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What do you think of gemming Agi (red = agi - yellow = agi/crit - blue = agi / hit) for a dps oriented itemisation on a BM monk ?
I know secondary stats are better for tanking purpose but I was wondering if I could maximize my dps by gemming AGI or if i should focus on crit / haste too.
If you're mainly worried about DPS then you're probably going to want to hard cap expertise (15%) as well as get the obvious hit cap. Once you have those, then yeah, gem in the way you suggest (assuming you have enough haste).
Out of curiosity though, why are you wanting to do this? Trouble with enrage timers? It's not the place of the tank to worry about maximising DPS. The only other reason would be maximising Guard coverage on the raid with the Ox Statue. Which is nice, but again... That's the healer's concern, not yours.
So I'm just a bit baffled really!
Actually for the Statue's Guard it's better to go with haste / crit since the "proc damage value" is AP dependent.
I'm currently raiding 25 with perhaps too much healers (now that our stuff is better) and we won't consider dropping them for more dps. With that setup I consider that I don't need to maximize my EH or avoidance but perhaps give them a tougher job while maximizing my dps output.
I was thinking that maybe crit & haste could be better (with the 2:1 ratio) than agi considering the already high AP value we get with vengeance. Agi seems to win the match, but I haven't done the maths to prove it right.
You are going to be creating a bazillion GotO orbs so just watch your health and any time your down a chunk just step into a pile for full health. W/ the statue Guards, GotO, and EH on CD your healers will be bitching about your HPS =P
He's worried about chi starvation, which can be attributed to using more of your level 30 talent instead of other abilities, or a low base chi generation (the latter being more the case, here.)
The interesting thing about Ascension vs Power Strikes is that you'll feel less energy starved with Asc. but it generates less chi per 40 energy than PS, since it gives 3 free chi every minute, so while it's a bit jankier on chi generation it does provide more output over a fight.
Typically I'll only bank chi for certain big, predictable hits.
I was looking at this
and what I've extrapolated is that more crit is always more crits...
While that may sound silly, what I was trying to figure out was...
If I have say a hypothetical 1000 points of stat to play with that can either go to haste, or crit, if I stack it all in crit, am I getting less ACTUAL crits because I'm swinging less? Or if I stack it all in haste, am I actually getting MORE crits because I'm swinging more?
And if that spreadsheet is accurate, I'm sold on the idea that once you're comfortable with your energy/chi generation and shuffle uptime, everything else should probably get moved into crit...
Can anyone tell me if I've come to these conclusions logically or if I've missed some piece?
And you will get more crits from putting stats into crit, relative to haste. Not sure if that bit was actually a question or if you were just showing your thought process prior to finding an answer.
I read this everywhere, and you're right in theory. BUT that is only the case if you Jab exactly after 20 seconds which is only possible if you monitor that very specifically and I doubt many people do.The interesting thing about Ascension vs Power Strikes is that you'll feel less energy starved with Asc. but it generates less chi per 40 energy than PS, since it gives 3 free chi every minute, so while it's a bit jankier on chi generation it does provide more output over a fight.
0s : you get PS
2s : you Jab and get extra Chi
20s : you get PS
24s : you Jab and get extra Chi
40s : you get PS
Can someone clarify for me if the reason you're all discussing Power Strike is because it's still competitive with Ascension or better?
Also I recall reading that at high haste (62xx something) it's break-even with PS for chi generation due to Ascension being a straight % increase to your existing energy regen.
If that's accurate, then I'd personally stick with Ascension simply because I like the way it feels far more than PS.
I like the extra room 5 max chi affords, I like the faster energy. If there's a strong case past low haste level chi generation superiority I've not yet seen it. Perhaps someone could explain it in a way that more clearly explains why it's superior if that's the case.
edit1: Also Mad, I find it interesting to note that you appear to have previously shared my same main, while having appeared to re-main your monk tank in MoP, as I did.
edit2: And what's up with your expertise? Not saying I know it to be bad or good, just that you're at a weird spot halfway between hard and softcap.... are you just unable to reach hard cap or... idk. Just wondering what you know that I don't.
Last edited by Trendy-Ideology; 2012-12-12 at 09:14 AM.
PS is still good, yeah. It'll give more Chi over the course of a fight, while Ascension allows you to stack crit instead of haste and still have enough chi/energy to do stuff with. You could use Ascension and get enough haste to 'break even' with PS, as you say. It's personal preference and what works best for you, essentially. I don't think there's a cut and dry 'best' option here.
As for the expertise thing, while I obviously can't speak for Madgod, there's one thing that should be kept in mind... the concept of the 'soft cap' for expertise is kind of a fallacy. From 0% all the way to 15%, expertise has the exact same value. It doesn't increase or decrease in value depending on how much of it you have. This is because it first reduces chance to be dodged, then reduces chance to be parried: it doesn't do both at the same time like in prior expansions.
So I'd wager that all he's doing is getting an amount of expertise that he feels comfortable with for threat purposes, or is just the amount that he naturally gets from gear, or whatever. Of course, if I'm wrong, I apologise and I'm sure he'll correct me on this point. :P
On that note now that the DPS in my guild are getting geared up I'm noticing some threat issues at the start of fights that wasn't there before, which usually happens because of missed/parried keg smashes. Kind of frustrating.
The crazy minmaxer in me would find weapons with expertise, start fights with them, and swap to something more suited for the length of the fight after agro is established.
Of course getting extra weapons is never easy sometimes.
Ascension is nice because you can more easily control the amount of chi you have, be able to get chi more quickly within a shorter period of time, and get to a point in energy regen that feels comfortable. Power strikes, on the other hand, just wins at raw output. Which is better depends a lot on personal preference, your effectiveness at maintaining shuffle, and how many times you need to purify your DoT within a given space of time. The more you need to use PB, the more PS can benefit you.
Well... TECHNICALLY it's not for threat, it's for less janky resource generation. I prefer the consistency that higher level of expertise gives me. The extra damage (and therefore threat)'s just a bonus :P
Actually I'm probably going to go even lower to 7.5, just because we've just bolstered the tanking core to four guys, so we all have to fish up an offset, and I can just use my brewmaster gear as such.
Or I can gear up my warlock. Lawl.
I must admit I do like that about Monks. I've never really felt in any other class that there was any level of 'personal preference' involved: it was all, 'read this guide! Do it this way! ANY OTHER WAY IS FAAAAAAIIIIILLLLLLL'; with Monks, it's 'well this way works, but so does this, just get what you feel comfortable with really'.
I mean yeah, there's some things that just don't work at all, but the leeway we're given to make our own decisions is rather refreshing I find. Not sure if this is a general MoP thing or a Monk only thing.
As clarification, I'm referring to stuff like hit/exp caps (getting an amount that works for you), and the PS/Asc debate, where both are good for different reasons and it's up to you to decide which works for you.
And that's my 'yay I love my class' message for the week!