Now that the non-press have a closer hold on the ear of Anet...

[Cuchulainn]

Imaginary?
Every person I know including myself uses the A and D keys while playing MMOs.
Not being able to strafe means you can only move directly forward and in no other directions at any time, which is DEFINITELY not optimal.
It is more efficient to have all of your bindings on the same side of your keyboard, regardless of whether you use WASD or not.
Less travel time, less chance of misplacing fingers due to that travel time.. it just doesn't make sense to be moving your hand across your keyboard when there are more than enough buttons on the left side, due to modifiers.
Shift + Q requires a lot less hand movement than hitting 0 on your keyboard, so is more efficient.


As Larynx said, if you honestly can not see the advantages of hitting 3 over hitting 0, this conversation is pretty much pointless.
You tend to be a brick wall in most of your posts.

On the bolded part: you must not have done arenas in any MMO then. Mouse turning is HIGHLY optimal even in PvE, too. All you have to do is hold down both left and right click and have your sensitivity up. I don't know where you get the idea mouse turning is garbage. Good for you, though, keep using A and D while I have my entire left hand free to press buttons all over my keyboard; no restrictive movement, all muscle memory, fully optimal.

Onward!

I'm not doubting that [x]+shift is useful...in other MMOS, however, it doesn't seem so much needed in GW2 specifically. The combat is more action orientated, thus you're not really going to need all kinds of crazy combination binds.

[PonyCannon]

I don't think hes saying mouse turning is garbage more that is good to use along with A/D strafe. He also seems to be talking about the possibility that most people don't want to have to move their hands all over their keyboards so use shift modifiers and such so they can keep their hands in mostly one place. This is how I personally play, I could not image using 1 through 0 even if I didn't have strafe bound.

[Delias]

On the bolded part: you must not have done arenas in any MMO then. Mouse turning is HIGHLY optimal even in PvE, too. All you have to do is hold down both left and right click and have your sensitivity up. I don't know where you get the idea mouse turning is garbage. Good for you, though, keep using A and D while I have my entire left hand free to press buttons all over my keyboard; no restrictive movement, all muscle memory, fully optimal.

Onward!

I'm not doubting that [x]+shift is useful...in other MMOS, however, it doesn't seem so much needed in GW2 specifically. The combat is more action orientated, thus you're not really going to need all kinds of crazy combination binds.

...
What part of "Strafing is optimal" led you to believe I keyboard turned?
When you hold down your right mouse button and hit A or D, you strafe. That way, you can continue looking at your target while moving at full run speed to the left or right.
How is only being able to move directly forward (because while you can turn with your mouse, I can do that to) advantageous over being able to move forward, forward-left, forward-right, right while facing forward, and left while facing forward?

Here, I'll bold this for you so you read it. I'm not saying keyboard turning > mouse turning, I'm saying that while mouse turning, you can use A and D to strafe, and that everyone I know who plays MMOs does just that. Because they're not retarded.
Not hard to figure out, but keep calling me a keyboard turning idiot.

[Psalma]

It's not just 1-10, its also F1-F4 and bind for weapon switch. I myself find it hard to reach longer than 6 and Fx buttons are abit tricky too. Maybe I just have small hands ALso, you can move just with your mouse but will still need WASD (or whatever you want) to dodge.

[Wynnyelle]

...
What part of "Strafing is optimal" led you to believe I keyboard turned?
When you hold down your right mouse button and hit A or D, you strafe. That way, you can continue looking at your target while moving at full run speed to the left or right.
How is only being able to move directly forward (because while you can turn with your mouse, I can do that to) advantageous over being able to move forward, forward-left, forward-right, right while facing forward, and left while facing forward?

Here, I'll bold this for you so you read it. I'm not saying keyboard turning > mouse turning, I'm saying that while mouse turning, you can use A and D to strafe, and that everyone I know who plays MMOs does just that. Because they're not retarded.
Not hard to figure out, but keep calling me a keyboard turning idiot.

... This, haha. I really don't know what else to say.

I PvPed on a competitive level and this is how I played the whole way through. Being able to strafe is not limiting in the slightest, and it certainly isn't the same as keyboard turning. In fact, I think that using only mouse-turning and limiting strafing entirely is what's limiting, because in order to move in another direction, you have to turn your character completely using the mouse in order to move in that direction, which turns the camera away from your opponent. By strafing, I am able to move away from my opponent as well as keeping my camera turned in the direction I need it in order to see what my opponent is doing in response. I mean, I guess different people adapt differently to their particular style of play, but while shift modifiers might not be important to you, they are vital to many other people who use this particular playstyle.

[Fencers]

There is actually a fairly optimal way to bind hotkets for right handed players and not a lot of wiggle room w/o a gaming mouse. Keybinds are one of those things which are not totally subjective. People simply come to this impression due to initial awkwardness or conditioning. In terms of operation there are only a few optimal bind points for right-y players.

And yes, A & D are strafe while all driving is done with mouse.

[Larynx]

There is actually a fairly optimal way to bind hotkets for right handed players and not a lot of wiggle room w/o a gaming mouse. Keybinds are one of those things which are not totally subjective. People simply come to this impression due to initial awkwardness or conditioning. In terms of operation there are only a few optimal bind points for right-y players.

And yes, A & D are strafe while all driving is done with mouse.

I think using W and the mouse is optimal since you have more freedom for the camera. In order to look behind you, you need to start strafing to the left or right instead of running forward, it's just awkward for me.

[Fencers]

W,A,D are acceptable with mouse driving. Ideally those are the only move keys. One can bind strafe to like T if they wish. The important thing is to optimize these sets of keys as primary use:



Do you really know how to tell if someone is bad? They use 1 instead 3 as their primary skill. 3 is most important key in hotkey MMOs.

[Larynx]

I use Q as my spam ability.

I'm better than all of you!

[Fencers]

I use Q as my spam ability.

I'm better than all of you!

It's not the best. Your index finger hovering over 3 is a lot more optimal in reaction to go 3>E, 3>2, 3>4, 3>R etc while your ringer finger goes ~, 1, Q, A, Tab and the modifers with pinky finger of Shift and Ctrl and thumb Alt.

[Delias]

I use Q as my spam ability.

I'm better than all of you!

Q is always my interrupt, since it's the easiest button for me to press and you generally want the fastest possible reaction speed on your interrupt.
E is just as easy to hit, but it's generally my CC break.

[Larynx]

It's not the best. Your index finger hovering over 3 is a lot more optimal in reaction to go 3>E, 3>2, 3>4, 3>R etc while your ringer finger goes ~, 1, Q, A, Tab and the modifers with pinky finger of Shift and Ctrl and thumb Alt.

What if I told you I only have half an index finger?

Also, I press tab with the pinky, and control with my lower palm. =D I don't use control ever though, because of that.

[Delias]

What if I told you I only have half an index finger?

Also, I press tab with the pinky, and control with my lower palm.

HOW IS THAT EVEN

=D I don't use control ever though, because of that.

Oh.

[Larynx]

HOW IS THAT EVEN

Oh.

Do not worry my dear, it all works out in the end.

Just like this cookie I'm eating. Last week, they tasted terrible. But they seem to have taken on a process similar to fermentation. Now they're wonderful!

---------- Post added 2012-03-25 at 11:57 PM ----------

I have to sleep, but to whatever response Fencers might have had, I lied about the index finger thing.

[terrahero]

Seems to me the OP made a decent post with things missing in the game and is asking for people with beta access to pay special attention to this.
Or would everyone rather wait with feedback untill the game is gold and then complain about all the stuff missing or wrong? Because if there ever was a time to give feedback to get some last minute changes, its the beta.

So "it beta" is NO excuse for features lacking or implemented wrongly. Its an excuse for bugs and balance issues.

[Purple]

It's not finished. The original poster knows this. When commenting on a game that's not out, it's obvious that you're commenting on a game that's not out. We can only discuss what we know, not what we don't know. Something, "not being finished and missing elements" is not a reason to stop discussing elements that may or may not be in/finished yet. Otherwise you might as well never discuss any, yet to be released, game at all and delete every forum, dedicated to said subject matter, across the internet from existence entirely.

I thought it might be suitable to make a list of concerns that those of us have as we watch from the sidelines. If any beta testers with the ability to post on the beta forums could: Please investigate any mentioned concerns and report them on the beta forums, if you'd be so kind.

Based on observations in gameplay videos and reddit comments:

- No button modifiers (Shift+X, Alt+X, Ctrl+X keybinds)
- No mapping of mousewheel.
- (Based only on the top two concerns, could anyone see if additional mouse buttons are mappable? Haven't heard any comments on this yet.)

I can understand these, especially the mapping of additional mouse buttons, since I've found I really like having axtras bound to my side mouse buttons. Though, I'm not sure how relevant it will end up being with so few skills equipped at any one time.. still, I can't fault you or anyone for bringing this up. Mapping has been a pretty valid concern in most recent MMOs I've played.

- Most people seem to want a customizable UI.

Well, on that note, GW1's was highly customizable and resizable. People liked that. I'd be truly surprised if they didn't have this in the works. I hope they do.

- Comparison tooltips do not show your alternate weapon set.

Hm. I noticed if they switched weapon sets it showed them. I don't think that works for the water weapons though.

- Cannot inspect other players.

I'm fine with this.

- No Duels

I found this to be a perk, actually.

- No /say chat function(short-radius chatting)

Another perk, but that may just be me.

- Buggy and/or unresponsive pet AI controls

Pets in GW1 left something to be desired too, I hope they work on this. I've seen too many MMOs, not just GW, with fairly questionable pet pathing and pet AI.

[DrakeWurrum]

- Cannot inspect other players.

I'm fine with this.

I can see why you might not mind missing a way to inspect other players, but it's going to get annoying over time, imo. I like to know what other people are doing. Maybe I'll learn about a build by inspecting another player of the same profession. The inability to inspect other players will NOT prevent elitist jerks from looking at you, paying attention to what you're doing, and then picking on you for supposedly not following the latest meta game. If they're a jerk, they're going to be a jerk to you one way or another. Lacking useful features will not prevent this.

And frankly, I think people are becoming too damn sensitive in this world. "Oh no, he might try to tell me 'how to play' or pick me out for underperforming!" Quit being such a pansy and tell him to shove off, imo.

- No Duels

I found this to be a perk, actually.

How is a missing feature a perk? I imagine a lot of people would love to be able to 1v1 each other in a private duel in order to test out the feel of their builds. Obviously this would be limited to the Mists, so no, you cannot complain about walking around/outside Org and getting spammed with duel flags.
They could even implement duels by creating a small 1v1 arena-type instance for people who want to duel, instead of having it all happen right out in the open in the Mists and causing clutter and lag.

- No /say chat function(short-radius chatting)

Another perk, but that may just be me.

Absolutely is just you, especially with the DE functionality of the game. If there's no /say functionality, that means we'll essentially have to be chatting in zone chat or whispers in order to communicate with the ungrouped people around us about the events we are participating in. Which means a zone chat could become heavily cluttered when multiple events are going on and people are trying to communicate with each other, which will only cause confusion and chaos.

---------- Post added 2012-03-26 at 10:05 AM ----------

I kinda want to add to the list: Automatic looting and aoe looting. I haven't heard a lot about this yet, for some reason.

Primarily automatic looting, however, because I've noticed in beta videos... when people loot mobs, they always open up a box and manually grab the loot. In the middle of combat even. Why aren't they automatically looting?

[Delias]

I can see why you might not mind missing a way to inspect other players, but it's going to get annoying over time, imo. I like to know what other people are doing. Maybe I'll learn about a build by inspecting another player of the same profession. The inability to inspect other players will NOT prevent elitist jerks from looking at you

Esp since they said they wanted to implement some sort of armory..
and if they plan to do that, it definitely sounds like a 'beta is beta' issue atm.
Doesn't make sense to have an armory and no inspect.