10 man HC warmaster wont die for us

[Deleted]

I dont post often here but this ones really needing help.

My raid team can kill the 10 man warmaster, we have had over 160 wipes in just over 2 weeks and seem to be hitting our head against the wall.
we are a steady progression team with everyone above 398 (some 403) ilvl and raid 3 times a week but i cant help feeling 160+ wipes on nerfed content with out gear is bad. i mean guilds cleared that boss pre nerf with prob less gear than what we do.

i dunno how to take the nxt step for the game, keep going and fine tuning the wipes or wait till MoP and reform a better team

any help or critism will be useful

thanks for listening

[Resentful]

Well for one we could use a WoL log or what is your raid comp atm. Would be very helpful before we can help you really

[Deleted]

i dont wanna hurt anyones feelings after the amount of time we spent raiding, i guess im asking if its worth my while keeping this going or is 160+ wipes avarage in the nerfed DS hc bosses, if its crap i will stop raiding and look to MoP for a new guild raid team

[Resentful]

i dont wanna hurt anyones feelings after the amount of time we spent raiding, i guess im asking if its worth my while keeping this going or is 160+ wipes avarage in the nerfed DS hc bosses, if its crap i will stop raiding and look to MoP for a new guild raid team

Well I'll be honest, With that amount of wipes and such along with the nerfs if I was you; I'd literally leave and find a new guild that's just me however if you insist on going we can do our best to help if you give us resources as I've stated a WoL log and your comp

[Deleted]

I would say keep at him. Our team only managed our kill last night after we started to learn the patterns of the encounter.

Where & what exactly are the issues here, as we've just downed it I'm sure I can give you some hints.

[Deleted]

Your approach is kinda negative here. You are just simply asking 'should I stick with them or move on?'. We can't tell you either way because you aren't giving us anymore info. With your current thought it's not worth going on, because you simply don't seem to want to (and if you think like that they are better off without you as well).
If you, instead, could give us some logs or at least your setup + tactics used we could perhaps comment on that and see if there is anything you should differently.

But yes, it is crap to wipe that many times. Shouldn't happen so much.

[Azshira]

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...ss-quot-Thread

Please read the sticky on how to make a useful post about wiping and how the community can help fix it. Otherwise we can't help you. All you're saying is you've wiped 160 times or more and no extra info.

[Dorfie]

It's a tough boss. We wiped to him for a few weeks before getting out first kill and we still do now even though we are 8/8 HM.

[Blackmist]

Sounds like you just haven't got the tactics right. Key is killing the drakes and soaking the small swirls. We spent ages wiping in P1 because of that. Not had many tries at P2 yet though, although it looks somewhat simpler and less random.

Oh wait, this is MMO Champion. 160 WIPES U SUX GO BACK TO LFR BADDIE SCRUB, etc.

[Temp name]

try spine heroic, that'll hurt you.

OT: what setup are you using? how fast are you getting the drakes down? are you killing the sappers? is there too much fire? whats the issues, without those we can't help

[Deleted]

we dont run WoL anymore as it made alot of ppl fall out over tiny things and i didnt want that happening, as for set up we run with ...
2 tanks...warrior tank, druid tank,
2 melee...dk frost, rogue combat,
3 ranged...lock destro, mage fire, hunter surv,
3 heals.. 2 holy pala, resto shaman

the highest dps is about 30k with players all around 26- 29k dps
not sure we can 2 heal it tbh

we die on silly things as u can guess maybe if someone linked a good video that we can see where we are doing it wrong,
the fire on the ship is the worst thing and the onslught kills us alot 2

[Curanhadin]

dps seems low for the item levels you say you have imo

[DistortionSleep]

Seems like you guys aren't soaking the barrages very well. If you have people soaking them properly fire shouldn't be an issue. Also no one should be dying to onslaught if everyone stacks, including the tanks. Well if you have the debuff from barrages then yes people will die to onslaught. Those people just need to stand out. With the nerfs you can survive onslaughts with like 7 people (I wouldn't recommend it though).

[Grimbold of Skullcrusher]

Here you can see our first kill of (nerfed) Blackhorn on heroic. Took us about 30-40 tries to get the basterd down. We are using 2 healers, because the fight is not that healing intensive if you do all the crap properly. Basically our tactic is soak all small barrages before first Onslaught, then only 2nd tank and 1 fire mage or spriest with dispersion soak a barrage every now and then and its just enough if you kill the dragons asap.
What helped us a lot was that I solo tanked first 2 wave of adds and 2nd tank could help with dps a bit and mainly soak as much barrages as possible. Is there anything specific which kills you? Our biggest prob was charge after Onslaught, but if you stack with 10 ppl inside, blow a cd(tank 4-p is usually enough) and then spread out asap it should be fine.

[Venara]

Having 3 healers probably hurts you most. The fight can easily be 2-healed and with an additional ranged DPS you will find the phases are much shorter and drakes die sooner. You will also want your tanks to bring the melee adds over to one drake and have your melee and tanks cleave the drake also to have it die faster. Overall, this results in fewer barrages and less fire.

Additionally, as has already been pointed out, the average DPS you mention seems a tad too low for the average item level you say your guys have. One less healer and and more DPS, preferrably ranged, will help with this also.

Onslaughts really shouldn't be a problem if you have all people standing in it (leave people with 2 debuff stacks out though). Use raid cooldowns to reduce damage. You say you have 2 Holy Paladins. With Resistance Aura and 2x Aura Mastery, you should be able to cover at least 4 of 6 barrages without major problems. Have your tanks cover the other 2 with their Shied Wall type cooldown if they have the 4 piece set bonus. You can also make use of the Spirit-Link totem for at least 2 barrages. Essentially what I'm trying to say is: Your comp has enough raid cooldowns to survive Onslaughts easily.

The only thing to look out for with Onslaughts is to move out once the hit has landed. If you don't, the melee adds will just charge into the group (and the one add also has a cleave that hurts a lot). This would likely cause deaths and can be avoided by simply spreading out immediately after the hit lands.

[SilverSnake]

This is probably the fight that still gives us the most problem after having cleared 8/8hc 9 times now. The fire seems very random to us and can royally screw us over for P2.

But you have a druid tank, that is a good start. It's the role I play as well in this encounter and it can give you a good leg up on it. Have the druid tank build a cat/bear hybrid spec and 100% dps through P1, your other tank should be able to survive tanking both adds on his own if you focus the Slayer add over the Dreadblade one. This buys you a lot of extra dps on sappers, drakes as well as these adds.

We split the dps in two equal halves, melee in one group and ranged in the other (with some adjustments if we're unbalanced). The melee group goes to one drake, where the adds gets tanked as well (for cleaving fun). We never have drakes fly off after being harpooned, so we only need to soak a few barrages to make the ship survive (but it does give us silly amounts of fire at times).

Make sure you really exploit that you have a druid tank, kittybears will help you a lot not only here but on Spine and Madness as well, makes for a big difference!

[Kennpai]

You should definitely be 2 healing this fight

[announced]

lots of good advice here. one of the key points being have a single tank take both adds at once while the other helps soak small barrages with a ranged.. this means u wont get distracted by swirlys cause for the most part it'll be taken care of.. the bigger swirlys have everyone stack aside from debuffed people and use dmg cds.

since u have a fire mage and cleave u can benefit by having them pre-dot the drakes at the start of the fight. and bring the melee adds to the drakes for cleave /bladeflurry/combustion dmg. the fight can be 2healed and its spose to.. just burn the drakes in time and watch carefully. if u can avoid stupid deaths from charge n stuff making it to p2 usually means a kill. other than spine this is considered the hardest fight in 10m heroic so dont get discouraged.

[Deleted]

thanks very much for ur help guys u have pointed out alot of things we can look into, going forward with the boss

just 1 more thing.... is 160 wipes before getting to the point i need to ask if im doing it right or wrong a bad way to handle raiding, plz be honest about that. i cant go another expansion with this kinda wipe-athon. i might need to look for better players :S

thanks

[Venara]

just 1 more thing.... is 160 wipes before getting to the point i need to ask if im doing it right or wrong a bad way to handle raiding, plz be honest about that. i cant go another expansion with this kinda wipe-athon. i might need to look for better players :S

Trying on your own first is never a bad thing. Most raids figure out strategies for themselves anyway I'd rather say it's a good thing you asked for help when you noticed that you have exhausted your own ideas. I would suggest to maybe check in with other players sooner next time. You can save yourself a lot of time