Mistweaver Monk Guide

[Felade]

but on the other hand Death is a bigger DPS loss than movement, so be aware of your own hp and if an orb is next to you and you think you might not get a heal.. sidestep lose 25dps and not die

But they give everyone self healing and defensive CDs, and don't make damage so life-threatening that if you don't run over that orb (or have a MW or a Holy Priest) you'll die. "Death is a DPS loss" is another overused defense of this mechanic. Its true, but it also misses the point.

[Luqt]

Sorry to butt in, just wanted to ask if there's any news on the addon RenewingMistWatcher, it really is a jewel

[Castif]

I keep trying to express how I feel felade but I cant just seem to get the feeling in my head to translate into words. Suffice to say I think the Orbs are a lot like Healthstones. Good players will use them, bads will die.

[Tatuin]

Affinti made a thread for it on the macro/interface section here and asked for help. Lets hope some kind person takes it up

[MixelPlx]

I keep trying to express how I feel felade but I cant just seem to get the feeling in my head to translate into words. Suffice to say I think the Orbs are a lot like Healthstones. Good players will use them, bads will die.

Haha. Well said

[Felade]

bads will die.

What I'm saying is that yes, they will die, but they die because they stood in fire, not because they didn't use orbs. I've not used my healthstone (or not had a Warlock) on my Shadow Priest quite often and I am almost always the last to die when we wipe. Whenever there's a serious mechanic that I can, I'll use Dispersion or my PW:S, and if we've set up a strat with Divine Hymn (now Symbiosis: Tranquility) I'll use that but for general raid damage I'll just let the healers handle it, especially if my DPS is really important at that time (think HM Zon'ozz). One of the first things I checked about Monks when I thought about rolling one was the self survivability buttons - thankfully we have a whole lot of those in all 3 specs.

From a DPS perspective, using these orbs (or lightwell, or healthstones) isn't absolutely imparative. The healer cares a lot more than the DPS if these get used or not, which is the recipe for a failed mechanic. The orbs work better because at least you don't have to click on them, and they will always be in a pretty convenient spot. They're still pretty unattractive as Mastery (even for very organized guilds).

[Deleted]

Moin moin,

Is for the Mastery orbs also a Spam time up like 2-3 min or they will be remove after leaving combat ???

Your,
Holy

[MixelPlx]

UPDATE:

• Je'lyu, Spirit of the Serpent has been added to the gear list.
• "Factions. Which one first?!" should be put in by tonight or tomorrow.
• Addon list and compilations will be put in tomorrow.

This being said, we're literally 9 days away from release. Those that have tested Mistweavers and feel comfortable discussing it(hopefully you do here!) if you have any other recommendations to the guide now is the best time to contribute so we can give upcoming Monks reliable information on Day 1.

As for Addons, I'll be adding these shortly so if you know any particular addons that either help the "Healer" role or are made specifically for Mistweaver, please post it!

[Lyriok]

Snip!

Just had a look over it again, seems everything is perfect (excluding addons)

* Fingers crossed for my recommended addons

I really can't believe how close to release it is, this year has really flown by for me.

[Mistfit]

Grid, clique, vuhdo, weakauras, quartz, fortexoquist (or something like that), elvui, tukui, lui, DBM, Omen, Bartender.... etc

[Zaak]

Raiders have a lot to worry about. They have to worry about their rotation (and if your DPS are anything like our DPS, worrying about trinket ICDs, timers, buffs and whatnot, that's a fair amount of worrying). Then they have to worry about various mechanics of a fight, and their own self healing and survivability CDs. And then they have to basically do your job for you by running over orbs/clicking a lightwell? People act like raiding is easy whenever these interactive abilities are brought up, but we all spend lots of time thinking/writing/doing this stuff and no one's one-shotting heroic modes here. These interactive abilities take up more mental bandwidth than they are worth either in power or in terms of designing compelling gameplay.

MW mastery isn't quite as involved as Lightwell (at least you don't have to click and the orb places itself), but having the DPS do your job for you/and/or having your performance determined by other players isn't compelling gameplay. I'd be happy if Blizz just quit it with these mechanics, but they seem to really like them (I think they like them for trying to get raiders more aware of whats going on around them).



He has to walk through the sphere (remember, movement is a DPS loss for most folks) to get the benefit.

Pretty much this. Movement which is not caused by boss mechanics is DPS loss. And no, it's not 25 DPS. It could be way more if you're moving all the time "Because I have to touch the fking orbs to get some heal". It won't be a problem if you overgear a fight, but with preraiding gear every single thing counts and the orbs make it somewhat more difficult. Lightwell and orbs aren't a 1:1 comparison, but the people still have to do something to get healed by an orb. Sure, in 25-man when the melee are all together it won't be much of an issue, just because if one orb spawns it will be absorbed by another guy.
Also, you have no control over the orbs. Lightwell at least had to be clicked if you knew there was damage incoming, Lightspring now heals people with <50% HP. Orbs just spawn and if by chance there's someone standing with almost full health, it's wasted.

We'll just have to check in real raid environments how it works out with crappy gear. If it sucks, they hopefully will improve it

[Deleted]

Pretty much this. Movement which is not caused by boss mechanics is DPS loss. And no, it's not 25 DPS. It could be way more if you're moving all the time "Because I have to touch the fking orbs to get some heal". It won't be a problem if you overgear a fight, but with preraiding gear every single thing counts and the orbs make it somewhat more difficult. Lightwell and orbs aren't a 1:1 comparison, but the people still have to do something to get healed by an orb. Sure, in 25-man when the melee are all together it won't be much of an issue, just because if one orb spawns it will be absorbed by another guy.
Also, you have no control over the orbs. Lightwell at least had to be clicked if you knew there was damage incoming, Lightspring now heals people with <50% HP. Orbs just spawn and if by chance there's someone standing with almost full health, it's wasted.

We'll just have to check in real raid environments how it works out with crappy gear. If it sucks, they hopefully will improve it

Orbs pretty much always spawn within tapping distance of a player provided they aren't moving all the time

[Deleted]

Raiders have a lot to worry about. They have to worry about their rotation (and if your DPS are anything like our DPS, worrying about trinket ICDs, timers, buffs and whatnot, that's a fair amount of worrying). Then they have to worry about various mechanics of a fight, and their own self healing and survivability CDs. And then they have to basically do your job for you by running over orbs/clicking a lightwell? People act like raiding is easy whenever these interactive abilities are brought up, but we all spend lots of time thinking/writing/doing this stuff and no one's one-shotting heroic modes here. These interactive abilities take up more mental bandwidth than they are worth either in power or in terms of designing compelling gameplay.

MW mastery isn't quite as involved as Lightwell (at least you don't have to click and the orb places itself), but having the DPS do your job for you/and/or having your performance determined by other players isn't compelling gameplay. I'd be happy if Blizz just quit it with these mechanics, but they seem to really like them (I think they like them for trying to get raiders more aware of whats going on around them).



He has to walk through the sphere (remember, movement is a DPS loss for most folks) to get the benefit.

Im not big fan of those orbs/lightwell either but if they put mechanics like that in game and by moving little prevents you from dying why not use it? I kinda feel same like you that is stupid to make these random orbs to proc so healer dont have to do anything and it is just more to worry for Dps.
But if you progress Hc raid and you wipe because people dont want to walk over these orbs then i would change guild very fast.



Oh and i really cant wait for Hc bosses where we hit enrage timer... jumping around, dodging shit on the ground, trying to maximize dps while moving/kiteing/dodgingfire and trying to walk over some green orbs that will keep you alive.. thats gonna be fun :P

[Trickk]

You are missing http://mop.wowhead.com/spell=125669/glyph-of-uplift in your glyphs.

I have tested it and its kind of a double edged sword. Its amazing for your output and heals when you need them, and not all that expensive.

However it does leave you in a small bind if your not good at managing using your chi to generate your Tea charges.

[Mistfit]

Glyph of uplift I see being more important for the later tiers of raiding when spirit becomes a lower priority and mana regen is more comfortable. It is very powerful but also a drain on your mana.

[Jekerdud]

It's possible. I don't think it will happen though. I think people who don't use the glyph now will get comfortable with how we'll be doing it in tier 14, and not see the need for it. To me, there are other more useful glyphs. I am looking from a 25 man perspective though. Mana Tea, Zen Med, and Renewing Mist glyphs seem to be the three that'll have the most use.

[Deleted]

Some glyph questions - is glyph of ReM really that great? Just asking, havent tested it too much yet.

And another question - I will be focusing on challenge modes a lot, what do you think about them and glyphs? As far i figured out that Glyph of ReM would be useless there, and Glyph of ZM...probably depends on specific encounters. But what about glyph of roll (for getting rid of some add aggro before tank can grab them)? Or, as discussed - glyph of uplift (for burst healing large aoe damage spikes)?

[Jekerdud]

Glyph of ReM will see more use in 25 mans IMO. It will make spreading ReM between the melee pack and the ranged pack a little better. And with good tracking, you can have 12-19 ReM's going at once. If it's always going to the melee group (unglyphed), your AoE throughput will drop. For 10 man though, this won't be as much of an issue since you can just cast it on someone who doesn't have it yet. For challenge modes, it will be worthless.

I picked ZM just for the mobility of it, nothing more. Being able to pop ZM while running seems like it will be a good move in all raid sizes and dungeons.

Uplift... hmm. For challenge modes, we might run into the same debate about spirit regen there as you would for raiding. Since gear will be scaled, your regen might be nerfed in a challenge mode. If so, it might be a better idea to keep costing Chi UNLESS you find that you really, really need to be able to spam uplifts 5 times in a row. Keep in mind, you'll go OOM. If it came to that, you might be better off ZM'ing then casting the uplifts just to mitigate some of that damage. If you are going for gold, your group should be popping defensive CD's as well. For raids, I won't be using it for a good long while, and I don't see it shining until at least the end of tier 15.

For challenge modes, I guess Glyph of Retreat will be a good one if your tank doesn't have good snap threat. You could roll in and start jabbing and it'll be like a really weak tricks/md. Mana tea is a great choice for CM as well. If you are going for gold, you won't wanna stand around and drink, so just keeping it on cool down should keep you good to go for quite some time.

Life cocoon would be OK for challenges, but there isn't a lot of stuff in the 5 mans from what I've seen that would warrant using it.

For the rest for challenge modes.... there really isn't a great choice overall. The only other two that could get some use is expel harm and transcendence. Extra range would never hurt anything. SCK, while it would look good at first glance, for challenge modes it does sound like there won't be a lot of straight up AoE'ing.

[Alianthos]

Hey guys,

So I'm new here. Didnt try out MW on Beta, I only saw some vids + guides, and this thread. Overall, it looks very good.

One of the thing I'm looking forward to do is the ability to dish some serious damage and heal at the same time. For this only reason, I believe that MW will be enjoyable though the whole extension, and especially looking at 5m dungeons and challenges, where you can deal more and more damage when you get some gear, and still passively heal though Eminence and such. So MW could legitimaly considered a real healer, but would deal high amount of damage as well, thus increasing the clear time significantly. Maybe geared MW will actually be the best healing spec to get gold medals in Challenge mode ? Maybe we could see some MW legitimatly queue as DPS in LFR/Dungeon finder ? Here's hoping.

Anyways, I went though MW talents/rotations in the last days (and I do things thoroughly) and MW seem very fun to me. In the past, I only tried Resto Druid (in dungeons and raids) and I enjoyed it a lot (I'm a die hard warrior tank), and MW seems very nice. Also, it has a high skillcap it seems, which is even better. The more complex, the more rewarding it is when you succeed.

I still have my doubts regarding progression raiding and healer-DPS style the monk has. Is Eminence THAT powerful ? During progression I really cant see how I could spend a single GCD outside of healing spells. Are Jab/Tiger Palm/Blackout kick REALLY worth the GCD ? As I see it :
Jab = gain 1 chi (2 chi), deals damage, minor heal through Eminence. BUT if you are fishing for some Chi, you can justi channeling SM, healing instead of doing damage.
Tiger Palm = vital mist buff, which is useless if you channel SM
Blackout Kick = buff your healing out put though damage - so you have to keep doing damage in order to heal.

My point is, for real progression, I'm not sure if you could (or should) even consider going melee and hit the boss. Does the healing done though meleeing, eminence and such compensate the healing that could have been done though "classic heal" ? I just dont see it.

Dont get me wrong, I dont see it as a problem. As far as i'm concerned, for progression you could just focus on channeling your heals only,, and when the content is easier, or when the boss requires a huge amount of DPS and not so much heal, MW could really shine. And when the content becames trivial, geared MW would be in a really good spot, doing some serious, legit damage and healing WITHOUT GIMMICKS (like Smite).

Anyway here's my rant. I'd like some feedback about experienced MW on the beta ! Of course no one really tried "hard" MOP encounters yet so I guess no one really knows. Thanks.

[Zaak]

You won't be using melee skills the entire time. You stack the Blackout Kick twice and then you won't use it until it's time to refresh it, because you'll want to use the chii for other spells. On trash mobs it's possible to just heal through damage, maybe some bosses too, but only a few. Vital Mists doesn't only reduce cast time, it reduces mana costs as well. So if you know you won't be doing anything else, stack it up to 5.

About Jab & Chi. Jab gives you always 1 Chi, or 2 every 20secs. It happens that SM doesn't give you Chi at all because of the randomness. It happens that you get 3 with a single channel, maybe 2, 1...or none at all. So it's not that SM>Jab for Chi regeneration.

So what you do in melee is basically: Keep your buffs up and continue with your normal healing rotation. You just use Jab instead of SM.

What you won't do: Full melee rotation (basically J+J+BoK +TP once in a while) and top healing meters.