How can most guys here time their combustion?

[reflection]

Hello everybody

I'm just wondering if I'm too stupid or if it's just gear... I read everywhere that you should pop combustion at exactly this moment and spread it at that moment. Of course I would do that, but the reality is that this stuff is all about procs. I can imagine that you get a lot more reliable hot streak procs with better gear (Gear of my toon is about 387ish - excuse the missing gems got the gear yesterday in the evening).
I always read something like:

On Hagara use it after phase 2 (the phase with 100% more damage). Ok... nice... but this phase lasts exactly 10 seconds and it's very realistic that there is no hot streak proc in 10 seconds.

So
1. is this all blabla and it's just luck?
2. am I doing something wrong (I even waited a little bit after casting fireball to pull instant pyro because of ignite munching when waiting for a nice ignite for combustion)
3. do I need better gear?

I really want to help my raid but my DPS completely sucks. On Ultraxion HM I think I pulled about 25k.

There's another example: On Yohrsaj it's over imba to spread the combustion in the black phase (to those tiny adds). But how can I spread it if I don't get a good ignite or don't have the proc. Fishing is not an option - it just takes too long and ignite is running out or if I have already cast combustion the dot runs out and looses its value.

What do you prefer: 13k ignite combustion and use it when it's ready or wait for a ignite above 20k?

I really want to get better Hope anybody can help!!

Thanks!!!

I will see if I can get a log in the next days.

[Deleted]

I recently started lvl my 60 rogue and find myself in same situation.. feels like i must get the gear to make use of it properly.. kinda "sucks" a bit

[Blueobelisk]

Yeah man it happens. Some fights I'll be top DPS, and other Riggs I just won't have luck And be on the lower part of recount.

Unless I get good RNG I don't spread combustion on feedback for hagara, I spread it on ice tombs for nice AoE.

[xtramuscle]

Im gonna guess and say you raid 10man? (in which case it isnt worth using combustion on tombs). You can help by hardcasting pyro just before the phase ends, on both frost phase (you should be in the middle) and on lightning you can stand still to chain the conductors to make sure you have pyro dot, then LB and fish for an ignite.. but honestly for 10man HC Hagara, I much prefer arcane. TOP fire parses are still higher, but I can reliably hit 40k as arcane, where as you need to be very lucky to meet the same dps as fire.

[rokk]

Well first off you don't need a hot streak to combust. The pyro dot while ideal, is not huge. All you need is a living bomb and a decent crit from fireball, which will give you a good ignite.

When you're in a situation like Hagara and have only a short window of opportunity to benefit from a potent buff or debuff, never wait for a hot streak. Take your first big ignite and as long as lb is up pop combustion.

A tip however... A lot of times when I get a fb crit in these situations and there's still a little time left, I'll cast 1 more fireball. If it doesn't crit I still have time to combust the ignite from the first fireball. If does crit, then I'll get a pyro.

[reflection]

@xtra: thanks for the hints will try those in the next run

@rokk & blue: ah ok... then you would prefer the 13k use it as soon as possible strategy. Yesterday I got 4p bonus. I think that will rock even more can't wait for the next raid! I will try to keep combustion on CD. Thanks mates!

[Rambard]

Just keep in mind, if you're aiming make sure you can impact your combustion around, proc impact FIRST then fish for that ignite. Praying for impact after you get a good ignite and combustion going can sometimes be the most aggravating thing in the world.

[rokk]

@rokk & blue: ah ok... then you would prefer the 13k use it as soon as possible strategy.

Yeah it's an easy choice if you think about it. A 13k ignite under a big buff, haste proc, etc will do more damage than a 20k ignite without any buffs, plus give you more combusts on the fight overall.

Even on a fight without buffs or debuffs I tend to combust on any good ignite regardless of whether or not the pyro dot is up in order to get the most combusts in a single fight. Again it's simple logic, 4 combusts with a 13k ignite is more damage than 2 combusts at 20k ignite, and more consistent damage as well. This becomes even more important with the 4pc you just got.

[reflection]

Yeah it's an easy choice if you think about it. A 13k ignite under a big buff, haste proc, etc will do more damage than a 20k ignite without any buffs, plus give you more combusts on the fight overall.

Even on a fight without buffs or debuffs I tend to combust on any good ignite regardless of whether or not the pyro dot is up in order to get the most combusts in a single fight. Again it's simple logic, 4 combusts with a 13k ignite is more damage than 2 combusts at 20k ignite, and more consistent damage as well. This becomes even more important with the 4pc you just got.

Yes that's right. I think it's the same for each CD. One should use it nearly asap.

@Rambard: Well that's just the problem if you don't get a crit in about 10 seconds especially when single targeting.

[Deleted]

I always struggle with timing - when you get a fireball crit you are normally casting another fireball when you see the crit - do you stop that FB to cast combustion or do you finish that cast then combust. I never know if I should interrupt a cast to combust if I see a big crit?

[Azatos]

I always struggle with timing - when you get a fireball crit you are normally casting another fireball when you see the crit - do you stop that FB to cast combustion or do you finish that cast then combust. I never know if I should interrupt a cast to combust if I see a big crit?

Depends on the ignite size. Also, make sure you have a combustion macro, that looks something like this
/stopcasting
/cast combustion

With that, if you happen to see a ridiculous ignite pop up, no matter what you're doing...you can bang out a combustion asap to make sure you catch it.

[reflection]

Normally I don't wait for the next cast. But if you see a 40k ignite (e.g. on hagara) I instantly stop casting and combust

[Rambard]

Depends on the ignite size. Also, make sure you have a combustion macro, that looks something like this
/stopcasting
/cast combustion

With that, if you happen to see a ridiculous ignite pop up, no matter what you're doing...you can bang out a combustion asap to make sure you catch it.

That macro is actually bad policy. If you react too quickly, you run the risk of throwing up combustion without waiting for the ignite to actually apply. That's just all sorts of dps fail =-/.

[Azatos]

"ignite pop up" means the same thing as "ignite to actually apply".

[Deleted]

When I saw this on the front page, I thought it had something to do with men's health.

[Azutael]

When I saw this on the front page, I thought it had something to do with men's health.

That made my day lol.

I do not play a mage as main, but i find fire to be extremely frustrating. It's to random imo, and think that's kind of a known complaint about the spec.
Some times I can do a crapton of dmg, but other times it's horrible as hell.

Timing combustion is probably the hardest part for me, even with the addon "combustion timer" I got problems getting off those awesome combustions.
Needless to say, I ditched fire and went with arcane instead. Even with arcane being so damn boring, at least you don't get weird looks like if you are frost :P

[Dreamy]

I recently started lvl my 60 rogue and find myself in same situation.. feels like i must get the gear to make use of it properly.. kinda "sucks" a bit

Did you even read the post? o.0 Rogues - Mages two different things I think.

[Deleted]

If you don't have the CombustionHelper addon, I strongly suggest you get it. It helps you keep track of your dots, especially ignite. I mostly use it to keep track of my living bomb and look out for big crit numbers manually. If a big number hits, I switch my focus over to CombustionHelper to see if ignite is already applied, and as soon as all three bars are up, I hit combustion, and I almost always get pretty nice combustions.

You should not wait to throw your pyro after a fireball, and here is why: I don't know if ignite rolling still happens, but if it does, then both crits will be counted into the ignite and it will be extra oomphy. If not, don't worry. Since the pyro is cast later, it will hit later, and since pyro usually hits harder, it will overwrite the smaller fireball ignite. If only one of the spells crits, there is no doublecrit to interact anyway.

On Hagara, what I usually do is, I try to place myself, so I can precast a pyroblast, before the last pillar goes down. That way, my pyro hits almost the instant the shield goes down, and if I'm lucky, it is a crit already. Immediately after pyro goes off, I put up a living bomb, and that's all I need to get the best combustion result for this fight. Doesn't always work, and in that case I just use it during the normal phase on any decent crit as described above.

On Yohrsaj, it sometimes helps to keep a hot streak for a few seconds, instead of just throwing it out the second you got it. If you know that adds will be coming, and you got a fresh hot streak, keep your cool and wait for them to spawn. In the meantime, maybe refresh your living bomb. Then hit them with a blastwave, ones all of the adds are in the group, which should grant you a fireblast proc (not always though). Now you have everything to set of a huge combustion and spread it, it works for me 90% of the time. Of course, sometimes you don't get a pyro crit and/or a procc to spread, but usually it turns out nice. One additional flamestrike or a dragon breath should also work to fish for a procc, and I would advise you to do it, since the combustion spread is extremely important to get the adds down quick. Try to instapyro + combust after you get the procc, because otherwise there might not be much left, once you actually spread.

On Ultraxion, combust as soon as possible and as often as possible. Don't wait for the 10 stacks to reduce the cooldown, use the first as soon as possible and then as soon as its off cd and you got a decent crit.

For all of this: You're going to have to practice it a bit, but you'll figure out the right timing soon enough.

[reflection]

Actually I'm doing a bit better in the mean time. Thanks for all those tips! Today I did 36k on Zon'ozz and about 32k on Yor'sahj (had no luck here with my combustion and my guild has better gear then me causing the adds to go down very fast). I think that's ok for my 390ish gear