[TV] Avatar: Legend of Korra

[shimerra]

Actually, the definition of a Deus Ex Machina is:

The main part to stress is "provides a contrived solution to an apparently insoluble difficulty", the suddenness is typical but not necessary or at least that's how people around me have always used the term. As I said the being the Avatar's already known to grant some level of super powers, but crying your way into the avatar state is a pretty cheap way of getting rid of the mechanic with no drama or weight given to the seriousness of the problem. Dues Ex or not, which it isn't, it's a shit way to end the story given the other options.

"Because she's the fucking Avatar and for no other reason." That happened to Aang multiple times in the original series.

Did you really want the creators to spend the time explaining 100% exactly how Bloodbending can affect a person's bending? We're shown in the original show about Chi and the Blood Stream in the body, and they are overlapping in nearly every single way, and its completely realistic to say that somebody who can control Blood can prevent these chi "routes" from being open.

You should go back and rewatch the original series. They actually explain everything that you're complaining about in the past lore of the show. I guess I just assumed people knew the lore of the Avatar universe before watching Korra. Even if you didn't they still explain it fairly well.

And no, the previous season at all doesn't explain how chi or blood bending can permanently server a connection to the elements. It was mentioned earlier in the thread Blood bending just got to be too fucking good. First it was only usable during a full moon, then it was usable at any time but only by a few people, now it can be used during the day and strip away bending powers? What's next a blood bender jacks the Blade story and tries to summon the blood god? Your assumptions are all well and good but all it would have taken was a quick 20 second flashback/montage to explain exactly what you said if that was how it was done. Why is that so hard or unreasonable to expect given that they spent a good few minutes explaining how Tarlok/Amon learned to blood bend? Two sentences from Amon while Korra was moping on the floor and we're done.


I've watched the series, your explanation is as good a guess as any but that's it all is. Now if you'd like I'll help you off the high horse and you can look at me in the figurative eye to eye level rather than down your nose.

You say that now, but if that was actually done in the series you would be bored to tears by it. If she's with the Guru for one episode and it's all fixed, you'd all complain that it was too fast. If she's with a Guru for multiple episodes to get it fixed, you'd all complain that it was too long. The simplest option would've been to make her go into the Avatar state when Amon had her.

Also, we've already had an Avatar that could only really airbend in the beginning, I do not want to see that again..

I never said it had to be with the Guru in a single episode, in fact I mentioned it could be either through some sort of spirit based ordeal guided by Ang/Guru or a combination of both. And I like how even though I said I'd like the idea you automatically put words into my mouth saying I'd complain no matter what the out come. You must have missed the part where I said I still liked series, I just felt they could do better.

Whose to say it even had to be all about air bending? How can you say an episode or two of spirit world adventuring ala Ang going to visit Koh wouldn't have been amazing?

[Deleted]

This wasn't that Deus Ex Machina. A real Deus Ex Machina? The introduction of energybending in the first series. It was a plot mechanic made up in the final hour to solve an overarching problem they faced.

[Xuvial]

Right. I'm not happy. Sorry I just skipped to the last page of this thread without reading the crazy long comments :P

Pacing. All sense of pacing was through out of the fucking window. I know the Avatar series was known to show a tremendous amount of events happening in one episode, but this...was plain RUSHED. I know the directors said they wanted to have the series a lot "tighter" with no messing around with fillers. But in doing that they made it SO tight that there was pretty much nothing else.

1) The FIRST TIME Korra goes into the Avatar state she has full control of it. I call bullshit. Don't try to make sense out of it, it was plain rushed and forcefully wrenched into the last episode.

2) How the hell did Korra learn airbending from having her other 3 elements taken away? Airbending comes from peace of mind and freedom. Korra saw her friend's bending being almost taken away and then literally started punching the air (the exact moves that shoots fireblasts or hurl stone discs), at which point Amon conveniently forgets how to dodge. "I can airbend!" she yells with determination and throws a few more jabs/uppercuts. Bullshit.
Airbending is supposed to use circular movements to build up kinetic energy and then unload it in massive gales. I can imagine Aang doing that exact same air torrents except he would've rotated both arms (or his body) with fluidity, like airbenders are supposed to do. That whole scene made jack-all sense, nobody attempted to explain how she suddenly learned airbending while having everything else taken away, it was just left at that.

3) We never find out how Bloodbending could remove (or disable, or whatever) the ability to bend. I don't want to hear theories or speculation about it, I want to hear what the WRITERS had to say about it. I want a definitive answer and we never got one, and now both of the most powerful waterbenders on earth are dead.

4) Mako. He's a dick. Why would you have one of the main supporting characters be such a gigantic dick? How come Korra didn't ask Mako about silently betraying his relationship with Asami? Why is he allowed to play a "I loved you all along" card and nobody has any problems with that? Asami just seems bitter. If I was Asami I would electrocute the asshole and tell him to atleast LET HER KNOW CLEARLY that their relationship was over and he liked Korra more.

5) Overall comic relief. Every_single_time there's supposed to be a "funny" moment, the characters pull a sarcastic face. It was alright in the first few episodes but it is endlessly repeated in the remainder of the season. This is just a minor point though, the show did have it's funny moments.

6) Iroh just came there to fight and show us he could firebend quite well. Where is Zuko's personality? Where is Uncle Iroh's patience? He has no connection other than his looks and being voiced by the same guy.

7) Pacing, the most important one. This was slowly pushing against the window in most of the series, and then it was booted violently out the fucking window with the last episode (or the 2nd half of the last episode). There was a desperate attempt to tie-up all knots at the end of the season. Amon dead, Tarrlok dead, Asami's dad defeated, Korra equalized, then back to full power (and mastered avatar state), full connection with all previous avatars, she can now ENERGY BEND, everyone's bending got restored. This happened in a space of 20 minutes. Sorry but no.

I fully knew (before I saw the rest of the episode) that Korra could gain her connection back with the elements. But I thought that part would've been paced out into Season 2, meanwhile she would learn advanced airbending with Tenzen and strengthen her connection with the spirits and finally take an adventure to regain her other elements, helping people on her way. You know, a different spin on the Avatar journey as the travel around the world. Instead what we got was a "tie all knots" ending that looked extremely rushed.

Don't get me wrong, I did feel very sad when Tarrlok took himself and his brother out. I almost shed a tear when I saw Aang and all the previous avatars return.

But overall I have no connection with Korra. I don't feel sad when she cries (she cries a bit randomly IMO as if to remind us "hey I'm a girl, see how I sporadically burst into tears and attempt to display emotion"), I don't feel happy when she's happy. I'm more interested in Aang's life than Korra's life because Aang's journey (and all support characters too) was so amazingly paced, their personalities so well-defined etc etc that by the end we were all left with a bunch of characters with AMAZING depth. This all comes back to pacing. The series so far has been far, far too "tight".



Related image:

[Nab]

I agree with you on some points, like that Bolin isn't funny. Tenzin was the funniest character on this show for me, and the 2 seconds of Bumi. :P
Korra didn't have full control of the Avatar state, she just threw some rocks/fire and water. And yes, Mako is an asshole. Also, I liked the connection of Amon, it was good storytelling.

[Deleted]

Right. I'm not happy. Sorry I just skipped to the last page of this thread without reading the crazy long comments :P

Pacing. All sense of pacing was through out of the fucking window. I know the Avatar series was known to show a tremendous amount of events happening in one episode, but this...was plain RUSHED. I know the directors said they wanted to have the series a lot "tighter" with no messing around with fillers. But in doing that they made it SO tight that there was pretty much nothing else.

1) The FIRST TIME Korra goes into the Avatar state she has full control of it. I call bullshit. Don't try to make sense out of it, it was plain rushed and forcefully wrenched into the last episode.

2) How the hell did Korra learn airbending from having her other 3 elements taken away? Airbending comes from peace of mind and freedom. Korra saw her friend's bending being almost taken away and then literally started punching the air (the exact moves that shoots fireblasts or hurl stone discs), at which point Amon conveniently forgets how to dodge. "I can airbend!" she yells with determination and throws a few more jabs/uppercuts. Bullshit.
Airbending is supposed to use circular movements to build up kinetic energy and then unload it in massive gales. I can imagine Aang doing that exact same air torrents except he would've rotated both arms (or his body) with fluidity, like airbenders are supposed to do. That whole scene made jack-all sense, nobody attempted to explain how she suddenly learned airbending while having everything else taken away, it was just left at that.

3) We never find out how Bloodbending could remove (or disable, or whatever) the ability to bend. I don't want to hear theories or speculation about it, I want to hear what the WRITERS had to say about it. I want a definitive answer and we never got one, and now both of the most powerful waterbenders on earth are dead.

4) Mako. He's a dick. Why would you have one of the main supporting characters be such a gigantic dick? How come Korra didn't ask Mako about silently betraying his relationship with Asami? Why is he allowed to play a "I loved you all along" card and nobody has any problems with that? Asami just seems bitter. If I was Asami I would electrocute the asshole and tell him to atleast LET HER KNOW CLEARLY that their relationship was over and he liked Korra more.

5) Overall comic relief. Every_single_time there's supposed to be a "funny" moment, the characters pull a sarcastic face. It was alright in the first few episodes but it is endlessly repeated in the remainder of the season. This is just a minor point though, the show did have it's funny moments.

6) Iroh just came there to fight and show us he could firebend quite well. Where is Zuko's personality? Where is Uncle Iroh's patience? He has no connection other than his looks and being voiced by the same guy.

7) Pacing, the most important one. This was slowly pushing against the window in most of the series, and then it was booted violently out the fucking window with the last episode (or the 2nd half of the last episode). There was a desperate attempt to tie-up all knots at the end of the season. Amon dead, Tarrlok dead, Asami's dad defeated, Korra equalized, then back to full power (and mastered avatar state), full connection with all previous avatars, she can now ENERGY BEND, everyone's bending got restored. This happened in a space of 20 minutes. Sorry but no.

I fully knew (before I saw the rest of the episode) that Korra could gain her connection back with the elements. But I thought that part would've been paced out into Season 2, meanwhile she would learn advanced airbending with Tenzen and strengthen her connection with the spirits and finally take an adventure to regain her other elements, helping people on her way. You know, a different spin on the Avatar journey as the travel around the world. Instead what we got was a "tie all knots" ending that looked extremely rushed.

Don't get me wrong, I did feel very sad when Tarrlok took himself and his brother out. I almost shed a tear when I saw Aang and all the previous avatars return.

But overall I have no connection with Korra. I don't feel sad when she cries (she cries a bit randomly IMO as if to remind us "hey I'm a girl, see how I sporadically burst into tears and attempt to display emotion"), I don't feel happy when she's happy. I'm more interested in Aang's life than Korra's life because Aang's journey (and all support characters too) was so amazingly paced, their personalities so well-defined etc etc that by the end we were all left with a bunch of characters with AMAZING depth. This all comes back to pacing. The series so far has been far, far too "tight".



Related image:

1. She doesnt, in Avatar state you have ALL bending powers, doesnt mean she mastered it, Aang gave her the ability to, so doesnt mean she mastered it, hold your horses.
2. She unlocked it, its something that can happen in stress or anything I assume, we do not entirely know, but amon knew she could not bend air, so I assume he somehow did not take that.
3. We have a season 2 incoming, once again bloody hold your horses mad boy.
4. He loved her from the start, my guess is that asami hooks up with either Ihro or Bo Lin, dont get mad its a fictional story, they are not trying to make you rage, they have a story, they will tell it, not us.
5. You have no sense of humor?
6. So you have exactly the same temper as your father and grandfather? seems legit.
7. Well, they said it would be quick.

All with all, dont get so mad, you knew it would be quick and you are overreacting in my opinion.

But off that topic, so I get it right when Amon and Tarrlok are now dead right?
I mean Tarrlok and Amon we're misunderstood as I tought, Amon was NOT a bad guy on himself, he was a loving brother but Yakone forced him into being the person he became.
So that part of my theory/ish was right, I am glad to see that worked out, but Tarrlok sacrificed himself to kill him and Noa Tak, you could see the regret of what they did in both of them to be honest, I am really really curious about how Season 2 will work out.

[KrazyK923]

Snip

No, you're contriving what YOU think the definition of a Dues Ex Machina is because you're using it incorrectly and was called on it.

Second, its quite cute that you assume I'm talking down to you when that is exactly what you are doing to me.

Again, you need to go back and watch the original series, especially S1E18: The Waterbending Master. They completely explain what Chi is, how its connected to the elements, and to bending. Or just read this: http://avatar.wikia.com/wiki/Chi

I'm not "guessing" at anything.

Your points about bloodbending is nothing more than ignorance peppered with slippery slope arguments that somehow suggest the Avatar writers would resort to such nonsensical plot elements. Again, there are many examples of benders who excel at some specific thing in a specific school of bending. You don't even have to go back to TLA to see the examples, Sokka mentions them in the flashback.

Is it really too hard to draw your own conclusion about Chi Blocking through Bloodbending? Do you REALLY need the creators to sit there and spell out every single detail. Frankly, the fact that they did not is far more interesting. Although anybody who watched the original series, or even just goes and reads the Wiki for 5 minutes, can see its completely reasonable.

Finally, why are people pretending that Korra has mastered the Avatar State? Where did they stated this, or even show it? Because she uses all 4 elements at once? That means she's a master now?

I didn't learn my lesson the first time about this thread. I should have known. See ya.

[Activi-T]

Was anyone else but me really hoping General Iroh would end up with a Zuko scar when he got full on bombed in the crow's nest?

[ijffdrie]

Again, you need to go back and watch the original series, especially S1E18: The Waterbending Master. They completely explain what Chi is, how its connected to the elements, and to bending.

Your points about bloodbending is nothing more than ignorance peppered with slippery slope arguments that somehow suggest the Avatar writers would resort to such nonsensical plot elements. Again, there are many examples of benders who excel at some specific thing in a specific school of bending. You don't even have to go back to TLA to see the examples, Sokka mentions them in the flashback.

Is it really too hard to draw your own conclusion about Chi Blocking through Bloodbending?

Chakras, according to the guru episode, are pools of chi energy. Emotions can block them or release them, allowing the energy to flow from one pool to the other.

Bloodbending manipulates water. It grabs the water inside someone's body and forces it to move in a way that the bender wants to.

They work with completely different substances, so yeah, it is kind of hard to imagine how one could affect the other. I mean, I could imagine blood clots blocking part of the brain (like someone else suggested), but than I don't see why Korra needed energy-bending to give back Lin's earthbending.



On a completely unrelated note. Does anyone know how to spell Amon's real name?

[Deleted]

Chakras, according to the guru episode, are pools of chi energy. Emotions can block them or release them, allowing the energy to flow from one pool to the other.

Bloodbending manipulates water. It grabs the water inside someone's body and forces it to move in a way that the bender wants to.

They work with completely different substances, so yeah, it is kind of hard to imagine how one could affect the other. I mean, I could imagine blood clots blocking part of the brain (like someone else suggested), but than I don't see why Korra needed energy-bending to give back Lin's earthbending.



On a completely unrelated note. Does anyone know how to spell Amon's real name?

I think Noa Tak

[Alraml]

I think Noa Tak

Noatok(k)?

[ijffdrie]

For some reason, I though Noad-Hawk. After I realized how silly that looked, I went for Noatawk.

[Deleted]

Haha xD
To be honest, I dint want Amon and Tarrlok to die, they regretted what they did... I really hoped for them to help out and well amon would proberbly be punished but still.. stayed alive.
Any speculations of them being alive from your side?
I am quite sure they are dead, Amon could not know he was doing that, he was crying of regret I think, not of jumping off knowing what tarrlok was trying to do or w/e.

[dignaidgnaiud]

I've thought about this before and I think Sound Bending would make sense. If it's practical or not, who knows. But sound requires air to travel through, so... You could bend/make/destroy sound with air bending, I'd imagine.

Maybe it would be like toph in the play where she or he screamed to see :P

[randomone05]

was it just me or did Amon's voice as a kid sound alot like Aang?

yes, i am pretty sure it was the guy who played aang. nice touch, but a bit off-putting to see him as a water-tribesmen lol.

and i still cant believe that David Faustino is Makos voice. i have to stretch my hearing to the limits to make it sound like good ol Bud Bundy. but, i guess he is in his 40s now so his voice wont be the same as in the 1990's.

[dignaidgnaiud]

Right. I'm not happy. Sorry I just skipped to the last page of this thread without reading the crazy long comments :P

Pacing. All sense of pacing was through out of the fucking window. I know the Avatar series was known to show a tremendous amount of events happening in one episode, but this...was plain RUSHED. I know the directors said they wanted to have the series a lot "tighter" with no messing around with fillers. But in doing that they made it SO tight that there was pretty much nothing else.

1) The FIRST TIME Korra goes into the Avatar state she has full control of it. I call bullshit. Don't try to make sense out of it, it was plain rushed and forcefully wrenched into the last episode.

2) How the hell did Korra learn airbending from having her other 3 elements taken away? Airbending comes from peace of mind and freedom. Korra saw her friend's bending being almost taken away and then literally started punching the air (the exact moves that shoots fireblasts or hurl stone discs), at which point Amon conveniently forgets how to dodge. "I can airbend!" she yells with determination and throws a few more jabs/uppercuts. Bullshit.
Airbending is supposed to use circular movements to build up kinetic energy and then unload it in massive gales. I can imagine Aang doing that exact same air torrents except he would've rotated both arms (or his body) with fluidity, like airbenders are supposed to do. That whole scene made jack-all sense, nobody attempted to explain how she suddenly learned airbending while having everything else taken away, it was just left at that.

3) We never find out how Bloodbending could remove (or disable, or whatever) the ability to bend. I don't want to hear theories or speculation about it, I want to hear what the WRITERS had to say about it. I want a definitive answer and we never got one, and now both of the most powerful waterbenders on earth are dead.

4) Mako. He's a dick. Why would you have one of the main supporting characters be such a gigantic dick? How come Korra didn't ask Mako about silently betraying his relationship with Asami? Why is he allowed to play a "I loved you all along" card and nobody has any problems with that? Asami just seems bitter. If I was Asami I would electrocute the asshole and tell him to atleast LET HER KNOW CLEARLY that their relationship was over and he liked Korra more.

5) Overall comic relief. Every_single_time there's supposed to be a "funny" moment, the characters pull a sarcastic face. It was alright in the first few episodes but it is endlessly repeated in the remainder of the season. This is just a minor point though, the show did have it's funny moments.

6) Iroh just came there to fight and show us he could firebend quite well. Where is Zuko's personality? Where is Uncle Iroh's patience? He has no connection other than his looks and being voiced by the same guy.

7) Pacing, the most important one. This was slowly pushing against the window in most of the series, and then it was booted violently out the fucking window with the last episode (or the 2nd half of the last episode). There was a desperate attempt to tie-up all knots at the end of the season. Amon dead, Tarrlok dead, Asami's dad defeated, Korra equalized, then back to full power (and mastered avatar state), full connection with all previous avatars, she can now ENERGY BEND, everyone's bending got restored. This happened in a space of 20 minutes. Sorry but no.

I fully knew (before I saw the rest of the episode) that Korra could gain her connection back with the elements. But I thought that part would've been paced out into Season 2, meanwhile she would learn advanced airbending with Tenzen and strengthen her connection with the spirits and finally take an adventure to regain her other elements, helping people on her way. You know, a different spin on the Avatar journey as the travel around the world. Instead what we got was a "tie all knots" ending that looked extremely rushed.

Don't get me wrong, I did feel very sad when Tarrlok took himself and his brother out. I almost shed a tear when I saw Aang and all the previous avatars return.

But overall I have no connection with Korra. I don't feel sad when she cries (she cries a bit randomly IMO as if to remind us "hey I'm a girl, see how I sporadically burst into tears and attempt to display emotion"), I don't feel happy when she's happy. I'm more interested in Aang's life than Korra's life because Aang's journey (and all support characters too) was so amazingly paced, their personalities so well-defined etc etc that by the end we were all left with a bunch of characters with AMAZING depth. This all comes back to pacing. The series so far has been far, far too "tight".



Related image:

Look, I could say something about all of these, but I'll just point out that Katara is still one of the most powerful and has bloodbended before. It's possible that she has an answer.

[Deleted]

Look, I could say something about all of these, but I'll just point out that Katara is still one of the most powerful and has bloodbended before. It's possible that she has an answer.

I did it for you haha

[Duronos]

Guys this is the best thing you will hear all day.

Mako is awesome.

[Anakonda]

I wont post stuff about what i didnt like / what didnt add up / etc. Because, in the end, i enjoyed the episode and the season, and thats all that matters.

One issue i have, however, is that its the end of "book 1" and we already saved the day and brought peace back, with NO chance of retcon (boat explosion ) So... are they planning on bringing new "world evil" every season? or?

[ranku]

Noatok(k)?

this may be a bit off topic but i love your sig.

---------- Post added 2012-06-24 at 02:25 PM ----------

I wont post stuff about what i didnt like / what didnt add up / etc. Because, in the end, i enjoyed the episode and the season, and thats all that matters.

One issue i have, however, is that its the end of "book 1" and we already saved the day and brought peace back, with NO chance of retcon (boat explosion ) So... are they planning on bringing new "world evil" every season? or?

yes I believe they said they would do that when they first went over the second season in an interview

[Frozenbeef]

if aang and korra - child selfs were to have a battle who would you think would win 0o