Illegally downloaded games 'up 20% in five years'

[Rhammy]

"The number of illegally downloaded video games has gone up nearly 20% in the last five years."

Know what else has gone up by 20% in the last five years?

Prices of video games. I used to pay $60-65 for a game on the day it launched. Now it's 80.

Know what else has gone DOWN by up to an undefinable percentage? Quality of video games. Most stuff that's currently released, I wouldn't buy it until I can get a used copy for 15 bucks.

It's pretty hilarious seeing them talking about how they think they're already providing games for a fair price. I mean, how badly can they be disconnected from reality.

Personally, I'm also from the line of thinking that "I try it for free, and if I like it, I'll buy it." That applies to games, movies, anime, and the rest. If piracy is such an issue for these people, they should try to 1. Make sure what they offer is worth the price you pay, and 2. provide some way to get a preview of what the hell you're selling so your customers know if they're throwing their cash by the window, or if it's actually worth it.

Where I live, you can go to the Mercedes or Audi dealership and they'll let you try out their brand new models even though they know you probably can't pay for one, for Christ's sake.

[Hedleyazg]

What this person said about pirating for the sake of trialing them, and then buying the ones he likes.. that is the purpose of demo's. In the case of some games, like Skyrim and Batman Arkham, i could not find a demo prior to their release. Bought both but I can see why someone may have pirated to try it out. All games costing over £30 should really have a demo available imo.

But overall its all a big excuse really, stealing is stealing. If you haven't paid you have no right to play it regardless of any thoughts you may have about the companys policies, ethics or prices. You wouldn't walk into a store, take a chocolate bar, eat it and say "i would have bought it if it were cheaper" which is essentially what pirates are doing.

Most games do not have demos anymore. As for the bit about the chocolate bar I suggest listening to this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCk9Cheiqqg

[Biohazardx]

Like, I'd love to buy SW:TOR but at $60 for the game and then the $15 sub? Fairly steep, that's worse than WoW (WoW and its expansions have never been over $40 that I know of, unless you get the CE) and Rift. Honestly, when games are so damn ridiculously expensive, $60+ (they have been for a long time I know) people are less likely to buy them I think and if they can get the game free, they're more tempted to, but look at Portal... that was a killer game and could have easily been sold for more but at $10-20 they made a TON of sales.

I don't think price is a valid arguement. 15 years ago people were paying $70 to $90 for SNES RPGS like Final Fantasy III, Chrono Trigger, and Earthbound when they were still brand new. Factor in inflation and that value in todays terms would be around $100 or more a game. We are actually paying around 1/2 now what we were paying back then for a game. You should be thankful that games are still around the $50 to $60 mark.

[Rennadrel]

Come to think of it, say the average album costs $15 and contains 10 songs. That means my music collection is worth around $11,000. People love their music but asking them to spend that much is plain stupid.

If you buy digital music it's 8-10 bucks an album, and I have somewhere around 250 albums, even 2,500 dollars is extreme for most people. Mind you this is coming from a guy who owns copies of a lot of albums on CD as well and some on vinyl too. But hey, if you love something that much, you should be willing to pay for it.

[Brittany]

Most games do not have demos anymore. As for the bit about the chocolate bar I suggest listening to this - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCk9Cheiqqg

I see what he's saying but he is comparing downloading a single to stealing someones handbag. Downloading is a crime against a company and will always be lesser to a crime where there is an innocent victim. Instead compare downloading Skyrim illegally to going into a game store, taking a copy of skyrim, putting it in your bag and running out with it. Its exactly the same thing, the only difference is the risk is far less behind your computer than it is going into a shop. You're essentially stealing still, you've just eliminated the risk of being caught by security, cameras, clerks or passers by which makes it easier for you to do.

I have no issue with anyone who pirates, but really everyone is making excuses. Pirating is stealing and morally and legally wrong, regardless of any reasons or beliefs for doing so.

[Runenwächter]

i dont walk to work because there are trains and cars
i dont crap in a hole because there is a toilet with water
i dont die of tetanus because there is medicine
and i download movies because there is internet and filesharing

all those things significantly improved my living standarts and while i am not blind to the fact that my actions are not without consequences, i have to admit that simply because someone else is worse of because of me i wont stop what im doing.
some kid in afrika dies because i donate my worn clothes to charity who sorts the clothes and sells those that they dont need to a contractor who exports them to africa, dumping prices and destroying the local industry, making 200k people loose their jobs. and i still donate it to ease my conscience. and i eat chicken, where mass production causes leftovers to be exported to the furthest corners of the world, destroying local chicken farmers. its still delicious and i dont care.
some systems work that way. it doesnt mean i dont get to have my chicken and give my clothes to charity, it means the system is fucked up and needs to be changed.

build a system where you can actually see a justified and equal distribution and you will get people to give a damn. if you, on the other hand with an increasing social rift between poor and rich, fail to establish easy and legal access to media, you will not succeed. didnt work on alcohol, doesnt work on prostitution, doesnt work on drugs. wont work on filesharing either.
remember: media is a carrier for social and cultural values and opinions and therefor access to it is necessary to partake in culture and society because through media change in values and opinions as the everpresent constant of a society is distributed. shuting people out from their access to this based on financial inequalities is neither natural nor productive because it damages society as a whole, because you create people who (cannot or do not) are left behind in this exchange and therefore isolated. this estranges people and causes further rupture.
not that hard to understand is it now?

[Comby]

yay piracy says I.
Buy games that deserve it, liek skyrim and what not.

[Rennadrel]

Going to have to agree with the drunken Norwegian here. Statistics have always been something to laugh about, especially when it comes to something illegal like this. The question comes to mind, how do they know illegally downloaded games are up 20%? The only way I could figure they could so easily get that sort of information is if in secret they hosted all the torrent sites and got their information that way, but that is such a ludicrous idea I can't believe I even just typed it.

The statistic is dumb and fake. Enjoy your booze.

I think if these companies are so worried about their profits, they can make it so the only way you can play is on one of their servers like with WoW and other MMORPGs, while some people have hosted WoW servers "illegally," Blizzard was still able to crack down hard on them.

I kind of like how Iron Maiden has always been about their music, they don't care that people record their concerts, they just ask that you buy their albums and support them, if you are able to, they just want people to enjoy themselves.

Like, I'd love to buy SW:TOR but at $60 for the game and then the $15 sub? Fairly steep, that's worse than WoW (WoW and its expansions have never been over $40 that I know of, unless you get the CE) and Rift. Honestly, when games are so damn ridiculously expensive, $60+ (they have been for a long time I know) people are less likely to buy them I think and if they can get the game free, they're more tempted to, but look at Portal... that was a killer game and could have easily been sold for more but at $10-20 they made a TON of sales.

I need more coffee, I'm losing my train of thought, if you could tell. o.<

I think you have to take the game development into context though. You have to look at things like building gaming servers, and all the initial startup just to get an MMO going, plus you are comparing a game with a newer graphics engine and more advanced programming involved in designing the game, WoW is still running off computers with hardware 4 or more years old. 40 dollars might seem cheap by today's standards, but in reality it takes a lot less design effort to make a WoW expansion then it does to make a brand new game like Star Wars: The Old Republic. I think as time goes by, and when Blizzard decides to release a new version of WoW with a completely new game engine, you will see the cost of that franchise go up.

Sometimes game companies also realize that certain games, like Portal, are worth only a certain price because they only have one play type. Team Fortress is the same way, it's just online only.

[Tygrion]

I see what he's saying but he is comparing downloading a single to stealing someones handbag. Downloading is a crime against a company and will always be lesser to a crime where there is an innocent victim. Instead compare downloading Skyrim illegally to going into a game store, taking a copy of skyrim, putting it in your bag and running out with it. Its exactly the same thing, the only difference is the risk is far less behind your computer than it is going into a shop. You're essentially stealing still, you've just eliminated the risk of being caught by security, cameras, clerks or passers by which makes it easier for you to do.

Not it isnt exactly the same thing. Downloading an illegal copy is the same thing as someone going into the store, magically making a copy of the product on the shelf and walking out with the copy. it doesnt remove anythign from the seller/victim's stock, doesnt stop other people from buying the legitimate copy. And as a lot of people said, a large number of pirated copies arent 'lost sales' because the pirate wouldnt have bought a proper copy anyway for various reasons. In my case I download a lot of American TV shows because they simply arent availble in New Zealand - but on the other hand I go watch all the new movies in the cinemas.

To suggest that downloading an illegal copy of something is a equal crime to physically robbing someone is ludicrous - Im nopt saying it is 'right' to download, but they simply arent the same.

[shruikan2553]

I dont pirate myself but I can see why people do it. I dont think they can say that every pirate is a lost sale, picking out numbers say:

100 games bought
100 games pirated

The game has restrictive DRM,10 people who bought the game also pirate it to get by the DRM leaving 90 "lost sales" because those 10 had actually bought the game and are just using the pirated version to make things easier for themselves.

There wasnt a demo, 20 people pirate, 10 decide they dont like it and delete it, 10 keep it. This leaves 80 pirated games, 10 were def lost sales.

10 are 10 year olds who only get games for birthday or christmas, have no source of money themselves so with a bit of googling come across the pirated version, they werent going to buy the game, I have games from steam that I only bought because they were 2.50, if they werent that low in price I wouldnt of gotten them, you cant get any lower in price than free, some people might not be interested enough in a game to deem it worthy of the money and the only reason they have it because it was free, if they had to pay $60 for it they wouldnt have gotten it. This leave 70 pirated games.

Im sure theres other situations but with my made up numbers out of 100 games, 70 were actual "lost sales" to the company. Also they say piracy is up 20% but if sales are also 20% higher then there really isnt any difference, its like saying there are more people in prison in the US than there is in prison in Ireland, ignoring the fact that the population is also a lot bigger in the US

[Meleti]

To suggest that downloading an illegal copy of something is a equal crime to physically robbing someone is ludicrous - Im nopt saying it is 'right' to download, but they simply arent the same.

Which is why they're different crimes, of course. Pirating a game is stealing intellectual property. The best comparisons are probably companies stealing each other's designs and then selling knockoffs; compare it to buying fake Viagra off of a Slovakian pharmacy on the internet, maybe (except in this case your product is slightly more likely to work properly).

I really do wish people would be more honest about why they steal games, of course; more "I don't see why I should pay for a product" and less "This DRM requires an internet connection, guess I have to pirate!"

[Drunkenvalley]

You sound slightly like you're implying that everyone pirates a lot, Aphorism. At least to me.

Of course, that might not be the case, but to make a case in point: The only things I've pirated for the last few years have been products that wouldn't work without a metric ton of horsecrap (GFWL games strike me as particularly likely targets), or which were extremely inconvenient to obtain (certain music featured in anime, for example).

If I get more trouble with Windows authentication process despite a legit product I'll probably give up too.

[Xuvial]

I really do wish people would be more honest about why they steal games, of course; more "I don't see why I should pay for a product" and less "This DRM requires an internet connection, guess I have to pirate!"

But requiring a constant internet connection to play is ridiculous. Pirating has indirectly made itself more popular because it's actually offering an EASIER way to play the game rather than buying it.

[Runenwächter]

ubisofts assassins creed 2 i believe was a prime example of that.
i can reluctantly agree on activating a product ONCE when i install it, but thats the absolute limit. i dont want a social network account to be mandatory, when i play a SINGLEPLAYER game.
also not everyone lives in a place where constant, stable and cheap access to broadband internet is available. i live in germany and even here, in central europe there are spots on the map where you just loose out on that.

[mmff4]

You've shared a pirated game for 2500 people. Those 2500 people have each shared that same pirated game for 2500 additional people. You're now responsible for 6252500 (6,2 million) illigally downloaded games. The total amount of money Greedy Gaming lost is 6252500 * $59 = $368897500 = $368 million.

Congratulations, your life is now officially ruined.

Steam has done what game houses should've done years ago. Setup an easy way to purchase games. All that is missing from steam is the possibility to add hard copies or order hard copies of the games through steam. I'm sort of a game collector and I'd like to have physical game copies in my bookshelf, but I don't like to hassle with DVDs everytime I want to install a new game. Steam gives me the opportunity to just download the games I want. Just like piracy does. Altho, I have to admit that Steam is one hell of DRM, but how many of you actually think of steam when someone is speaking from DRM?

[Zephasaurus]

Part of the issue that should be brought up is the utter crap that some of these games are. When a company takes a console port and then brings it over to the PC where it is utter crap never worth the $60 that they want to charge I see the point in grabbing the game for free from somewhere. When you have a game like skyrim or BF3 that is a quality product people will pay for it. There is no reason not to if you love the game and want to support it.

It is interesting that MW3 is brought up in the discussion with piracy quite often because of how popular the game is right now. I still disagree with the whole franchise because I dont ever want to give a company $60 for a game that looks just like the last one with the same shit in a different package. I am not hating on the game itself because I have played MW and MW2 but I just dont see any personal justification to promote the company if on a whim I want to waste my time with the game.

[Meleti]

also not everyone lives in a place where constant, stable and cheap access to broadband internet is available. i live in germany and even here, in central europe there are spots on the map where you just loose out on that.

I have broadband internet in my cabin in the middle of the mountains. In the western United States, which compared to central Europe is still in the dark ages of internet providers. I own Assassin's Creed 2. I play it in the mountains. Things seem to work out alright.

Reports of your lack of internet access are greatly exaggerated.

Besides, you can just choose to not play the game if you don't like it. You don't have some obligation to steal a game just because you don't like a certain aspect of it. It's a nonsensical argument in its very simplest form.

[Drunkenvalley]

Reports of your lack of internet access are greatly exaggerated.

What. So because you do have access to internet, everyone around the world surely do, yes? This is a tremendously poor counter.

Besides, you can just choose to not play the game if you don't like it. You don't have some obligation to steal a game just because you don't like a certain aspect of it. It's a nonsensical argument in its very simplest form.

What kind of argument is that? We shouldn't not play games that we like because the DRM is donkey balls? That's a nonsensical argument in its very simplest form, if you will.

[Meleti]

What. So because you do have access to internet, everyone around the world surely do, yes? This is a tremendously poor counter.

If you're in the Democratic Republic of Congo, my condolences.

But as you appear to be in Norway, like most of the rest of the world you have consistent access to at least some form of internet access. If it were 1990 I might be inclined to agree that internet access isn't a fair requirement, but it's actually 2011 and the internet is very much commonplace these days (especially among people inclined to play games on their PC).

What kind of argument is that? We shouldn't not play games that we like because the DRM is donkey balls? That's a nonsensical argument in its very simplest form, if you will.

That's how the market works. You don't like a product, you don't buy it, companies like Valve notice you don't like it and offer better DRM or no DRM at all. You aren't entitled to steal something because you don't like some aspect of it.

[bigjenk]

Actually, Blizzard very rarely crack down on private servers. There was often no need either.

The whole private server market had its neck snapped in the transition from BC to WLK content. Most of the big core server software that were popularly used were open source, but somewhere along the line of WLK development they just plain died off, so the open source projects were never maintained and suddenly everyone had to make their own stuff to get it to work.

How it works today I'm not sure of, but during large parts of WLK the core software that most servers used were custom-made and closed-source for WLK content. This didn't really help the market in any way, and massive instability issues were more than happy to further dropkick them out of function for long times.

TLDR is that Blizzard never really made any big punches against the playerbase for playing private servers, nor did they really make any big attempts to pursue the private server market either. If anything ever killed off the private servers it was the multitudes of problems in keeping the server running.

That's only loosely relevant to piracy though.

Blizzards more pirated but overlooked game is wc3 by a long shot. Approx 14 million dota users 95 percent of whom never purchased the game, not to mention the popularity of the game itself in SEA and Russia both of which are notorious for piracy.