Inferno question I would LOVE to find a solid answer to

[Lorsk]

Am thinking this could only be definitively answered by a blue, but I'll give it a shot here in case I missed a quote somewhere.

My question is this:
Does anyone know if it will be even remotely possible to get any piece of gear that could be considered best in slot in acts 1 and 2 inferno?
(I'm not talking just great gear, or gear that is better than SOME items in acts 3 and 4. I'm talking about the chance for the *absolute BEST* randomly generated to perfection items in the game having a chance to drop, even if a ridiculously small chance.)



I was not happy with the change to "de-flatten" inferno such that acts 1, 2, and 3-4 drop different "tiers" of gear. I know Bashiok has stated something along the lines of them being simply "visual tiers" like the different armor types in D2. But this isn't exactly the same thing because stats in D3 are allocated automatically. There is no strength investment for higher armor gear and all that. So there is no sacrifice made to wear the end gear in D3 and so I suspect the last tier will always have the highest potential of random stats, and therefore the absolute best gear will all by coming from that "visual tier."

The argument saying that this is all fine seems to consist of, "Well, it's still possible to get an item in act 1 that's better than an item in act 4!" I don't get why this keeps getting repeated; it seems to just state the obvious and dodge the question.

The problem with this, is that even if it's possible to find great gear in acts 1 and 2.....if it is the case that the ONLY way to get a perfectly generated "tier 18" item is from acts 3 and 4, then to me that really puts a damper on my excitement for playing acts 1-2, for a change of scenery/gameplay.

In other words, if it is the case that there is *ZERO* chance of getting a piece of the best possible gear in the game from acts 1 and 2, I don't see a lot of people playing those acts hardly ever again once they get to act 3, even if they are just scraping by and having an utterly frustrating experience banging their head against the act 3-4 wall.

If anyone could point me to a blizz quote since they de-flattened inferno saying there will be at least SOME best in slot items that have a small chance to drop in act 1-2 inferno, it would really make my day.

[Dispirit]

they've said some of the best gear in the game can drop in hell difficulty since item stats are random. it's all in how lucky you are.

[Deleted]

Am thinking this could only be definitively answered by a blue, but I'll give it a shot here in case I missed a quote somewhere.

My question is this:
Does anyone know if it will be even remotely possible to get any piece of gear that could be considered best in slot in acts 1 and 2 inferno?
(I'm not talking just great gear, or gear that is better than SOME items in acts 3 and 4. I'm talking about the chance for the *absolute BEST* randomly generated to perfection items in the game having a chance to drop, even if a ridiculously small chance.)



I was not happy with the change to "de-flatten" inferno such that acts 1, 2, and 3-4 drop different "tiers" of gear. I know Bashiok has stated something along the lines of them being simply "visual tiers" like the different armor types in D2. But this isn't exactly the same thing because stats in D3 are allocated automatically. There is no strength investment for higher armor gear and all that. So there is no sacrifice made to wear the end gear in D3 and so I suspect the last tier will always have the highest potential of random stats, and therefore the absolute best gear will all by coming from that "visual tier."

The argument saying that this is all fine seems to consist of, "Well, it's still possible to get an item in act 1 that's better than an item in act 4!" I don't get why this keeps getting repeated; it seems to just state the obvious and dodge the question.

The problem with this, is that even if it's possible to find great gear in acts 1 and 2.....if it is the case that the ONLY way to get a perfectly generated "tier 18" item is from acts 3 and 4, then to me that really puts a damper on my excitement for playing acts 1-2, for a change of scenery/gameplay.

In other words, if it is the case that there is *ZERO* chance of getting a piece of the best possible gear in the game from acts 1 and 2, I don't see a lot of people playing those acts hardly ever again once they get to act 3, even if they are just scraping by and having an utterly frustrating experience banging their head against the act 3-4 wall.

If anyone could point me to a blizz quote since they de-flattened inferno saying there will be at least SOME best in slot items that have a small chance to drop in act 1-2 inferno, it would really make my day.

As per Blizzard most of the non-hardocre-player will not be able to defeat act 3 + 4 in inferno. Most of the players will be happy to be able to kill at least something in Act 1 and 2.

Inferno mode is heroic mode in WoW... and Act 3 and 4 as per Blizzard is HC Lich King, Madness whatever without buffs... so, perhaps 2 or 3% of the players will defeat this mode, unless the average D3 player is much better than the average WoW-player.

[bossmonster]

I think they stated yesterday in the developer chat that some of the best items only drop in the last acts of inferno. Looking for a source atm.

[brirrspliff]

i don't really know, but i hope they make the best gear only droppable in the very last tier. trash farming is not so much fun. people would farm act1 endlessly until they can faceroll the rest of inferno. that's not how it should work.

[Lorsk]

As per Blizzard most of the non-hardocre-player will not be able to defeat act 3 + 4 in inferno. Most of the players will be happy to be able to kill at least something in Act 1 and 2.

Inferno mode is heroic mode in WoW... and Act 3 and 4 as per Blizzard is HC Lich King, Madness whatever without buffs... so, perhaps 2 or 3% of the players will defeat this mode, unless the average D3 player is much better than the average WoW-player.

I understand all this, but I'm just trying to find out if it is the case whether or not *ALL* of the absolute perfect items will drop exclusively from Acts 3 and 4, or if there will be even an infinitesimal, ultra miniscule tiny chance of getting a perfectly randomized item with the *highest possible* ideal stats in the earlier inferno acts.

[Deleted]

even if inferno is very hard, with videoguides out will it realy be that hard to defeat them?

[bossmonster]

Guest-352: How much does the difficulty and greater item quality drop change when your buddy enters the world to play with you?
Jay Wilson: Depends on the difficulty level you are playing in. I can’t remember ‘exact’ numbers, though. It hovers around doubling monster health per player, but there are other variables as well.

Guest-217: Are the end of the act bosses still going to be the enemies with the highest drop rates for the most sought after gear resulting in “Baal Runs” being the best way to gear up, or will you encourage players to scour the map looking for rarespawns and giving them a higher drop rate instead
Jay Wilson: We have a new system called “Nephalem Valor” that encourages you to kill randomly placed rares and champions. When you do, you get a stacking buff that increases your gold and magic find, and increases the drops on bosses. This makes it most beneficial to play through random content, then go fight bosses.

Guest-351: My question is….. So if inferno has its own gear tiers Act1 – Act4 will all the normal thru **bleep** gear end up being trash or will some items end up being good way past their level unique items?? Thanks in advance .
Jason Bender: You’ll need to gear up for a while prior to Inferno, so He|| gear will still be valuable for a while. Inferno ramps harshly, though, so you’ll need to farm early inferno to handle late inferno. There is a point where gear becomes useless, but a perfectly rolled rare or legendary item can last a long time if it has the affixes you need. Don’t forget crafting components, too. Old items can be used to crafter better ones.

Guest-785: Can you craft “inferno” level gear? if not what is the highest level gear you can craft?
Jason Bender: Yes, and it’s awesome! It takes a lot of components to get to the best gear, though.

Guest-876: Is the best gear in the game (“potentially,” stats-wise) limited to dropping in Inferno difficulty, or are the differences between Inferno gear and end-game **bleep** gear mostly cosmetic or drop-chance related?
Jay Wilson: The top three tiers of items, which are the best, only drop in Inferno.

Guest-869: Are there any non-set Legendaries that will only drop in Inferno Act III and IV?
Jason Bender: Yes. Legendary items are dropped based on the level of the monster or chest, so we have several at the max level that can only be found in the end of Inferno.

There it is

[zjadow]

There it is

The bold part kinda implies two things tho. Yes there will be loot available only from act3-4 inferno which will be "BiS". But it kinda also seems like the "several" part implies there is stuff that drops from earlier content that would beat out other random drops from act3-4 inferno?

[bossmonster]

The bold part kinda implies two things tho. Yes there will be loot available only from act3-4 inferno which will be "BiS". But it kinda also seems like the "several" part implies there is stuff that drops from earlier content that would beat out other random drops from act3-4 inferno?

The quote is explicitly on legendary items. But I would think, the same mechanic applies to randomized items as well (monster level being the significant factor). As only Act 3 and 4 have lvl 64 monsters I would assume they drop the best randomized items too. Don't know about boss levels in previous acts / difficulties though.

[Lorsk]

The bold part kinda implies two things tho. Yes there will be loot available only from act3-4 inferno which will be "BiS". But it kinda also seems like the "several" part implies there is stuff that drops from earlier content that would beat out other random drops from act3-4 inferno?

Yeah. Thank you bossmonster for that quote but I feel like that is only telling us that there will exist some best in slot gear that is only from acts 3-4, but still does not answer the question of whether it is possible to get any best in slot gear from acts 1-2.

[bossmonster]

Yeah. Thank you bossmonster for that quote but I feel like that is only telling us that there will exist some best in slot gear that is only from acts 3-4, but still does not answer the question of whether it is possible to get any best in slot gear from acts 1-2.

They repeatedly said that loot from earlier acts and difficulties (with high rolled stats) can be better than that from later on (with average rolled stats) and last you quite a while. But that also means, the very best loot that you can possibly get will come from the very end of the game - meaning act3/4 inferno.

[Deleted]

I think we're going back a few months for that information, I'll see if I can dig up the blue post on it but I'm sure I read that you would still be able to get rare drops from hell that are equivalent to act1/2 inferno, and rare drops from act 1/2 inferno that are equivalent to later tiers. Hopefully I'm not going senile and remembering that wrong, I'll try and find a reference.

[Lorsk]

Hopefully I'm not going senile and remembering that wrong, I'll try and find a reference.

I hope you aren't either. I'm gonna be so sad if best in slot is completely exclusive to acts 3 and 4.

I don't think change of scenery is gonna be good enough for most players if it's literally not possible to find in acts 1-2.

I could even handle it if the drop chance was like 50 times as high in act 4 vs act 1. I just need the possibility! Haha.

[Tokas]

I think we're going back a few months for that information, I'll see if I can dig up the blue post on it but I'm sure I read that you would still be able to get rare drops from hell that are equivalent to act1/2 inferno, and rare drops from act 1/2 inferno that are equivalent to later tiers. Hopefully I'm not going senile and remembering that wrong, I'll try and find a reference.

i remember this as well

[Deleted]

I think this is what I was thinking of

Now, you may be saying “I thought you wanted us to be able to farm anywhere we wanted. Now we only have half as much area in the game to farm in? What gives?” Our goal is to make the loot mathematically better in the later acts without making the earlier gear completely obsolete. We feel Diablo II actually did a very good job with this and we expect Diablo III to perform similarly.

Specifically, people in D2 did Diablo runs, Mephisto runs, Pindleskin runs, Pit runs, Baal runs, etc. because the loot in Diablo is extremely random. Even though the theoretical best items might come from the later Acts, well-rolled items from earlier acts will still be better. Internally we find sometimes after an intense session of brutally hard Inferno it can be really fun to cruise through Hell Act III or IV and it’s not too uncommon surprise when an upgrade drops. We expect this to carry through to Inferno difficulty where somebody who can theoretically farm Act IV will likely still enjoy romping through Act I simply because the drop potential is still there. It’s all because of the highly random items having lots of overlap in their power distribution curves.

[bossmonster]

I think there will certainly be (legendary) items that drop of act 1 and 2 mobs that will be best in slot for some builds / classes. Higher item level does not necessarily equal better item. Also I doubt all best in slot gear is squeezed into the last two acts. But you will likely have the best chance on getting it there.

[Nerraw]

I think we're going back a few months for that information, I'll see if I can dig up the blue post on it but I'm sure I read that you would still be able to get rare drops from hell that are equivalent to act1/2 inferno, and rare drops from act 1/2 inferno that are equivalent to later tiers. Hopefully I'm not going senile and remembering that wrong, I'll try and find a reference.

I remember this as well. I think it's due to the stat randomization on all items that allows this to be possible. The average item is better in Inferno than the average item in Hell, but you can get high-range items in Hell that are better than the average in Inferno. Or something to that end.

Edit: Ah, you found it.

[Lorsk]

I think this is what I was thinking of

Now, you may be saying “I thought you wanted us to be able to farm anywhere we wanted. Now we only have half as much area in the game to farm in? What gives?” Our goal is to make the loot mathematically better in the later acts without making the earlier gear completely obsolete. We feel Diablo II actually did a very good job with this and we expect Diablo III to perform similarly.

Specifically, people in D2 did Diablo runs, Mephisto runs, Pindleskin runs, Pit runs, Baal runs, etc. because the loot in Diablo is extremely random. Even though the theoretical best items might come from the later Acts, well-rolled items from earlier acts will still be better. Internally we find sometimes after an intense session of brutally hard Inferno it can be really fun to cruise through Hell Act III or IV and it’s not too uncommon surprise when an upgrade drops. We expect this to carry through to Inferno difficulty where somebody who can theoretically farm Act IV will likely still enjoy romping through Act I simply because the drop potential is still there. It’s all because of the highly random items having lots of overlap in their power distribution curves.

Thank you for hunting that down, but reading between the lines it seems like it's probably what I'm afraid of. That being that yes, while you very well can find AWESOME gear in the lower acts of inferno or even hell when compared to inferno 3-4, it still seems like to get the theoretical absolute best, you probably HAVE to be running those last two acts.

Perhaps....non set legendary items that are best in slot will have a chance to drop in inferno 1-2, similar to uniques in D2? I really do hope so.

[bossmonster]

Perhaps....non set legendary items that are best in slot will have a chance to drop in inferno 1-2, similar to uniques in D2? I really do hope so.

No way to guarantee it pre launch, but it is highly likely.