Creatures from Cthulhu Mythos.Could they be real ?

[hellboyy]

there are creatures like that in our oceans right now. various worms and jellifish etc

[Vanyali]

No you're making assumptions based on observational logic rather than investigative. "That creature clearly can't exist as I don't know the mechanism for its operation", they've said that about animals on this planet dozens of times.

Viable is so subjective that to use it you must be claiming to understand the required instance for this sort of creature to exist and excluded it from occurring in the known universe.

...no, i'm making assumptions based on probability.

An immobile creature will have extreme difficulty with mating, meaning that very few (if any) offspring are produced. This leads to this strain of creature being weeded out of any gene pool. This will occur unless the animal can release its DNA into the air and form a self-sustaining creature... and in any case, saying that a creature can fly with no system for flying (show me the system on the first or second) so that's how they move is more silly than anything I could come up with.

For the second, organs are kinda vital for... you know, living. The brain HAS to be rigid to operate. Others can be more fluid, but ANY form of organ needs both room and protection. A system of tentacles in the second provides room for little more than rudimentary digestive tracts and very little else unless it runs on a system of filters.

[Deleted]

First, natural selection and evolutionary theory are two related but different concepts. Second, because evolution works by choosing the most viable specimen of a species to survive, and to therefore pass those traits on. It is hard to encapsulate a single-celled organism developing to flying tentacle monsters, especially since we don't know of anything that could let them fly. I guess the land-bound ones are technically possible.. although having an evolutionary trait leading to a big hole in your stomach seems unlikely.

They are the exact same thing, the Theory of Evolution explains the mechanism of natural selection. One is explanation, the other is the mechanism. You cannot mention one with the other and they are linked to a fundamental level.

It is not hard to believe that such a creature could evolve considering the level of diversity on our own limited planet.

[Deleted]

There are Creatures that live in near boiling water, anything goes I say. It just gets more unlikely the more fantastic the idea.

[Deleted]

...no, i'm making assumptions based on probability.

An immobile creature will have extreme difficulty with mating, meaning that very few (if any) offspring are produced. This leads to this strain of creature being weeded out of any gene pool. This will occur unless the animal can release its DNA into the air and form a self-sustaining creature... and in any case, saying that a creature can fly with no system for flying (show me the system on the first or second) so that's how they move is more silly than anything I could come up with.

For the second, organs are kinda vital for... you know, living. The brain HAS to be rigid to operate. Others can be more fluid, but ANY form of organ needs both room and protection. A system of tentacles in the second provides room for little more than rudimentary digestive tracts and very little else unless it runs on a system of filters.

You've just claimed to have calculated the probability for these creatures, in the entire universe. You also claimed that you can't see space for their organs, firstly there is no scale. Secondly you can see eyes, mouths and feelers indicating at least a central and peripheral nervous system and a digestive system.

The brain does not need to be rigid, a brain is not even needed to function. Just look at the humble starfish.

[Deleted]

I probably should have said 'and,' not 'but.' I was actually agreeing, it's fairly impossible for us to say whether or not it's possible for creatures as alien and strange as these to exist or not.

Yes, that's why I said the OP didn't say Earth. Not all planets have the same atmosphere, therefore there is a possibility of completely different types of organisms on other planets. It's almost impossible to even imagine.

[Herecius]

...no, i'm making assumptions based on probability.

An immobile creature will have extreme difficulty with mating, meaning that very few (if any) offspring are produced.

Unless they reproduce in some other way beyond mating, such as budding, or asexual reproduction, as any number of species on Earth demonstrably do. Perhaps they even reproduce in some totally different exotic manner, such as appropriating non-living material from its environment.

For the second, organs are kinda vital for... you know, living. The brain HAS to be rigid to operate. Others can be more fluid, but ANY form of organ needs both room and protection.

There are living creatures on Earth with zero organs, and I'm not talking about single-cell organisms, which technically have more organs than a jellyfish.

[Deleted]

I like to think that in the deepest, darkest and unexplored depths of the ocean we have creatures like these.

[Deleted]

There are Creatures that live in near boiling water, anything goes I say. It just gets more unlikely the more fantastic the idea.

"Near" boiling?? There is abundant life around underwater volcanoes and bacteria survives far in excess of 100 degrees C.

http://www.wildlifeextra.com/go/news...olcano.html#cr

---------- Post added 2012-03-09 at 01:39 PM ----------

I like to think that in the deepest, darkest and unexplored depths of the ocean we have creatures like these.

The deeper you go the stranger it gets due to the zero light and intense pressure. It's believed that at the deepest parts you'd find either enormous are tiny organisms but as we've mapped around 1% of those areas, it's impossible to have much authority on the subject.

[Aethilus]

...no, i'm making assumptions based on probability.

An immobile creature will have extreme difficulty with mating, meaning that very few (if any) offspring are produced. This leads to this strain of creature being weeded out of any gene pool. This will occur unless the animal can release its DNA into the air and form a self-sustaining creature... and in any case, saying that a creature can fly with no system for flying (show me the system on the first or second) so that's how they move is more silly than anything I could come up with.

For the second, organs are kinda vital for... you know, living. The brain HAS to be rigid to operate. Others can be more fluid, but ANY form of organ needs both room and protection. A system of tentacles in the second provides room for little more than rudimentary digestive tracts and very little else unless it runs on a system of filters.

Flowers reproduce sexually with themselves as well as other flowers to cause diversity, they are also immobile.

[Deleted]

"Near" boiling?? There is abundant life around underwater volcanoes and bacteria survives far in excess of 100 degrees C.

http://www.wildlifeextra.com/go/news...olcano.html#cr

---------- Post added 2012-03-09 at 01:39 PM ----------



The deeper you go the stranger it gets due to the zero light and intense pressure. It's believed that at the deepest parts you'd find either enormous are tiny organisms but as we've mapped around 1% of those areas, it's impossible to have much authority on the subject.

It's not boiling at that pressure.

[Deleted]

It's not boiling at that pressure.

If you mean turning to gas then no, however it is at the temperature of boiling, i.e. 100C and above.

[Deleted]

If you mean turning to gas then no, however it is at the temperature of boiling, i.e. 100C and above.

Under pressure the boiling point raises drastically, 100C is only the boiling point at 1G. You can also lower the boiling point by relieving the pressure with a vacuum.

http://www.iapws.org/faq1/boil.htm

[Deleted]

Under pressure the boiling point raises drastically, 100C is only the boiling point at 1G. You can also lower the boiling point by relieving the pressure with a vacuum.

.....So then why not pick a "g". And just so you know it's not a g, g is gravitational force. You want atmospheric pressure, typically measured either in standard units,e.g. 5 atmospheres. (Exactly 14.696 PSI for 1 atmosphere)

However the standard phrase "boiling point" relates to one atmosphere, not 20,000 leagues under the sea...

[Vladimeir]

Regarding the whole flying thing, if an atmosphere is super dense, it takes a lot less to fly. Kind of to the point where an atmosphere is liquid... Or perhaps, wait for it... in water, Like an ocean, where creatures "fly" whose weight may measure in the tons. So, I think people are assuming these creatures to exist on an earth like planet (which they still could in an ocean as mentioned) with an earth-like atmosphere and earth-like biosphere and are flying in a low density gas and are not thinking outside the realm of our world.

Also, boiling is defined as the vapor pressure being > than the pressure of the liquid. For water, this occurs at 100c at sea level. Granted, in some under water volcanoes, it is boiling (thus the bubbles) but it also is a much higher temperature before it begins to boil.

[Larynx]

I've spoken with the Dark Lord himself.

[LegendaryDude]

Dudes... you take that shit way to serious. We are talking about GODS. Who the fuck knows if they even have to eat, breath, whatever. They don't have to make sense. Evolutionary theory does not apply to things that are a) not from our planet and b) are freaking godlike creatures from outer space

[Deleted]

Dudes... you take that shit way to serious. We are talking about GODS. Who the fuck knows if they even have to eat, breath, whatever. They don't have to make sense. Evolutionary theory does not apply to things that are a) not from our planet and b) are freaking godlike creatures from outer space

I agree with this.

Then again, it was a single person who imagined them and wrote them down (mostly a single person). Of course there's a possibility, but I guess this possibility is as high as...I don't know, a flying space train with wings and eyes.
(also I hope that Cthulhu doesn't exist...we would be screwed :x)

[Aethilus]

Dudes... you take that shit way to serious. We are talking about GODS. Who the fuck knows if they even have to eat, breath, whatever. They don't have to make sense. Evolutionary theory does not apply to things that are a) not from our planet and b) are freaking godlike creatures from outer space

I want to say that you have no idea what evolutionary theory is or suggests, if that is the case, I suggest you watch the whole 10 minute video that I posted on the first page (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vss1VKN2rf8).

Regarding your points:

a. There is no reason to suspect that if life is on another planet, that life is not also influenced by evolution through natural selection, whether that life was originated by an unknown randomly occurring event, or by a supernatural being is irrelevant. By extension, without evidence, we can fairly expect that the same principles apply to life on other planets, similar to the laws of physics as we understand them applying (as far as we know) to the entire universe.

b. I assume by this point you mean supernatural beings, such as a creator or god. I do not have theistic beliefs, but I don't fight against those who do. If you want to believe in higher powers it is your privilege. Saying they (or it) exists does not produce any evidence that evolution is a myth though. Many religious individuals know and accept the theory of evolution, but still believe in gods, evolution is not concerned with the origin of life on the planet (or other planets). The theory of evolution is only concerned with how that life (again, regardless of the cause of that life), has developed and diversified since that origin.

To clarify my points:

1. Just because we haven't seen life on other planets, we can use what we understand about life on our planet to assume that the theory of evolution applies equally to that life for the same reasons.

2. Evolution is not concerned in any way about the origin of life on our planet or throughout the universe, that is the field of Cosmogenesis, you can read about it here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmogenesis

3. Evolution is accepted by both those who believe in one or multiple gods, and those who do not, evolution and a belief in gods are not mutually exclusive.

Edit: Please note that all of the above is not an attempt to illicit a discussion about religion (as it is against forum policy). While my personal viewpoints are highlighted above, I also highlight that I don't care what other people subscribe to. All of the above are facts to help clarify the points I've made earlier in the thread.

[Adam Jensen]

Dudes... you take that shit way to serious. We are talking about GODS. Who the fuck knows if they even have to eat, breath, whatever. They don't have to make sense. Evolutionary theory does not apply to things that are a) not from our planet and b) are freaking godlike creatures from outer space

And wasn't the whole point of Lovecraftian horror the fact that these creatures made no sense, or worse, were so strange and so horrible that they drove people into insanity?