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  1. #61
    Over 9000! Glorious Leader's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hraklea View Post
    I'm not sure what you're talking about. You questioned why companies change good games. I told you they do to make them even better. There are people that disagree that Diablo could be better? And those people are "a lot"?

    You'd be surprised how many think it's perfect... let's just say they lack any sense of discernment or critical thinking IMO

  2. #62
    most new things are nothing more then polishing existing concepts
    And "how to polish something" is an innovation.

  3. #63
    Blizzard are not really a dev known for innovation.

    What made Blizzard special was design savvy. Blizzard games are designed with a keenness equaled by only a handful developers in the world. And only a handful of games in the history of the medium.

    Diablo 3 isn't spectacular because it is different from Torchlight. The genius, D3 is a masterwork of design, of Diablo 3 is expressed in something as small as... the sound of clay pots breaking.

    Innovation? The notion is absurd, false even. Iteration is the Blizzard secret.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fencers View Post
    Innovation? The notion is absurd, false even. Iteration is the Blizzard secret.
    This is it exactly. Blizzard doesn't just keep going until it's good enough. They keep going until it feels absolutely right. And they don't re-invent the wheel when they clearly don't have to in order to make good games.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erin View Post
    I only saw a few minutes of it but it looked slicker than a lubed up olympic swimmer fleeing from a shark.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    . They keep going until it feels absolutely right.
    REALLY... IMO they needed to keep going a bit for d3.. it lacks the spark their other games have..

  6. #66
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    blizzard could have remade d1 and d2 and it would still be a success imo, cuz alot of ppl never played it and a bunch of us wouldnt mind playin it again lol
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  7. #67
    Blizzard never was about innovative games, it was about doing classic genres the right way. Starcraft and Warcraft were not very original RTS games but they were great RTS games. WoW also wasnt that innovative but it was done much better then any other MMO before it. Not sure about diablo since i dont know if there were such hack and slash games before it? D1 was one of the first games i played.

  8. #68
    innovative

    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post
    Even Blizzard themselves said that they are not known for being innovatic (innovational? Whatever).

    They take existing and working concepts and polish them.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    REALLY... IMO they needed to keep going a bit for d3.. it lacks the spark their other games have..
    To me it feels right. The server stuff can suck at times, but the game itself has what I was looking for. Things change over the course of 12 years, more than people think. It was never gonna be a carbon-copy of D2 with a new storyline.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erin View Post
    I only saw a few minutes of it but it looked slicker than a lubed up olympic swimmer fleeing from a shark.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    REALLY... IMO they needed to keep going a bit for d3.. it lacks the spark their other games have..
    Which has nothing to do with being the sequel to one of the most lauded over PC games (seriously, D2 is the PC's FF7) and having been hyped up by the fanbase for the past decade or anything
    Theron/Bloodwatcher 2013!

    Quote Originally Posted by Alsompr View Post
    Teasing, misdirection. It's the opposite of a spoiler. People expect one thing? BAM! Another thing happens.

    I'm like M. Night fucking Shamylan.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by hailey View Post
    Innovation is the creation of better or more effective products, processes, services, technologies, or ideas that are accepted by markets, governments, and society. Innovation differs from invention in that innovation refers to the use of a new idea or method, whereas invention refers more directly to the creation of the idea or method itself.
    Nailed it. People are combine both words and assuming innovation is invention.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistuhbull View Post
    Which has nothing to do with being the sequel to one of the most lauded over PC games (seriously, D2 is the PC's FF7) and having been hyped up by the fanbase for the past decade or anything
    It doesn't. Gaming has evolved since diablo 2. Diablo 3 doesn't reflect this enough IMO. It's a tired model that has failed to keep up.

    ---------- Post added 2012-05-22 at 08:27 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    To me it feels right. The server stuff can suck at times, but the game itself has what I was looking for. Things change over the course of 12 years, more than people think. It was never gonna be a carbon-copy of D2 with a new storyline.
    I didn't expect a carbon copy, in fact I expected more change and more evolution.

  13. #73
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    I think people are overlooking something fairly important.

    Blizzard conquered the MMO market by being innovative.

    Blizzard conquered the Dungeon Crawler by being innovative.

    Blizzard destroyed the only other major RTS titles (CnC) by being innovative.


    The did this stuff many years ago. They do not need to be innovative with crazy and insane new gameplay styles because no other developer has managed to give them any sort of competition in the genres they focus on.
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Gold and the 'need' for it in-game is easily one of the most overblown mindsets in this community.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    I didn't expect a carbon copy, in fact I expected more change and more evolution.
    That's the problem with a series that's so old and so popular. Either people will find that the game isn't enough like the previous games, or that it is too much like the previous games. Blizzard can't win. No one can win that.

    ---------- Post added 2012-05-22 at 10:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Anjerith View Post
    Blizzard destroyed the only other major RTS titles (CnC) by being innovative.
    To be honest, that was helped along a lot by EA's general douchebaggery half a decade ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erin View Post
    I only saw a few minutes of it but it looked slicker than a lubed up olympic swimmer fleeing from a shark.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by mistuhbull View Post
    Which has nothing to do with being the sequel to one of the most lauded over PC games (seriously, D2 is the PC's FF7) and having been hyped up by the fanbase for the past decade or anything
    Diablo 2 is not the PC equivalent of FF7, a title that had insane success due to the luck of being a game that "stuck it to Nintendo" in a period in which doing exactly that was some sort of social gold medal.

    ---------- Post added 2012-05-22 at 08:35 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    To be honest, that was helped along a lot by EA's general douchebaggery half a decade ago.
    I absolutely agree with you on that.
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Gold and the 'need' for it in-game is easily one of the most overblown mindsets in this community.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    That's the problem with a series that's so old and so popular. Either people will find that the game isn't enough like the previous games, or that it is too much like the previous games. Blizzard can't win. No one can win that.[COLOR="red"]
    That's a bit disengenious. IF ANY DEVELOPER has enough favour with their audience it's Blizzard. They could have turned d3 into anything as long as it was fun people would support them. It's Blizzard. It's Diablo 3. Even if what you say is true that's no excuse for doing a meh job and not pushing themselves or the game forward enough.
    Last edited by Glorious Leader; 2012-05-22 at 08:38 PM.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurmwhale View Post
    altho its hard to blame them since fans of their core games seem to want the same game updated to todays standards, and that seems to be what we more or less got between Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3. I'm just not sure if they're over-catering to their rabid online ladder fanbase more than gamers as a whole by repeating the same successful formula to the point the games are almost identical to their predecessors.

    Obviously they have Titan on the horizon which will likely be something new but i can't help but be disappointed with their remakes of older games. I'm surprised they spent 7 years doing D3, and however many doing Starcraft2, where they more or less felt like graphical updated versions of their original releases. Granted i'm not Blizzard's typical B.net online ladder player, more than casual gamer that leans single player campaigns. ITs gotten to the point i don't think i'll be buying another Blizzard re-release again, feels like a complete waste of money more than many other games i've purchased. Haven't touched SC2 for a long time after finishing it, and D3 is going to wear out quick from what i can see...i just feel disappointed in how much work they supposedly put into them only for those games to feel so much like i've already played them :P
    Though I understand your complaint in theory, in practice you're complaining that a sequel is similar to the game before. Duh. That's how sequels work. If they weren't, the internets would be exploding with millions of people arguing that Blizzard has lost the soul of Diablo and Starcraft by making their sequels so terribly different from the first game(s). If you've grown tired of Starcraft and Diablo, that's more than fine. Try another game, try another hobby! But that's what sequels do, and if they aren't similar to the games before all hell WILL break loose.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Atrahasis View Post
    That's a bit disengenious. IF ANY DEVELOPER has enough favour with their audience it's Blizzard. They could have turned d3 into anything as long as it was fun people would support them. It's Blizzard. It's Diablo 3. Even if what you say is true that's no excuse for doing a meh job and not pushing themselves or the game forward enough.
    And a lot of people do enjoy what they have been given. Could it have been more? Sure, any game can. But as with any other (sane) developer, Blizzard learns as they go along. Compared to what happened to the game over the next 10 years, the 1.0 version of D2 wasn't exactly spectacular either. Blizzard will take what feedback they can from this and incorporate it into an expansion in a way that fits best possibly with whatever they already have planned for it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Erin View Post
    I only saw a few minutes of it but it looked slicker than a lubed up olympic swimmer fleeing from a shark.

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerraw View Post
    And a lot of people do enjoy what they have been given. Could it have been more? Sure, any game can. But as with any other (sane) developer, Blizzard learns as they go along. Compared to what happened to the game over the next 10 years, the 1.0 version of D2 wasn't exactly spectacular either. Blizzard will take what feedback they can from this and incorporate it into an expansion in a way that fits best possibly with whatever they already have planned for it.
    See but were back in the 2000 mindset. Yes d2 was crap at start so it's okay that d3 is crap at start because well d2 got better and so will d3. How long was the development of this game? 10 years? 5 years? I hear so many mixed fucking answers. If they didn't listen then what makes you think they'll listen now? Did they not beta test the crap out of this game? Blizzard is usually very good at that. It's shit and the shittiest part is that of course people will still buy the expansions and reward them for it.. The status quo keeps rolling along because everyone is a bit to complacent

  20. #80
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    Blizzard are being innovative by using existing things and putting them in the perfect places.

    It's pretty clever of them.

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