banned on swotr.com for pointing out so many bugs

[Zyzzyx]

Yeah, spoken like someone who's never tried reporting anything in TOR.

Here's what happens when you report something to GMs in TOR. Players, bugs, it's all the same.

1.) A guy shows up in your chat window 36-48 hours later. He obviously doesn't speak a lick of English, as anything that isn't found in a textbook has to be explained and re-explained, frequently including common MMO terms. I had one that just couldn't comprehend the term "instanced", for example.
2.) The guy cuts-and-pastes canned answers, sometimes so sloppily that things like "Next Page" appear in the canned answer.
3.) The guy requests screenshots of whatever you reported, even if screenshots are totally illogical (e.g. "CODs never go through" "Please submit a screen shot with this report. NEXT PAGE")
4.) The email address that they tell you to send screenshots to does not accept incoming email. It starts with DO_NOT_REPLY@.
5.) Really.
6.) Fucking really.
7.) I can't make this shit up.
8.) In the event that they somehow give you the correct email address that does accept incoming email, a GM who also speaks very bad English creates an ENTIRELY NEW TICKET based on the email, even if you reference the exact ticket number. It's now a different report altogether, with ZERO means of traceback to the first report. They also lose any screenshots you send them.
9.) And we're back to step 1.

I'm sure that every GM position is outsourced to a foreign country as you suggest, but let's assume for a minute this isn't a horrible generalization.

These guys often have no choice. Yes, it's stupid. Yes, it sucks if they can't or don't help. Yes, you have no right to break the rules because of it. Don't like it? Send a letter and quit the game. Or post constructively and hope that every single other person feels the same way, or it won't matter.

Customer service positions are the way they are because of the customers. They have the worst job on the planet, and the position is going to hell because of it.

Oh, and I'm sure the "constructive criticism" posted by the OP was nothing but. Wait, it probably wasn't. People who complain about "only doing the right thing" are usually the loudmouth jackoffs that get upset when things don't go their way. Probably asked for it, whether he knows it or not.

[Vulcanasm]

I'm sure that every GM position is outsourced to a foreign country as you suggest, but let's assume for a minute this isn't a horrible generalization.

These guys often have no choice. Yes, it's stupid. Yes, it sucks if they can't or don't help. Yes, you have no right to break the rules because of it. Don't like it? Send a letter and quit the game. Or post constructively and hope that every single other person feels the same way, or it won't matter.

Customer service positions are the way they are because of the customers. They have the worst job on the planet, and the position is going to hell because of it.

Oh, and I'm sure the "constructive criticism" posted by the OP was nothing but. Wait, it probably wasn't. People who complain about "only doing the right thing" are usually the loudmouth jackoffs that get upset when things don't go their way. Probably asked for it, whether he knows it or not.

I'm not saying he did the right thing. Fuck, I don't even care. But I AM saying that when someone jumps on him because he feels like their forums are the only place to report a bug or exploit to someone who gives a rat's ass...let me tell you, there's a lot of good reasons why someone would feel exactly that way.

[Koalachan]

Yeah, spoken like someone who's never tried reporting anything in TOR.

Here's what happens when you report something to GMs in TOR. Players, bugs, it's all the same.

1.) A guy shows up in your chat window 36-48 hours later. He obviously doesn't speak a lick of English, as anything that isn't found in a textbook has to be explained and re-explained, frequently including common MMO terms. I had one that just couldn't comprehend the term "instanced", for example.
2.) The guy cuts-and-pastes canned answers, sometimes so sloppily that things like "Next Page" appear in the canned answer.
3.) The guy requests screenshots of whatever you reported, even if screenshots are totally illogical (e.g. "CODs never go through" "Please submit a screen shot with this report. NEXT PAGE")
4.) The email address that they tell you to send screenshots to does not accept incoming email. It starts with DO_NOT_REPLY@.
5.) Really.
6.) Fucking really.
7.) I can't make this shit up.
8.) In the event that they somehow give you the correct email address that does accept incoming email, a GM who also speaks very bad English creates an ENTIRELY NEW TICKET based on the email, even if you reference the exact ticket number. It's now a different report altogether, with ZERO means of traceback to the first report. They also lose any screenshots you send them.
9.) And we're back to step 1.

Yup, TOTALLY never reported all those bugs, like the one in D7 that they fixed, which still causes infinite spawns but only for certain people, or the countless name violations, or the miriad of other things. I want a good game, instead of coming to these forums to complain I try to help point out to BW things that aren't working in a helpful manner.

[obdigore]

EA is mocking you, guys. They spent most of their budget on the sound department and the rest of the game had to settle with scraps.

Think about it. Even now, at about 2 months from launch, they are still doing damage control, trying to fix the bugs and very poor design decisions. Patch 1.2 ? Damage control as it adds features that should have already existed from launch like they do in any run of the mill modern MMO (LFG and dual spec). Really, even Rift had dual spec and a global LFG chat (how hard could it have been to at least add a global LFG chat, HOW HARD ?!?) based on level, from launch and that game's budget didn't even come close to swtor's.

But I'm not worried about the game's future. After all, Lolhammer and SWG kept going with a minor percentage of the initial playerbase.

Really? I don't want a LFG system beyond a server wide channel you can create yourself. I don't need/want dual spec either.

Its ok though, I believe the term is 'haters gonna hate'.

@OP -> You have no way to prove your statement. If true, that sucks, but seeing the vitrol on the official forums I doubt you got banned for pointing out bugs and suggesting fixes in a positive manner.

[Diraeqt]

Find it kind of hard to believe they just banned you right away with no reason other than listing bugs

[obdigore]

Well glad to see YOU don't want it. However, and this might come as a shock to you, YOUR opinion is in the minority since the devs already stated they will be adding these features. Also the devs of WoW, Rift and Tera(!) probably saw a damn good reason to have these features, regardless what a bunch of arrogant, self entitled people like yourself think.

I mean if your highness doesn't want it, then no one else should.

Also, the custom made LFG chat was a fail from the get go, simply because most players aren't even aware of its existence.

And the term is also "biodrones gonna drone" if you want to talk about.

I'm just curious, what is your crusade against Bioware? I mean what did they do to you?

And no, I'm posting my opinion that I don't want a LFG system. I really don't care what the devs of WoW, Rift, and Tera did/didn't do, because I don't play those games. And yet, you decide to call me self entitled and arrogant despite the fact that I was just sharing my opinion. How ironic.

[schippie]

I cant say i find that to hard to believe. After seeing how some CMs reply to a thead clearly indicating they dont even care to properly read a thead. I am far from supprised if this would actually would be the case. Another reason why i find it not to hard to believe is there on the official forums have even been people joking about it. With adding into there signature something like: Ifractions 8 blablabla.

Then again if i look at this thread:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=300756

I could go on about how empty the game is, how much we're obviously paying for a beta, how bad the engine is, how bad pvp is, the horrible UI, the lazy classes/skill trees, the poorly thought out crafting, etc etc.

But instead let me bring up a little talked about annoyance:

The game has been out for two months now and it can't even count right.

Sort by level -> hilariousness ensues.

Really Bioware (or should I say EA?) when your devs see stuff like that... don't they have any pride in their work? When they see their game can't even sort numbers correctly do they facepalm? Hang their heads in shame?

.....

While this OP is clearly not constructive thats not what i want to point out. Its the reply a CM gives to this thread:


http://www.swtor.com/community/showt...=300756&page=3

Greetings everyone,

You might be interested to know what Associate Online Community Manager Joveth Gonzalez had to say about the issue of warzones mission credits:

People who post a reaction like this .. *face desk* it clearly indicates ones again BW doesnt properly read there forums. It has been so clear looking at feedback for the PTR testing. That is simply not read and completely ignored.

At the end of that thread another CM simply locked it telling how people should post constructive.

Other things that bug me about how there CM is done is helpfull and extremely constructive post like:

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=249030

Are completely ignored, not one CM / DEV replies to it. While it wouldnt be a bad idea if they did since the thread pretty much managed to find the problem all comming down to 2 files.
I wont be supprised when somebody in that thread is going to try and break the zlib files (.tor) and simply gain acces to the assets to change them and improve preformance.

Overall looking BW doesnt have 1 clear line with who gets banned/infracted and who doesnt. Also what i notice is that people who have had an infraction before seem to get another one faster then others. Also non trolling post but simply negative critism are quickly picked up and locked.

Will it improve? For the next few months no chance, this is something that probably has to grow (I hope) because looking at how "dumb" some replies from CMs/GMs are clearly indicate to not know anything related to the game. And only Auto-copy something from a word document with Auto-replies.

[obdigore]

My beef with Bioware is that this game of theirs that they hyped up so much and I placed my hopes in, proved to be very disappointing to me for great many reasons. Yes, it's a personal issue.

I am also sick to see features missing from the game and people saying "the game doesn't need them because I don't need them" as it's completely phantasmagoric that many other people might think differently, or "this isn't wow" as if WoW got 12 million subs in its glory days because it had all these "bad" features that weren't needed at all, and also new MMO, if they want to be original, they should avoid to have the same quality of life features that a much more popular MMO, after extensive studies and testing, decided they ARE needed after all, like a new car model with square wheels instead of round. Functional ? Hell no but it's damn original.

I'm all for having my criticism countered but I want it countered with objective and logical arguments, not arguments based on very personal impressions and often borederline illogical.

But your 'criticism' is based soley on what you think and personal impressions, so to dismiss anyone elses' impressions seems like a double standard where no one can 'win' any kind of discussion with you, since you just dismiss any arguments.

I'm also confused why you think if a popular MMO has certain features that every other MMO ever created had better have them or else it is destined for failure?

Also, where was this Hype coming from? I didn't see any except from the community, not Bioware. If you honestly allowed a community to get your expectations so high that you aren't at least a bit impressed that Bioware just pushed out the most stable launch of any MMO, ever, then there really is nothing to discuss and you are just as illogical as people who defend the game no matter what.

[Leonard McCoy]

My beef with Bioware is that this game of theirs that they hyped up so much and I placed my hopes in, proved to be very disappointing to me for great many reasons. Yes, it's a personal issue.

I am also sick to see features missing from the game and people saying "the game doesn't need them because I don't need them" as it's completely phantasmagoric that many other people might think differently, or "this isn't wow" as if WoW got 12 million subs in its glory days because it had all these "bad" features that weren't needed at all, and also new MMOs, if they want to be original, they should avoid to have the same quality of life features that a much more popular MMO, after extensive studies and testing, decided they ARE needed after all, like a new car model with square wheels instead of round. Functional ? Hell no but it's damn original.

I'm all for having my criticism countered but I want it countered with objective and logical arguments, not arguments based on very personal impressions and often borederline illogical.

Uhh they only did what they said they were going to do for years. Add the pillar of story to the traditional mmo pillars. It's like this game existed in a vacuum and NOBODY ACTUALLY PAID ATTENTION TO IT during its development and are not stunned at what it actually is. You could have seen enough information through beta leaks over the months and years before it came out to know better.

Here's an objective logical argument. Cars are not video games. Most of the features people have asked for are being implemented including (much to chagrin of many) cross server dungeon finder. If that doesn't suit you, then I'm not sure what to tell you. The other major mmo release from last year did not have it at launch either. Nor did it have mods at launch. Features get added over time.

Now having said all that, you really have decided to make a crusade against a video game because your upset by it? You really have the time and really care all that much to post on these forums and trash the game for others? I'm not insulting you or at least trying not to you but it seems rather childish. I'm sorry you didn't like the game, its unfortunate but I don't see why that has to mean you make a tirade against it.

[Redblade]

My beef with Bioware is that this game of theirs that they hyped up so much and I placed my hopes in, proved to be very disappointing to me for great many reasons. Yes, it's a personal issue.

I am also sick to see features missing from the game and people saying "the game doesn't need them because I don't need them" as it's completely phantasmagoric that many other people might think differently, or "this isn't wow" as if WoW got 12 million subs in its glory days because it had all these "bad" features that weren't needed at all, and also new MMOs, if they want to be original, they should avoid to have the same quality of life features that a much more popular MMO, after extensive studies and testing, decided they ARE needed after all, like a new car model with square wheels instead of round. Functional ? Hell no but it's damn original.

I'm all for having my criticism countered but I want it countered with objective and logical arguments, not arguments based on very personal impressions and often borederline illogical.

You do realize that most hype around games comes from the communities around them, not the developer them selfs right?

You think features are missing or not designed the way you want them, the fact that they are missing or working the way they are might just as well be intended design, you seem to be awfully quick judging others views without being able to even for a second consider that your desires might not be the once of the developer.

And to be fair, WoW reached it's peak before LFD/LFR and have since been on a steady decline in subscriptions, so not a very good argument in my opinion.

[Deleted]

My beef with Bioware is that this game of theirs that they hyped up so much and I placed my hopes in, proved to be very disappointing to me for great many reasons. Yes, it's a personal issue.

I am also sick to see features missing from the game and people saying "the game doesn't need them because I don't need them" as it's completely phantasmagoric that many other people might think differently, or "this isn't wow" as if WoW got 12 million subs in its glory days because it had all these "bad" features that weren't needed at all, and also new MMOs, if they want to be original, they should avoid to have the same quality of life features that a much more popular MMO, after extensive studies and testing, decided they ARE needed after all, like a new car model with square wheels instead of round. Functional ? Hell no but it's damn original.

I'm all for having my criticism countered but I want it countered with objective and logical arguments, not arguments based on very personal impressions and often borederline illogical.

Expecting logical and sensible arguments when you are being both illogical and senseless seems a little hypocritical. Bioware has a marketing team. Their job is to hype up the game, make people think it's the dog's bollocks. If you think a game is amazing, what are you going to do when it comes out? You don't need to answer that. The fact that you took all of this at face value and believed that this would be the one MMO to rule them all is your fault. Different people like different things, if you did your research and saw what would be in the game and what would be out at launch (dualspec, LFG - anyone who'd done any research knew neither of these things would be in at launch) then you wouldn't have been disappointed when you bought a brand new MMO at launch. Now through an objective and logical argument, you should realise that your beef with Bioware is unfair and puerile.

As for "missing features", well I'm sorry but it's Bioware's game made the way they want it (publishers etc notwithstanding). If you spent 3 years on an oil painting, you'd be a little confused if someone with no painting experience came and said "THERE SHOULD BE JESUS IN THIS PICTURE! THE LAST SUPPER HAD JESUS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE, THIS RIDICULOUS PICTURE DOESN'T EVEN HAVE A JESUS YOU GOT MY HOPES UP FOR NOTHING!". If they wanted a feature for launch they could have (and would have) added it. I'd imagine a large part of why the two features that you like so much aren't in the game is because the MMO community is hugely divided on them. If you'd had a look at the original SWTOR.com forums, there was easily as many people asking for the omission of them as there was for the addition. Call me stupid, but delaying the addition of them pending launch so that you can see if people actually do need them is a very good idea in my eyes.

For what it's worth, nothing will change your mind anyway. You're obviously very upset because you let yourself get overexcited and there's nothing anyone can say that will really have an effect.

[ContentsMayVary]

I was not angry i just wanted to see if i get banned like the guy that posted "Im 12 and what is this" and got banned coz he was under 13 =)

That was a hoax. It never happened. Someone made a hoax picture of the alleged email from BW, and lot's of people believed it.

[Deleted]

I posted a thread about the bugs in endgame raiding, and an exploit that they still haven't fixed.

Thread got locked with "please post constructive criticism".

I quit that day, uninstalled the client and am never returning back.

[Deleted]

Objective and logical arguments, not arguments based on very personal impressions and often borederline illogical.

Yet your entire post is built on personal impression and and admitted "personal issue"? with the game.

dude stop being so mad at a videogame other people enjoy, you dont ..fine not everyone will, move on.


@OP, you know you could post up some evidence you have a) been banned and b) your SWTOR forums post history, your not the first to claim banning for doing nothing but providing clear constructive criticism of the game, yet then it turn out theyre either lying or a complete troll who deserves the ban hammer. Looking at your post history here im going to go for the troll reason.

Plus its their forums they can do whatever the hell they like, hence why i never bother with them.

[Ivpiv]

I recently got banned on swotr forums because I regularly posted constructive criticism about the game. Mainly about unbindable keys, afkers in warzones (uyes they are cropping up more and more now since you get about 8-10k xp for losing), not punishing botters and speedhackers, and a bunch of other rather miscellaneous bugs that affect quality of life.

Honestly if Bioware thinks that this game is going to last they can't pull this gestapo shit especially since we forked over $70 to beta test this shitpile albeit fun shitpile. Sooner or later people are going to get pissed off enough and move on to the next best thing.

I got an infraction on this forum for stating that i find SWTOR to be a terrible MMO and i dont believe it needs any more publicity.. That sentence was deemed trolling..

So i´d suggest being careful, mods on these forums are really softskinned when it comes to Swtor aswell.. Seems i cannot even state my own opinion on the matter..

[Deleted]

As with wow, the developers can not take simply take action on every single account that is afking/botting etc because it is a waste of resources, the next day the same account holder has a new account and is doing the exact same thing they were banned for resulting in the developers actions being for naught.

Instead the developers need to investigate and remove the cause of the issue rather than the outlying effects.

Think of it this way:

You face a 5 headed hydra.
It is growing more heads by the minute
The heads are vulnrable but the body is encased in almost impenetrable armor.
You cut off a head and another grows right back
You cut off all the heads and they all grow right back
Now The Hydra has 20 heads and you are no closer to killing it, infact you are 15 heads further away than when you started.

Theres no use crying that no one is doing anything about the heads, they need to find a way to penetrate that armor and destroy the heart.

[Deleted]

I honestly don't believe you got banned by pointing out a bug in a normal civil way.
This is only half of the story and not the half i believe.

[Deleted]

I get the feeling you couldnt report them or write about it like a normal person but did rage as a little kid.

[gibbie99]

Yeah, spoken like someone who's never tried reporting anything in TOR.

Here's what happens when you report something to GMs in TOR. Players, bugs, it's all the same.

1.) A guy shows up in your chat window 36-48 hours later. He obviously doesn't speak a lick of English, as anything that isn't found in a textbook has to be explained and re-explained, frequently including common MMO terms. I had one that just couldn't comprehend the term "instanced", for example.
2.) The guy cuts-and-pastes canned answers, sometimes so sloppily that things like "Next Page" appear in the canned answer.
3.) The guy requests screenshots of whatever you reported, even if screenshots are totally illogical (e.g. "CODs never go through" "Please submit a screen shot with this report. NEXT PAGE")
4.) The email address that they tell you to send screenshots to does not accept incoming email. It starts with DO_NOT_REPLY@.
5.) Really.
6.) Fucking really.
7.) I can't make this shit up.
8.) In the event that they somehow give you the correct email address that does accept incoming email, a GM who also speaks very bad English creates an ENTIRELY NEW TICKET based on the email, even if you reference the exact ticket number. It's now a different report altogether, with ZERO means of traceback to the first report. They also lose any screenshots you send them.
9.) And we're back to step 1.

Sounds like every big company. When will people get it. I worked at afortune 500 IT company in tech support. They changed their policy to a) not hire any US tech support workers. b) Keep adding to india tech support. c) bring in US contractors (that was me) but! d) no training whatsoever.

Needless to say the place was a hell hole and I left as soon as I could. I still have to use their shitty products, I know way more than the tech support, excepting like 2 guys/gals in america who i know on a first name basis.

[Alvito]

Yeah, spoken like someone who's never tried reporting anything in TOR.

Here's what happens when you report something to GMs in TOR. Players, bugs, it's all the same.

1.) A guy shows up in your chat window 36-48 hours later. He obviously doesn't speak a lick of English, as anything that isn't found in a textbook has to be explained and re-explained, frequently including common MMO terms. I had one that just couldn't comprehend the term "instanced", for example.
2.) The guy cuts-and-pastes canned answers, sometimes so sloppily that things like "Next Page" appear in the canned answer.
3.) The guy requests screenshots of whatever you reported, even if screenshots are totally illogical (e.g. "CODs never go through" "Please submit a screen shot with this report. NEXT PAGE")
4.) The email address that they tell you to send screenshots to does not accept incoming email. It starts with DO_NOT_REPLY@.
5.) Really.
6.) Fucking really.
7.) I can't make this shit up.
8.) In the event that they somehow give you the correct email address that does accept incoming email, a GM who also speaks very bad English creates an ENTIRELY NEW TICKET based on the email, even if you reference the exact ticket number. It's now a different report altogether, with ZERO means of traceback to the first report. They also lose any screenshots you send them.
9.) And we're back to step 1.

I know I have been run in circles by the mods dealing with in game tickets and the forum modes. Having both tell you in a reply to file a ticket in game or an in game response to post online. The customer service is bad they in my experiences have not looked at the info provded in the tickets and often just pass the buck. It does frequently feel like they are poorly trained, dont care or dont know what to do. If you have any real issues email them the ppl that deal with those seem to be a bit more on their game.

I think the run ins with the CSRs they have are the tipping point and why so many ppl rage out here or on their forums and eventually get banned. You end up in a spot where you are having some sort of an issue with the game, big or small, you let them no and they often handle it so poorly it has now become a bigger and different problem.