Mm pvp hunter use serpent sting?

[Ilamuku]

See what I mean when I say take the replies with a grain of salt. SrS is in the nature tree.. aka spell..

Serpent Sting is on the physical hit table, not spell hit. "...SrS is on the physical hit table, not spell," is accurate in the context stated. A serpent sting fired onto a rogue who has cloaked it off will re-apply. Cloak only removes it, it cannot prevent it. So to sum up, you have fallen victim to your own snarky comment of being wary of what others are saying with a grain of salt. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul.

[Danur]

As a 2500 rated hunter i question why would you rather freezing over ice trap?

Caster's.
<1.9k rated hunter

This ^

But to be more specific in regards to melee, frost (ice.. I refuse to call it by its new name, since freezing was always "ice trap" to me) trap has pretty much run out of it's usefulness with all of the gap closers and self healing they have given every single melee class.

Rogues ShS and sprint over it
Paladins freedom judgement and sprint through it
DK's blow their unholy runes and walk over it
Warriors charge/intercept/and heroic leap over it
Shamans ghostwolf over it

Even with 2/2 entrapment, it hardly gives you the breathing room required to utilize your chimera shot as a heal and regen some focus. I don't even spec into entrapment anymore unless I'm playing a comp that makes a lot of use of it, but since snake trap is suicide in 3s and freezing trap is needed on heals, I'm just not getting my bang for my buck out of it. I prefer instead to spec down into Spirit Bond for the boost to my chimera's heal + the 10sec 3k heal.

As for dueling, being able to regain max distance with freezing trap, then reopen with fresh pet + silence + Chim shot cooldowns, and a full focus bar due to a SS opening shot is way worth it to me over a 4sec root. Also with SB your chimera heal can crit for over 15k.

[Illana]

Serpent Sting in on the physical hit table, not spell hit. "...SrS is on the physical hit table, not spell," is accurate in the context stated. A serpent sting fired onto a rogue who has cloaked it off will re-apply. Cloak only removes it, it cannot prevent it. So to sum up, you have fallen victim to your own snarky comment of being wary of what others are saying with a grain of salt. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul.

why does it always say "miss" when i try to sting a rogue with cloak up then

[asharia]

why does it always say "miss" when i try to sting a rogue with cloak up then

maybe you're not hit capped? maybe they have evasion up too?

[Danur]

maybe you're not hit capped? maybe they have evasion up too?

This I find interesting because before reading this I would have sworn that trying to serpent sting a rogue with cloak up would be like any caster applying a DoT, meaning it would be fully resisted. I will have to test this.

[Illana]

maybe you're not hit capped? maybe they have evasion up too?

definitely hit capped and spell pen capped

surprised there isn't much rogue QQ about this if it were true

[Pence-Korgath]

Serpent Sting in on the physical hit table, not spell hit. "...SrS is on the physical hit table, not spell," is accurate in the context stated. A serpent sting fired onto a rogue who has cloaked it off will re-apply. Cloak only removes it, it cannot prevent it. So to sum up, you have fallen victim to your own snarky comment of being wary of what others are saying with a grain of salt. I award you no points and may God have mercy on your soul.

How do you figure its on physical hit table? it doesn't do instant dmg. Regardless your point sucks because a rogue will just cloak vanish. To sum up, you can't SrS a rogue you can't see, therefor you do not use it in pvp as mm.

Side note: people like you ruin great quotes from movies because you have no idea how to use it and probably got the idea to use it from someone else saying it, not the movie itself.

---------- Post added 2012-03-03 at 09:53 PM ----------

Caster's.
<1.9k rated hunter

Ok, What good does it do vs. casters? Maybe if you screw up your outs and let a mage slap you around in the deadzone. Still should be using frost/ice to make him blink over it. Mediocre shams will ground it. Other casters will have you dotted up so whatever you are trying to accomplish by having him frozen is moot.

---------- Post added 2012-03-03 at 09:58 PM ----------

This ^

Rogues ShS and sprint over it
Paladins freedom judgement and sprint through it
DK's blow their unholy runes and walk over it
Warriors charge/intercept/and heroic leap over it
Shamans ghostwolf over it

Even with 2/2 entrapment, it hardly gives you the breathing room required to utilize your chimera shot as a heal and regen some focus. I don't even spec into entrapment anymore unless I'm playing a comp that makes a lot of use of it, but since snake trap is suicide in 3s and freezing trap is needed on heals, I'm just not getting my bang for my buck out of it. I prefer instead to spec down into Spirit Bond for the boost to my chimera's heal + the 10sec 3k heal.

As for dueling, being able to regain max distance with freezing trap, then reopen with fresh pet + silence + Chim shot cooldowns, and a full focus bar due to a SS opening shot is way worth it to me over a 4sec root. Also with SB your chimera heal can crit for over 15k.

-Rogues - Learn to keep conc up on them
-Pals -Why are you not dispelling freedom? Why do you not use conc?
-DK ok well make them blow their runes
- well then disengage back across it ffs and dont get leaped
-lol ghostwolf over it. that would be a blessing.. also WHY DONT YOU USE CONC SHOT?

Entrapment 4 secs. how are you not able to get space in 4 secs?

LOLOL No entrapment.. that is so awful.

2400 must be your combined ratings from each bracket or you are referring to bg rating.

[asharia]

How do you figure its on physical hit table? it doesn't do instant dmg. Regardless your point sucks because a rogue will just cloak vanish. To sum up, you can't SrS a rogue you can't see, therefor you do not use it in pvp as mm.

25 focus to force a rogue to blow cloak to vanish? yes please!

it still needs to calculate hit from somewhere. just because it doesnt do upfront dmg doesnt change this.

[Illana]

still want to see proof that you can apply this on a cloaked rogue

[zugzugz]

why does it always say "miss" when i try to sting a rogue with cloak up then

Evasion reduces ranged hit chance by 25%. The rogue likely had it up.

Also, while I have no way to prove it to you (account hasn't even been active since the beginning of cata) I will say that it is indeed true that serpent sting will apply the DoT to a rogue even when it is cloaked (this is obviously in the case where you shoot the serpent sting AFTER the rogue already has cloak up; if you shoot it before, then cloak will remove it upon activation). It's also completely possible that this has changed, although I doubt it. Go test it with a rogue friend.

Old main was a rogue, (not a hunter) so don't ask me how hunters have changed, but I remember distinctly that hunters would swap to a non-damage sting if they wanted to trap me (ie. if I got hit with scorpid sting then I knew a scatter-trap was coming immediately). Do you guys still have a non-damage sting that overwrites serpent?

[Illana]

nope

scorpid and viper got removed in cata

[Ilamuku]

How do you figure its on physical hit table? it doesn't do instant dmg. Regardless your point sucks because a rogue will just cloak vanish. To sum up, you can't SrS a rogue you can't see, therefor you do not use it in pvp as mm.

Side note: people like you ruin great quotes from movies because you have no idea how to use it and probably got the idea to use it from someone else saying it, not the movie itself.

Internet tough guy and Bulletin Board Bully still misses the point. You're falling into your own mind-trap Pence. You're removing the accuracy of the statement made by taking it out of context (exactly as I knew you would mind you) and somehow trying to shovel you're missed whiff of arrogance back at me. The problem is, you're claiming to be some kind of authority on hunter pvp. You qualify this assertion by basing your position on past PvP achievements (from what, 2010?), you're about a year and a half removed from top tier pvp.....You sir are not an authority. You fire back with arrogance ad naseum really. If you want people to respect your input, do so in a manner that comes across less as an impetuous child and more in a manner of respectable discourse.

I still award you no points.

[Pence-Korgath]

25 focus to force a rogue to blow cloak to vanish? yes please!

it still needs to calculate hit from somewhere. just because it doesnt do upfront dmg doesnt change this.

So you rather spend 25 focus over the 0 focus of hunter's mark?

[xpose]

this thread has actually opened my eyes as to how bad I am as a hunter in pvp. The information provided in here is going to help me a done as a relatively new hunter

[Arazen]

I'm not sure about Serpent Sting applying through Cloak of Shadows, but this (old) arenajunkies thread [1] states so quite clearly. So, if they didn't change it, it's very likely to be still the case.

But I know for sure, that Censure stacks from paladins get removed by CoS, but can be reapplied through CoS.

Regarding OPs question, I'd say, that Serpent Sting is not worth it most of the time. It's good, if you know, that it will last the full duration (unlikely, if paladins or druids are involved) and you won't need cc on the target for the whole duration.

[1] http://www.arenajunkies.com/topic/21...g-through-cos/

[Imbashiethz]

While serpent sting does prevent a rogues restealth, it will also kill you because serpent sting will break your cc on the rogue. Don't use serpent sting if you're playing against a good rogue.

[timoseewho]

Ilamuku, you have given me some good laughs here.

Definitely some good info here too, just started picking up PvP.

[asharia]

So you rather spend 25 focus over the 0 focus of hunter's mark?

does mark stop them vanishing like faerie fire? i'm not actually sure.

either way, SrS isnt going to stop them from vanishing if they plan on opening almost straight away, thanks to vanish's supereasymode 3sec immunity. it will pull them back out after though, whereas mark wont.

[Mormolyce]

definitely hit capped and spell pen capped

surprised there isn't much rogue QQ about this if it were true

Rogues really shouldn't be wasting cloak on hunters. Only time I can see them using it is to clear dots to get a permanent re-stealth, which seems excessive, but even in that case it'd be irrelevant as the rogue would vanish right after the cloak. Remember that Vanish protects you from dots for a few seconds, which is usually plenty to pop sprint and run or alternatively, shadstep-ambush/cheap the hunter and pound him in the face.

[Arazen]

does mark stop them vanishing like faerie fire? i'm not actually sure.

either way, SrS isnt going to stop them from vanishing if they plan on opening almost straight away, thanks to vanish's supereasymode 3sec immunity. it will pull them back out after though, whereas mark wont.

Both, Vanish and Cloak of Shadows, remove Hunter's Mark. But a good rogue will never get a clean restealth against a good hunter, so Hunter's Mark is useless most of the time. I use it, when I get a full trap on the rogue, while building up distance (there is nothing else you could do at this point anyway) or when they manage to run far away.

Also I agree with you, that it is very rare to get a rogue out of stealth with SrS when it actually matters, i.e. you're not stunned at the same time. SrS only ticks every 3 seconds and with Vanish's 3 second not-gonna-be-revealed-immunity, you well get him out of stealth 4-5 seconds after he vanished. And that is worthless.