What made Naxxramas epic?

[Chickensoup23]

Alright, here's a topic brought to my attention by a fellow guild member frequenting MMO-C as well.

We always see threads about people commenting how huge instances were king (and they were), such as Ulduar, Molten Core, AQ40, Black Temple, Serpentshrine Cavern, Karazhan, Zul'Guru or even Icecrown Citadel, to a certain degree. Now we thought, those couldn't be the only instances that were that much more epic. Well, we thought; what made some smaller instances that much more epic than the rest of similar size?

First idea that came to mind was Naxxramas. If you think about it, it's really not that big, it's not open, bosses aren't THAT creative (compared to some of the more recent ones which are much more complicated), there's "too much trash", sets aren't very pretty, ambience is nothing compared to, say, Karazhan or Black Temple, yet the dungeon remains one of the most loved ones out there.

I experienced it to a certain degree at level 60, and my guild got up (but did not down) Sapphiron. I spent a considerable amount of time in there with a group that I believed would not go anywhere but in which I would have fun nonetheless. When it got revamped at level 80, I wasn't even against it, and I still enjoyed it, getting all the metas and "easy-hard modes", which kept my semi-hardcore guild busy for most of the tier (admit, there were LOADS of chieves in there, more than most places, cept Ulduar).

Now, what made Naxx different? What made it so much better than others in that segment? Also, try to think of HM-Obsidium Sanctum vs HM-Throne of the Four Winds, or other few-bosses instances. Which did you prefer, and why?

Here's the time to express your opinions, AND DON'T HATE. If you don't agree with something, explain your reasoning in a civilized manner. Thanks!

Have fun,
Chicken

EDIT: I am ALSO talking about the level 80 Naxxramas. Had some fun in there. Both 60 & 80.

[PenguinChan]

The level 60 version wasn't pugable, no one ever could complete it besides a select few when it was current. And nostalgia glasses make it THAT much more memorable.


Hell, I was only raiding MC at the time and any time someone mentioned naxx I shivered at the thought of being in t3, killing kel'thuzad.

Mainly freshness, being new.

[ThatInternet]

The original Naxx was epic because:

- it was a flying citadel
- it pioneered the scourge event that was rehashed for wrath
- It debuted deathknights
- The lore of the ashbringer was brought into play
- Lights hope chapel's quests culminated finally into the raid setting the groundwork for dailies and future raid quest zones.
- the 4 wings offered a choice to players (similar to MC, but very direct and apparent from the get go
- The boss mechanics were very complex for their time
- the coordination for trash clearing was medium-high difficulty(as opposed to DS trash which is basically, we'll do this for 10 mins without thinking)
- Legendary Staff quest was unique at that point(splinter system)
- the Plague wing gauntlet was terribly unforgiving
- that 18 slot bag you got
- Saphirron boss fight was quite exciting in vanilla, so was kel

Mainly it was epic because it was a breakaway from MC and BWL. It was hard but added alot of new boss mechanics to the table.

In the end it was considered good enough to be an entry raid two expansions later with few changes. Though at that point after TBC raids, it felt dated.

[Swingthang]

My first real max level raid was Naxx 10. I was not allowed in vent because I was new to the guild, so they didn't want to potentially allow in the "wrong" people, just in case. All fights were explained in /ra or /w. I did not have any addons. I did not have any experience beyond 5 mans. I remember using the ingame stopwatch thingy to time Patchwerk's enrage timer.

We started at noon. After a few breaks/random afk's.... we cleared Construct wing cept for Thaddius, all of Spider wing, and part of Military in about 8 hours.

Despite how fail I realized it was about a month later, it was the most epic thing in a video game I had ever done. 10 people killing giant monsters? Fuck yes.


tl;dr? nostalgia. /shrug.

[ghostprotocol]

why would you refer to the level 80 version as epic. it was horrible.

[dhupp]

I think the revamped Naxx was so good because we got to run it for 7 months. Players really got the chance to take in the raid and all it had to offer. I'm lying.

[Deleted]

In each x-pack there should be an EPIC raid in the end of it, for true hardcore people like Naxx in Vanilla or Sunwell in TBC.
After ICC in Woltk there was Ruby Sanctum but no1 really like it.
Now in Cata there should be N'zoth raid (or something like that), with only 1 level of difficulty and that would be normal, but still hard!
Raid would be only for 25man (maybe 10man to but they should not share the same loot and ilvl).

[Exiztence]

Leave Naxx where it belongs, I just wish my memory of it wasn't tainted by the abomination I was forced to run during WoTLK.

[Deleted]

A little bit of genuine creepiness goes a long way.

#Thaddius

[Deleted]

Naxx puts the xx in xxx... Ok that was just random, yeah i'm just scrollin through some forums and said what the hell hehe

[MagicMert]

Leave Naxx where it belongs, I just wish my memory of it wasn't tainted by the abomination I was forced to run during WoTLK.

No one forced you to do anything.

back to the OP question I only started really raiding during WOTLK despite playing the game from classic and Naxx was mine and many of my friends first raid jumping in knowing nothing about what we were going to see was epic the gear oh my god the gear! I loved it I am currently working on getting all the weapons I loved again for transmog so for me its killing big things and the gear!

[Nadja]

Naxx had that air of being ~exclusive~ back in Vanilla, since you had to grind rep/attune yourself to use the instance. My guild downed Razuvious and Spider Wing before i took a break until BC. Being the hardest instance to raid in Vanilla gave it that epic-feeling especially for watching out for "World First" kill videos, which for most, was the only way to watch the fights. I remember watching the Horseman video, and shots of spreadsheets for times (I think it was for swapping groups around), or the PVP video of the world first Might of Menethil drop. Or the 800 DPS video of a warrior on Patchwerk. World-first Atiesh (I think it was a druid?), and the Corrupted Ashbringer questline, which made you friendly with Scarlet Crusade and caused scripted events in SM.

At the time, all those things were considered epic.

[Marahdeka]

I personally like the scourge theme (naxx, icc) more than titans theme (ulduar) or demons theme (BT, SWP)

[Crazia]

Nothing els than the defficulty level, beside that it was nothing special

The reason it is so "famous" is because only a handfull of player mannaged to finish it.

[wariofan1]

Naxx was epic for the following reasons:

-It was the first scourge raid, who didn't love the scourge?
-Kel'thuzad, the first raid boss from warcraft 3 that we got to face, many people have different attachements to the warcraft 3 heroes. Personally he is my all time favorite lore character.
-Sapphiron, same as above, the model was mindblowing.
-It was the first raid with interesting mechanics, it wasn't just a raid filled with bosses with simple abilities with high numbers like Molten Core, Blackwing Lair and the first half of AQ40.
-4 wings and one final place, first raid where you could choose what order you wanted to kill things (it usually went Spider -> Abo -> Necro -> Death Knight)
-The Lich King talked in the Kel'thuzad encounter, that was sick as we hadn't heard from him ever since he fused with Arthas.
-Hardest raid ever, and could still possibly be when it was current content.
-It was creepy, it had a frigthening athmosphere, mostly because you knew that it was nigh to impossible to complete the whole place, Anub'rekhan's lines didn't help much on it, and god bless the people with arachnophobia who actually beat Maexxna.
-The tier gear was really cool, who didn't love the tier 3 warrior gear? Hunters getting to look like Crypt Fiends was awesome.
-It flied.

It was simply the frigthening athmosphere of knowing that you're inside one of the scourge's strongholds, at the time many people thought the scourge to be the strongest army 'alive', the legion was just a washed out army compared to them. Time proved otherwise though, and I remember people being shocked when Lich King was to be the main villain in already the 2nd expansion.

Personally the original Naxxramas remains one of my favorite raids, I never got to enter it back then, but just seeing videos, knowing all tactics, the place looked astounding, horrifying. Definately a ground breaking raid by then.

And then came Wrath of the Lich King...

[Varyk]

very few people saw it, that's it. Getting there was the hard part. Anyone who thinks Kel'Thuzad was hard is kidding themselves. (He was probably the easiest boss in the instance). The gear looked awesome. It had a completely different feel from the rest of the raids.

[Deleted]

As well as being exclusive and making you feel epic in the old one, I think the fun thing about it was that there was a huge sense of adventure. The same can be seen in other popular raids like Karazhan and Ulduar. People disliked the revamped 80 version because many people had already done the raid before and knew what was in it before they even entered it.

80 Naxx was a lot of fun for me because I had never raided before and even killing Patchwerk felt awesome, so a bit of nostalgia and being many people's first raid could also be why it is liked so much.

I think Dragon Soul is a good raid with a variety of different bosses, but there is no sense of adventure. We have already been to Dragonblight and we have already been to the Maelstrom.

[Bender]

I'd imagine that some (or a lot) of the Naxx epic factor came from the fact that there was a small exclusive club who ever got anywhere in there. Blizzard has abandoned that long ago (for good and bad) but it felt really good to be able to kill stuff in an instance that few others even stepped into. I got whispers daily with questions about naxx and compliments about my gear and whatnot. The fights were very hard (for their time) and they required preparation that isn't far behind the current world first guilds level of prep (as in time required to farm consumables, world buffs, resistance gear etc). Killing the bosses in naxx really made you feel elite, which was pretty cool. Since I haven't raided hardcore since then I can't really compare that feeling with how it is today. Realm first guilds might still have this (the world first ones probably do at least) but idk. All I can say is that Naxx (and AQ) were freaking awesome and the rose tinted goggles makes me look back at that time with a nostalgic tear in my eye.

I also think it was a bit related to the fact that the Scourge plotline was in fresh memory from WC3 for many, and Kel'Thuzad (and to a lesser extent, Sapphiron) were the first WoW raid bosses who were well established characters before being introduced in WoW.

[manisher]

The fact that you couldn't clear it in one night, and it had so many bosses

[traen]

Uhm. Nothing?
It was not available to most of the raiders back on level60, it was pretty unbalanced and buggy these times.
As of wotlk, it was not epic at all, it was one of the worst raids in Wotlk, maybe just a little bit better than totc.
Boss mechanic was already too outdated, rehashed content is boring and difficulty was too easy for any kind of challenge - it was cleared just in 2 hours in mostly BC items.

The only good thing about it - there were few really hard achievements and epic titles there. But its just because blizzard was not greedy those days and they wanted to reward hadcore players for doing something exceptional. It does not make raid instance better in any ways.