American Education, anyone wanna help out a swede :P

[Deleted]

Short background, Im studying to become a english teacher in Sweden and we have a course called "American cultural studies" so atm we are reading about education in the US (and other things there as well)

So Im wondering if any of you american guys/girls can share with me some of your experiences of the education is. Whether if you are in school atm or how it was when you were in school.

Good things?

Bad things?

Typical things maybe you think other countries like Sweden doesnt have or maybe should have?

And so on..

Would appreciate very much if some ppl can share their experiences in school that might help or enlighten me for my work in this subject

Thx in advance /Scy

[NeutralGuy]

Biggest problem here in America is too much freedom... the freedom to fail I mean. Parents don't have the same convictions about education here as my native homeland or any of the countries I've visited. Its kind of funny too cause when I read the paper or watch tv news they always put emphasize on bad schools/teachers. I can say without a doubt its the bad parents here in this country NOTHING else.

[Cocoballs]

Biggest problem here in America is too much freedom... the freedom to fail I mean. Parents don't have the same convictions about education here as my native homeland or any of the countries I've visited. Its kind of funny too cause when I read the paper or watch tv news they always put emphasize on bad schools/teachers. I can say without a doubt its the bad parents here in this country NOTHING else.

Teachers and schools are not the problem, its Day-cares and Lack of Discipline the children are receiving while growing up.
Personally I think day-cares are terrible and are what is making society bad.

[Deleted]

Ah, yeah as it seems from the things I have read the problem seems to be the freedom parents have with putting their kids in this or that school and the amount of different kinds of schools/education types that exists.

But what would you say are some of the positive things then? Since that is rarely something one could read in the news.

[Reeve]

Biggest problem here in America is too much freedom... the freedom to fail I mean. Parents don't have the same convictions about education here as my native homeland or any of the countries I've visited. Its kind of funny too cause when I read the paper or watch tv news they always put emphasize on bad schools/teachers. I can say without a doubt its the bad parents here in this country NOTHING else.

I don't think there's too much freedom to fail. I think there's too little freedom to fail. Schools will do everything in their power to keep a student from failing because they don't want the parents to come after them, and they don't want that statistic. So you get students who never learn the material who keep passing on to the next grade. That's probably part of the reason that in US Universities you have so many students who have to take a few semesters of remedial math and English.

I think the biggest issues are that teachers are not paid enough, so we don't get the best people for the jobs. Also parents have a little too much influence in the classroom right now. I know teachers who are terrified that a picture of them holding a beer could make it onto facebook because it could get them fired or at least censured. Also the way that No Child Left Behind has worked has stifled creativity and innovation in the classroom.

[TacTican]

Kindergarten - happy fun times, arts and crafts, or having stories read to you by the teacher. Lots of time in the playground. No homework. Basic reading skills (alphabet)

Elementary school - grades 1-5. Significant recess time. Arts and crafts, basic math, basic science, fundamental reading skills, basic national history, activity workbooks. Boys are dirty, girls have cooties. Teachers learn about the characters in Saturday morning cartoons by osmosis. As a student, you worship the other students in the grades above you. Team sports sponsored by the school (pee-wee baseball club FTW!). LOTS and LOTS of indoctrination (D.A.R.E. to keep kids off drugs, smoking is bad for you, do this-this-and-this in the event of fire/earthquake/tornado/alien invasion, etc). Very politically correct. Students get along with each other except for the odd bully here and there.

Middle school - grades 6-8. Where the eff did my nap time go? Puberty occurs, terrible thing for boys and girls to experience. Slightly more advanced math (geometry, pre-algebra, fractions). Multiple teachers instead of one teacher, and they get worse at drawing back wandering attention spans. Students become more cliqueish. Still politically correct. The girl that used to be an easy dodgeball strikeout is suddenly - whoa, I had no idea something with cooties could be so ... um ... attractive? Confusing primal urges in brain. Self-discipline suffers. Everyone tries to be "cool." More organized sports, less spontaneous group activities. World history, more in-depth social studies, English starts to suck because of having to learn all kinds of arcane rules and exceptions. Critical readings and book analysis. First science projects.

High school - grades 9-12. Congratulations, if you made it through grades 1-8 without becoming a myrmidon, we now call you gifted and move you to the advanced class. Puberty is over, boys and girls (slightly) more comfortable around each other now. Very, very clique-ish - friendship is almost dictated by common interest at this point. More after-school clubs and activities. Teachers can be less politically correct, while administrators are more so. Math suddenly becomes a lot more abstract (algebra, geometry, trigonometry, calculus). The general study of "science" is now broken down to biology, chemistry, and physics. World geography in grade 9, world history in grade 10, U.S. history in grade 11, (optionally) European history in grade 12. More esoteric subjects, like finance electives, psychology, or technical training. WTF we have to learn another language now, why couldn't this be done in elementary school?! Boys talk about cars, girls talk about boys. No more recess except during lunch break. Social acceptance is now at an all-time premium. Massive stress from standardized tests (SAT, ACT). Begging your teachers to write recommendations for you for college. English study turns more to literature and becomes fun again. A sense of relief that it's all over upon graduation. Yearbooks. Swearing that you'll never forget your high school friends. Stop talking to them a few weeks after graduating.

[Deleted]

I agree with it seems that the teachers/school all care about results and not actual knowledge. After reading a few articles about education in the US it seems to be so much about the money which in turn is related to the whole RESULTS FTW issue.

But anyone who has anything positive to say about how education is over there? =D

[Kasierith]

Yes, there are some negative aspects of our education. But people fail to realize several things when addressing these concerns.

First, we offer free public education. The difference between our education and, say, India's, is that we educate absolutely every person, whether that person is an immigrant who can barely speak English or from a long line of doctors. In India, if you don't have the money, you don't go to school but instead go into other things. So when considering US education, you look at far, far beyond the horizon of people who are there to learn. Even if yo uwant to go into pure manual labor, it is required.
Second, public education quality is determined by its district, through state taxes. If a school is in a rich district, than it has a large amounts of resources at its disposal for education and other products. If it is in a poor district, it often does not have the fund necessary to properly educate everyone it has at its disposal. This is an especially large problem in rural areas, where you have one school servicing a small group of people over a massive land area.
You can go back and forth on everything else... but that is the essential problem of primary education in America. We teach absolutely everyone up through high school, even though most of the people will never use that education and thus do not care about it, and the finances of the district define public education.
If Sweden's education system is anything like Germany's (Sorry, I only know Germany's education system, not yours ) than you have profession-oriented schools as an alternative to high schools, where individuals can learn specific trades instead of overall knowledge. This is something that the US is very distinctly lacking.

Now, college education is significantly different. The largest strength in US education is having an integrated system of colleges throughout a massive area. This allows for shared databases and increased efficiency of financial support. In addition, it allows for large opportunities for professors, allowing for those who are most interested and invested to gain positions. This is set back slightly by research-based universities, but overall this holds true. There is a reason why students from all over the world come to colleges here.. and that are the colleges are connected. More connections means more finances and opportunities and more resources, which in turn allows for more connections. The massive number also allows for more specializations. We have colleges able to focus on minute, specific programs that you would not be able to find anywhere else. For example, there is a university in Florida that is the only university in the world (last I checked, it may have changed since I searched for my graduate school) that has a doctorate of pharmacy - forensic science degree. You could not have that kind of program in a smaller, less connected region.

[Caiada]

No Child Left Behind. It's defined pre-University education since Bush passed it. Teaching to the test is absurdly dominant, especially in my state. Teaching is mostly rote, and teachers (and schools) are rewarded for getting their kids to reach test goals, not for any sort of creativity in teaching. Test preparation is the name of the game, basically.

[Willeonge]

While I don't always agree with what Bill Maher says, I have to agree with him on the point he makes in this clip:

[Derpules]

American education. Hmm, where to begin?

The problem starts at home. Parents being friends and not authority figures, then they go to school and think they can talk to adults anyway they like because they do at home (with their oh-so-hip parents). A lot of teachers are underpaid, so then they might lose some of their motivation to really work on some of the kids. Kids grow up, getting by with acting like punks, have kids of their own, repeat.

The whole system is jacked imo. Kids have bad parents to start them out in life, then they are sent to schools with bad teachers, then they fall through the cracks and get their hand held by the government, which then allows them to have kids of their own. Sad panda mode: Engage!

[Kasierith]

American education. Hmm, where to begin?

The problem starts at home. Parents being friends and not authority figures, then they go to school and think they can talk to adults anyway they like because they do at home (with their oh-so-hip parents). A lot of teachers are underpaid, so then they might lose some of their motivation to really work on some of the kids. Kids grow up, getting by with acting like punks, have kids of their own, repeat.

The whole system is jacked imo. Kids have bad parents to start them out in life, then they are sent to schools with bad teachers, then they fall through the cracks and get their hand held by the government, which then allows them to have kids of their own. Sad panda mode: Engage!

Meanwhile, back in the majority of America....
While you are referring to a portion of the population, it does by no means encapsulate the majority of people in America. The education is far, far more advanced than that, and just saying that with nothing else severely skews the entire system

[Roose]

American education system is a massive joke. They push kids through and only teach them how to pass a standardized test.

It varies drastically from district to district depending on how wealthy the community is.

Americans do not value education and our corporate masters like it that way.

Nothing good to learn from American education system besides what not to do.

American schools are like free daycare. That is all.

* I want to emphasize that it is largely a system failure and the teachers are really handicapped as to what they can actually achieve. Underpaid, undervalued, and overworked. I have a few close friends that teach and they all started out enthusiastically and then the bureaucratic bullshit wears them down. That and children with shitty parents.

[conscript]

The pre-university American Education System is designed for the lowest 10% of any normal class. The pace and content of almost every single class is designed for those people to feel comfortable. That leaves the upper portion of the classes feeling bored and disinterested in most content that is taught at high school so they seek out college courses during school or take the incredibly few advanced courses their school offers. Best way to sum it up is that in most American classes, the moron who can't read by 11th grade is doing the exact same coursework as the kid who just got a 33 on their ACT. Every kid is taught at a pace to meet the minimum of standardized testing so that they don't lose funding nothing more, nothing less. There is no push to succeed in anything but sports in most high schools. In my school, knowledge always seemed like a secondary concern.

Fun story, when I was in middle school, my friends and I competed in academic games. We won state in several games during 6th grade and competed at a national competition where we did well. We won state again in 7th grade, but our school refused to fund our trip to nationals because the budget was constrained to paying for the football team's annual camping trip (seriously). The school even refused to allow our parents to pay for the students because of the costs to send the educators with us. That was when I learned that it doesn't matter if your football team is 3-10, they will always be more important than the educational success of the students. This applies only to my school of course, but I'm sure it isn't much different at most schools.

[Scrabblet]

I have a question: How does the Swedish educational system work? Only then can I give you a proper comparison between the two.

[Darkchickens]

American education is pretty bad like others have said. You cram information for the test, then forget it. In Honors and AP classes they even say the goal of them is "to pass the AP exam" not retain the information. There is too much discipline in schools for the smallest things and not enough in the household for bad things.

[Shaytan]

The quote below pretty much sums it up well... Thank you for writing it TacTican

Even for the bad schools in Cali where racial fights still break out and the schools test on the lowest scale.

Kindergarten - happy fun times, arts and crafts, or having stories read to you by the teacher. Lots of time in the playground. No homework. Basic reading skills (alphabet)

Elementary school - grades 1-5. Significant recess time. Arts and crafts, basic math, basic science, fundamental reading skills, basic national history, activity workbooks. Boys are dirty, girls have cooties. Teachers learn about the characters in Saturday morning cartoons by osmosis. As a student, you worship the other students in the grades above you. Team sports sponsored by the school (pee-wee baseball club FTW!). LOTS and LOTS of indoctrination (D.A.R.E. to keep kids off drugs, smoking is bad for you, do this-this-and-this in the event of fire/earthquake/tornado/alien invasion, etc). Very politically correct. Students get along with each other except for the odd bully here and there.

Middle school - grades 6-8. Where the eff did my nap time go? Puberty occurs, terrible thing for boys and girls to experience. Slightly more advanced math (geometry, pre-algebra, fractions). Multiple teachers instead of one teacher, and they get worse at drawing back wandering attention spans. Students become more cliqueish. Still politically correct. The girl that used to be an easy dodgeball strikeout is suddenly - whoa, I had no idea something with cooties could be so ... um ... attractive? Confusing primal urges in brain. Self-discipline suffers. Everyone tries to be "cool." More organized sports, less spontaneous group activities. World history, more in-depth social studies, English starts to suck because of having to learn all kinds of arcane rules and exceptions. Critical readings and book analysis. First science projects.

High school - grades 9-12. Congratulations, if you made it through grades 1-8 without becoming a myrmidon, we now call you gifted and move you to the advanced class. Puberty is over, boys and girls (slightly) more comfortable around each other now. Very, very clique-ish - friendship is almost dictated by common interest at this point. More after-school clubs and activities. Teachers can be less politically correct, while administrators are more so. Math suddenly becomes a lot more abstract (algebra, geometry, trigonometry, calculus). The general study of "science" is now broken down to biology, chemistry, and physics. World geography in grade 9, world history in grade 10, U.S. history in grade 11, (optionally) European history in grade 12. More esoteric subjects, like finance electives, psychology, or technical training. WTF we have to learn another language now, why couldn't this be done in elementary school?! Boys talk about cars, girls talk about boys. No more recess except during lunch break. Social acceptance is now at an all-time premium. Massive stress from standardized tests (SAT, ACT). Begging your teachers to write recommendations for you for college. English study turns more to literature and becomes fun again. A sense of relief that it's all over upon graduation. Yearbooks. Swearing that you'll never forget your high school friends. Stop talking to them a few weeks after graduating.

I have not read through every post yet, but I would like to get my opinion out there early on.

Coming from someone with Family as current Teachers, and a Wife working on becoming a Teacher, in the State of California.


Teachers are underpaid, and over worked.
The Parents of today expect our school systems to teach our children, all the basics, as well as respect, discipline, and how to act as human beings.



The problem with today's youth, is a complete failure on the parents. (Don't get me wrong, every kid has a different way they need to be raised, some more/less discipline, some more/less parental involvement. But in the end, if a kid ends up breaking the law or failing in school, its the Parents Fault.)

It's not the Teachers job to raise your kids to be respectful, disciplined, and productive adults.

It is the Teachers job to teach your kids the basics fundamentals for mastering the English Language, Sciences, Mathematics, and the Arts.


Once parents start stepping up to handle their kids, we need to figure out the funding for the schools. Science's, Mathematics, Computer courses, and Languages need to be pushed more on the kids, and the funding for those programs.


We've been breeding a bunch of lazy, stupid kids, that turn into lazy and stupid people for years. This needs to stop.




I have more to say but that gets the basic point across.

[Deleted]

The education is good if you WANT to put effort in your studies. It really is up to you whether you want to end up in a shithole or not.

American social life is also a whole lot different than Europe. Friends can lead you to shitholes or be saviors, just pick your friends carefully.
Europe is also a whole lot more individualistic than America.

Generally, to have a chance to beat the education system is to a) quit it or b) get awesome grades or c) have a rich family.


I'm not an american, nor do i live in america, but my uncle who teaches there has been thrown out from various schools because of his critics against the education and the discriminating way of treating students. He's coming back to Europe in a couple of months but he really hates America now.

[Jodah]

The American education system is caught between a rock and a hard place right now. Teachers are underpaid, overworked, and expected to teach kids. The problem is by teach parents mean straight A's no matter how dumb their offspring are. If a teacher gives a bad paper an F the parents go in and start yelling at the teacher.



This is surprisingly accurate.

Then one of three things happen. The kid doesn't go to college, this is pretty common. The kid goes to college but realizes they actually need to work now and succeeds, this is pretty rare. Or the kid goes to college, expects it to be easy, fails half his classes, tries to complain only to be laughed at by the professor or dean, and drops out.

[Jackmoves]

I have a question: How does the Swedish educational system work? Only then can I give you a proper comparison between the two.

I'm lazy and it's late, so I'll just leave this here. It's a comparison between the UK and Sweden, but should give you an idea how it's done. Explains pre-school to age 15 if I remember correctly.