Shadow Priest Mists of Panderia

[kombucha]

From a PvP perspective: Purify is currently Holy/Disc only, we're losing most of our healing abilities, and for whatever reason Mana Burn is no where to be found on the current PTR.

PvP Shadow has the potential to totally suck right now, but we'll see how things evolve.

[Yvaelle]

From a PvP perspective: Purify is currently Holy/Disc only, we're losing most of our healing abilities, and for whatever reason Mana Burn is no where to be found on the current PTR.

PvP Shadow has the potential to totally suck right now, but we'll see how things evolve.

The biggest concerns for PvP I have are:
- No dispel protection on VT
- Mass Dispel costs 40% of our mana, and our spec has no mana right now (or to put it another way, it costs more than dispersion returns...)
- Mind Blast no longer supplied predictable high burst - which was the only argument to bring a spriest over an affliction lock the last two expansions

[Annesh]

Phantasm will be crazy good in PvP unless it gets nerfed, but we still need something to help vs. melee.

[kombucha]

Anyone else notice that in the current build of the PTR all three lvl90 Talent choices are literally useless for Shadow?

http://mop.wowhead.com/mists-of-pand...t-calculator#p

[Deleted]

Anyone else notice that in the current build of the PTR all three lvl90 Talent choices are literally useless for Shadow?

http://mop.wowhead.com/mists-of-pand...t-calculator#p

How are all three choices useless when they all do damage?

[Soranis]

How are all three choices useless when they all do damage?

They are all healling/damage abilities. However they all sound pretty 'holyish' so they will most likely kick us from shadowform. And unless there damage is AWESOME it isnt wortht he GCD you lose for returning to shadowform

---------- Post added 2012-04-01 at 05:40 PM ----------

If they would add the possibility to pick 2 talents in 1 row for example Twist of fate + Power Infusion that would solve the problem of some rows being completly useless for disc/holy or shadow and it will add alot more depth into the trees aswell.

[Deleted]

They are all healling/damage abilities. However they all sound pretty 'holyish' so they will most likely kick us from shadowform. And unless there damage is AWESOME it isnt wortht he GCD you lose for returning to shadowform

Ohh noes, how horrible to have a choice between three different spells that can both do damage and heal the raid....
That was sarcasm btw.

[mmoscreenshotproof]

As an spriest main since TBC (playing since vanilla) and a beta player, I am not happy with the current version of Spriests. We seem to have many mana issues currently in MoP beta, and shadow orbs just seem useless. The Shadow Orbs now are an additional resource that is only used for one spell (shadowy apparitions) which used to just happen automatically anyway. AA is also bugged or something but I assume that will be fixed.

THE MOST ANNOYING thing is that SWP no longer gets refreshed by mindflay, and reapplying SWP is actually costly, especially during trash pulls. Without improved Spirit Tap we just dont have efficient mana replenishment for trash (also no more replenishment lol).

This can all be fixed and I hope it does

[jplusl]

They are all healling/damage abilities. However they all sound pretty 'holyish' so they will most likely kick us from shadowform. And unless there damage is AWESOME it isnt wortht he GCD you lose for returning to shadowform

---------- Post added 2012-04-01 at 05:40 PM ----------

If they would add the possibility to pick 2 talents in 1 row for example Twist of fate + Power Infusion that would solve the problem of some rows being completly useless for disc/holy or shadow and it will add alot more depth into the trees aswell.

no there's a spell for shadow priests as well http://mop.wowhead.com/spell=120644/dark-halo

[FieryBull]

The class is obviously still deep in the work-in-progress area. Drawing conclusions at this point in time would be irresponsible.

[Yvaelle]

The class is obviously still deep in the work-in-progress area. Drawing conclusions at this point in time would be irresponsible.

I don't think anyone is drawing conclusions about "OMG this is how it is in Beta so this is how it will be in 5.0!", we're drawing conclusions and recognizing problems in Beta - recognizing problems is the most important step in fixing problems - how are we supposed to provide useful feedback about our class without sharing our negative experiences and discussing what was bad about them?

[kombucha]

Ohh noes, how horrible to have a choice between three different spells that can both do damage and heal the raid....
That was sarcasm btw.

Ok... A GCD counts for a lot, anyone with an extended amount of time playing end-game will tell you the same, from both a PvP and Raiding perspective.

also "btw" your attempt at sarcasm blew up in your face and made you look foolish. Congrats!

:edit:

On topic: When I step back for a moment, the utterly incomplete feel of shadow in Beta has me rather excited actually, as it implies we still have some surprises to look forward to.

[Yvaelle]

On topic: When I step back for a moment, the utterly incomplete feel of shadow in Beta has me rather excited actually, as it implies we still have some surprises to look forward to.

Yep! ^^ I'm still very hopeful for shadow in MoP, my critiques are just trying to guide change and encourage conversation so we see it to fruition!

NOM FRUIT IONS!

[FieryBull]

I don't think anyone is drawing conclusions about "OMG this is how it is in Beta so this is how it will be in 5.0!", we're drawing conclusions and recognizing problems in Beta - recognizing problems is the most important step in fixing problems - how are we supposed to provide useful feedback about our class without sharing our negative experiences and discussing what was bad about them?

Honestly at this point our feedback can't really be useful, until they implement more of our class.

[kombucha]

Anyone see that Void Shift does work on your own MC'd target? Could be a pretty amazing survivability cooldown and source of damage for shadow.

[Deleted]

Well, regarding Dark Evangelism... I've never fully understood why on earth they put it in. I mean, they remove Shadow Weaving because it gives a rampup time but Dark Evangelism does just that. Ok it's nice to use with Dark Archangel and all but the way they changed it is the way it shouldve been really. A dps cooldown that you can use for nukephases. Now it's more a manareturn than an actual nuke buff because you use it on cooldown anyways.

Evangelism for spriests was put in because they got pretty far into the Cata beta before realising there was fuckall in either the disc or holy tiers for spriests. People were going 3/0/38 or other daft builds because there was nothing else to do except fill out the shadow tree. This lead to us getting archangel, which was nice as we lack in dps cd's, but unfortunately coincided with Blizz realising that mastery affecting only MB would lead to either 1. spriests one-shotting people in pvp or 2. mastery sucking as a stat. Therefore emp. shadows was introduced as a fix, leading to spriests having a much higher ramp-up time in Cata than we'd had before.

[Purple]

Ohh noes, how horrible to have a choice between three different spells that can both do damage and heal the raid....
That was sarcasm btw.

The reality is, in their current wording and form, they don't stand up, they do not hold up, for Shadow.

-

They're Holy spells.

Shadow's specialization doesn't support mana management of Holy Damage spells, it doesn't support the scaling of Holy spell Damage, it doesn't even support the ability to use them in the state it's meant to be played in (Shadowform) which further lessens our Damage, our Mitigation and completely nullifies our Raid Wide Haste support. It's one thing to look at this as, "It's not finished, they obviously need to do more work to make sure these are at all useful to Shadow, as well as the other specs" but, when you ask, "How are these useless" it seems you're blind to the fact that these would be extremely weak damage spells in the hands of a Shadow Priest on a very real gameplay and mechanics level, not even getting into the Thematic issues. It's not even counting the GCD and extra mana usage issues of having to pop in and out of Shadowform to even use them.

So, no, they don't hold up in their current form. Beta isn't over. A sensible person would see that they quite simply can't stay as they are, to be at all viable tier choice for Shadow. In which case one wouldn't ask how they're useless, because it's obvious why they don't stand up, instead one would just realize that.. they have to change. The current state just doesn't work for all specializations, which is Blizzard's goal.

A noble goal, I suppose time will tell how possible such a goal is.

-

With that in mind..

http://mop.wowhead.com/spell=120644/dark-halo

I doubt the name is a coincidence.

[Yvaelle]

@Wyred

It wasn't really a higher ramp up time, it was about the same as all past expansions - but when the dev team last beta were saying they reduced it - they ended up just replacing Shadow Weaving stacks and the like with Evangelism stacks.

Nice catch Purple, I hadn't seen the Dark Halo link yet

[Purple]

@Wyred

It wasn't really a higher ramp up time, it was about the same as all past expansions - but when the dev team last beta were saying they reduced it - they ended up just replacing Shadow Weaving stacks and the like with Evangelism stacks.

And the Orbs, I remember thinking it was funny to have the Orbs manifest in the way they did, given their explanation for axing Blackout Stuns. I miss that random stuns where a Warrior Charge me and Blackout would proc at the same time they'd stun me, I always had to imagine a very annoyed expression on their face just to make it funnier.

Nice catch Purple, I hadn't seen the Dark Halo link yet

I'm hoping I'm not completely crazy for seeing that and.. hoping.

[Prod]

It's already been mentioned in other thread numerous times about finding Dark Halo in the database. Considering that not only the name, but cool down, cast time, and even spell description matches it word per word, only with shadow replacing holy, it's more than a coincidence.

The other thing is with Divine Star. Oddly enough, it says divine damage. Going by WoWWiki's description of divine magic (link), both Holy and Shadow are listed under divine magic. Finally, look at Divine Star's effect #2 in the database. It lists Divine Star - Launches a massive bolt of shadow energy.

I can't find anything about Cascade though.