).
    Deathknight's do it using disease, blood and the power of the unholy. Warlocks do it with dark demons by their side. Mages do it with summoned arcane powers. Druids do it using the forces of nature. Rogues do it through stealth, poison's, shadows and....from behind. Paladins do it by calling to the light for aid. Shamans do it with the help of the elements. Priests do it through the holy light.
    But warriors....
    Warriors just fucking do it.

  2. #282
    lol where are people coming up with this Nzoth business. All we know is he wasn't killed and he went into hiding. He could have gotten his butt kicked and pulled a rogue and vanished and ran. Or I guess in an old god's case submerged deeper(oceanically). Nowhere in any current lore does it say his strength or that the titans COULDNT beat him. With Ysharj they learned their lesson about killing old gods since the land was corrupted so they contained instead.

  3. #283
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    The Titans are not gods.
    Well they where supreme being.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Sargeras left the Pantheon long before they fought the OG on Azeroth.
    Yes on azeroth. But there are more than only OG in azeroth. But the biggest point is that the demons where with a very big number that darkened worlds (the nathrezim atleast) or OG who only take one world. (atleast those of azeroth)


    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    There are different kinds of strength besides combat capabilities. One could say Sargeras was the weakest Titan because he fell into a brooding depression and doubted their mission.
    Well yeah but he was the most noble of the titans so. Maybe in mind he was the weakest but not with force

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    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    lol where are people coming up with this Nzoth business. All we know is he wasn't killed and he went into hiding. He could have gotten his butt kicked and pulled a rogue and vanished and ran. Or I guess in an old god's case submerged deeper(oceanically). Nowhere in any current lore does it say his strength or that the titans COULDNT beat him. With Ysharj they learned their lesson about killing old gods since the land was corrupted so they contained instead.
    Finaly someone who I can agree with

  4. #284
    Quote Originally Posted by purebalance View Post
    Nowhere in any current lore does it say his strength or that the titans COULDNT beat him.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Where is N'Zoth? He was mentioned at Blizzcon, then was talked about in Dragon Soul. What is going on with him?!
    N'zoth is still lurking. The Titans couldn't defeat it... maybe someday we'll get our chance? Don't expect to hear anything about him in Pandaria, though! (Source)
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    Quote Originally Posted by OscarPP View Post
    Well they where supreme being.
    Titans were never gods. Ever.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Also, the benevolent titans, though not gods themselves, cast a magical slumber upon the Old Gods and imprisoned them far below the surface of the world. (Source)
    Also, not even gods are supreme beings in the Warcraft universe.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Gods are neither omniscient nor omnipotent. ... It is possible for a god to exert influence over several locations simultaneously. Yet the power of a god is limited. Otherwise, of course, the Old Gods could not have been imprisoned. (Source)

    Even godhood itself is no guarantee of superior might. Consider the titans' defeat of the Old Gods. The titans are not gods, but their vast power allowed them to imprison the Old Gods far below the surface of Azeroth. (Source)
    Quote Originally Posted by OscarPP View Post
    Yes on azeroth. But there are more than only OG in azeroth. But the biggest point is that the demons where with a very big number that darkened worlds (the nathrezim atleast) or OG who only take one world. (atleast those of azeroth)
    Sargeras was only ever mentioned fighting demons while he was in the Pantheon. Nothing says he ever fought Old Gods.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  5. #285
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Where is N'Zoth? He was mentioned at Blizzcon, then was talked about in Dragon Soul. What is going on with him?!
    N'zoth is still lurking. The Titans couldn't defeat it... maybe someday we'll get our chance? Don't expect to hear anything about him in Pandaria, though! (Source)
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    Titans were never gods. Ever.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Also, the benevolent titans, though not gods themselves, cast a magical slumber upon the Old Gods and imprisoned them far below the surface of the world. (Source)
    Also, not even gods are supreme beings in the Warcraft universe.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Gods are neither omniscient nor omnipotent. ... It is possible for a god to exert influence over several locations simultaneously. Yet the power of a god is limited. Otherwise, of course, the Old Gods could not have been imprisoned. (Source)

    Even godhood itself is no guarantee of superior might. Consider the titans' defeat of the Old Gods. The titans are not gods, but their vast power allowed them to imprison the Old Gods far below the surface of Azeroth. (Source)

    Sargeras was only ever mentioned fighting demons while he was in the Pantheon. Nothing says he ever fought Old Gods.
    While Sargeras is a god and titan so yeah, The great dark god of the Nameless Void resolved to destroy the fledgling world and claim its energies as his own.

    Also it would be very unlikely if he fought OG in his life because he doesn't seem to care about them if he destroys a planet. It is possible but I don't believe he ever faced one of them duo his bad knowledge about them.
    Last edited by OscarPP; 2013-12-08 at 08:28 PM.

  6. #286
    Quote Originally Posted by OscarPP View Post
    While Sargeras is a god and titan so yeah, The great dark god of the Nameless Void resolved to destroy the fledgling world and claim its energies as his own.
    That was from the WC3 manual which stated that the titans were gods too. The Titans, colossal, metallic-skinned gods from the far reaches of the cosmos. So by extension Sargeras was also a god. However, that stuff was retconned by the WoW encyclopedia, as I linked, that explicitly states the Titans are not gods.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  7. #287
    Opening a portal to the home realm of the Old Gods and dumping Sargeras into it would be a grand way to end his threat. It would leave the possibility open that he could survive by endlessly fighting the purest expression of the chaos he proclaims to loathe, and it avoids the problem of trying to find something that can actually kill him.

  8. #288
    Epic! Sainur's Avatar
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    I think Sargeras would obliterate them just by farting.

    Then he would imprison their remains.
    "The sword is mightier than the pen, and considerably easier to kill with."

  9. #289
    Sargeras, what what!!

  10. #290
    Elemental Lord Haven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dathadr View Post
    Sargeras, he was the one who helped imprisoned the old gods in the first place
    It was not Sargeras, but the whole Pantheon. Now he would be alone against them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Metzenphrenia. As defined in the DSM: "To be so badly written, that it drives the character into insanity." It's symptoms are similar to schizophrenia but even crazier.
    "There are no answers, only choices" - Solaris.

  11. #291
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dathadr View Post
    Sargeras, he was the one who helped imprisoned the old gods in the first place
    Sargeras had already gone corrupt when OGs were imprisoned on Azeroth.

    That's why, he didn't know Azeroth existed, before the Nelfs started to abuse WoE...

  12. #292
    Quote Originally Posted by Golden Yak View Post
    Opening a portal to the home realm of the Old Gods and dumping Sargeras into it would be a grand way to end his threat. It would leave the possibility open that he could survive by endlessly fighting the purest expression of the chaos he proclaims to loathe, and it avoids the problem of trying to find something that can actually kill him.
    Everything points to the Old Gods being a fairly isolated problem.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haven View Post
    It was not Sargeras, but the whole Pantheon. Now he would be alone against them.
    Shouldn't be too hard a fight, seeing as C'thun was almost killed by a low-ranking titan or titan construct (the latter of which is more likely).
    Deathknight's do it using disease, blood and the power of the unholy. Warlocks do it with dark demons by their side. Mages do it with summoned arcane powers. Druids do it using the forces of nature. Rogues do it through stealth, poison's, shadows and....from behind. Paladins do it by calling to the light for aid. Shamans do it with the help of the elements. Priests do it through the holy light.
    But warriors....
    Warriors just fucking do it.

  13. #293
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolretadin View Post
    Everything points to the Old Gods being a fairly isolated problem.
    That's just what they want you to think.

  14. #294
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lolretadin View Post
    Everything points to the Old Gods being a fairly isolated problem.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Shouldn't be too hard a fight, seeing as C'thun was almost killed by a low-ranking titan or titan construct (the latter of which is more likely).
    Can someone pleaze state the source where it says that C'thun is defeated by a titan cosntruct

  15. #295
    Quote Originally Posted by OscarPP View Post
    Can someone pleaze state the source where it says that C'thun is defeated by a titan cosntruct
    Skeram's prophecy says it was a Titan, but that is a subjective telling of events by someone unfamiliar with Titans. Many people thought the Titan Watchers were actual Titans.

    According to Mogu legend, the Mogu themselves killed the Old God Y'Shaarj. But being a legend, the accuracy is also debatable.

    The logic is that if 2nd tier Titan constructs (not even Watchers) can supposedly kill Y'Shaarj, it is unlikely that a full Titan would lose to C'Thun.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  16. #296
    Quote Originally Posted by TheAmazingFeedz View Post
    I think this pretty much explains it all. A united Pantheon barely won over a divided Old God force.

    There you go folks, Old Gods win.
    Yep. I don't even know why this is a debate. I thought it's been made pretty clear all along that Old Gods are more powerful individually.

  17. #297
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    Yep. I don't even know why this is a debate. I thought it's been made pretty clear all along that Old Gods are more powerful individually.
    Only because the Titans weren't trying to kill the Old Gods. If all they wanted to do was win, the Titans could have killed the Old Gods and destroyed Azeroth.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  18. #298
    Quote Originally Posted by Raizenyokai View Post
    Old Gods. Without a shadow of a doubt. Sargeras can be killed, Old Gods cannot be killed, not because they are immortal, but because they are directly tied to the very stability of Azeroth itself. To destroy the Old Gods would mean the destruction of the very planet. Sargeras had neither the strength, nor the foresight, like the rest of The Pantheon, to stop the Old Gods from doing this when they first visited Azeroth. Here's some nice info dealing with the most powerful of them all, N'zoth.

    When Malfurion finally awoke from the Emerald Dream with the help from Broll and Thura, it is remarked, "When Malfurion Stormrage contained the Nightmare within the Rift of Aln, he sensed an "ancient evil" that was keeping its foothold in the Emerald Dream from somewhere beneath Azeroth's oceans."

    Source: http://wowpedia.org/N%27Zoth

    From Krasus: "Krasus speculated that should the Old Gods open the gates of their prison, even Sargeras would find himself pleading for the peace of death."

    Also about Xavius: "Although the Nightmare Lord in the dream turned out to be the Satyr Lord Xavius, it is suspected that he acted on behalf of a power even greater and darker than Sargeras."

    Source: http://wowpedia.org/Old_God

    They are the complete embodiment of evil and corruption. Sargeras is a mortal, just like the Old Gods. He can die, be corrupted (which he was slowly corrupted over the countless millenia of fighting against demons. So even Sargeras had a breaking point to where he couldn't handle his duties anymore.), and be slain. He is powerful, but the Old Gods are unflinching in their desire to corrupt and dominate all life. Unlike Old Gods, Sargeras' death would not destroy all life and the planet, as Old Gods are directly linked to the world. The Titans found this out when fighting them. C'thun and Yogg-Saron are not "dead", but instead, their husks have been beaten, while their existence lives on. C'thun and Yogg-Saron are still fully able to be resurrected.

    Also, it should be noted that all the various demonic races of the Legion are controlled by corruption and dominance. The Old Gods are the living embodiment of these forces, and are capable of overpowering even Sargeras' magic in doing so. If the Legion was to come to Azeroth in full-force, it takes only a whisper from an Old God to dominate all of them, therefore stripping Sargeras of his power. Sargeras is simply the main antagonist, because he is a tangible enemy that can be dealt with.
    I stopped at the bolded part, because that is just wrong and shows you have no knowledge of the subject.

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    On this topic people are forgetting that the Titans never really tried to kill the Old Gods on Azeroth. They wanted to preserve the planet, not destroy it. They have killed a lot of old gods in the past, so they knew killing the old gods would destroy the planet. They fought to weaken and then contain the old gods. Killing them would have been way faster and way easier. Sargeras was not present during the fight with the Old Gods. Sargeras was the most powerful titan. It has been hinted that the Pantheon collectively is weaker than he is currently. Old gods are no match for him from any real standpoint.

    To the people saying "But the old gods and their followers thought they could kill Sargeras"....Seriously? I'm pretty sure that is an extremely common mindset to have in competition. I always thought I could beat anyone, even if realistically I had no chance.

  19. #299
    Quote Originally Posted by Torgent View Post
    I stopped at the bolded part, because that is just wrong and shows you have no knowledge of the subject.
    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    Last edited by Larynx; 2013-12-10 at 08:44 PM.

  20. #300
    Quote Originally Posted by Larynx View Post
    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."

    http://wowpedia.org/Herald_Volazj

    A number of Faceless Ones have similar quotes.

    http://wowpedia.org/Mindbender_Ghur%27sha
    http://wowpedia.org/Erudax
    Blizzard has been quoted before as saying the Titans have killed many of them. Killed.

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