MoP: Ret Mastery vs. Haste

[Grognard]

On live I go for crit while leaving myself with 13 mastery points, on beta however...mastery all the freaking way. Haste is alright to have but, i'd rather hit like a truck than get a .5 second CD reduction of course that number is made up so don't take it literal. Heck I minus well reforge haste to crit in my eyes it's still the least valuable attribute.

Are you talking primarily for PvP or PvE? If PvP, I'll agree with you; PvE, on the other hand, is a totally different beast - and with Inq now providing crit, we'll probably want to gear more towards haste and mastery.

sorry for amssive quote but as far as im aware haste is a percentual decrease in swing/casting-timer or cooldown on the spells it affects so a 0.5 sec decrease in CD for CS would be a bigger decrease in the CD for judge since judgement has a longer base cooldown and it would also be a lesser decrease in the swingtimer cause of the swing timers 3.6 sec being less than CS 4.5. I recently got back to the game after being absent for about a year though so i might be wrong but i asume that the haste formula on wowwiki is still legit http://www.wowwiki.com/Haste

I wasn't aware of that being the way in which haste affected things, so thank you for that. I'm hesitant to trust the formula there on WoWWiki, as much of the information on that page does not seem to have been made current for Cata, and I wouldn't know where to start with it to make it fit what I'm trying to figure, anyway. But if the same haste that knocks a half a second off from CS knocks, say, three-quarters of a second from Jud, I think that'll still make haste pretty attractive in MoP.

[Snuxx]

what do you guys think about this post patch? Has Hand of Light damage/Mastery overcome haste?

[Aideren]

I haven't theorycrafted it myself but I'm sure a crusader strike nerf would have to favor haste even more.

[Requital]

I haven't theorycrafted it myself but I'm sure a crusader strike nerf would have to favor haste even more.

On the contrary it favors haste even less, Mastery is still top dog by leaps and bounds I can't see anything over taking it but I do see the possibility of a Haste break point that we aim for to smooth the rotation out but currently you can't reforge on beta w/o crashing so I can't really test.

[Divineknight13]

i will be extremely curious to see how this progresses

i tried out a haste stacking build early cata and it wasnt viable sadly compared to mastery stacking ... so just a few questions im really lazy to download mop beta and try it out

whats the time on your cs ?
does the rotation feel clunky with haste or is it noticeably smoother?
what 75 talent do you take for pve?

i guess thats all i can really think about for the moment

ty all in advance for your reply

[Requital]

i will be extremely curious to see how this progresses

i tried out a haste stacking build early cata and it wasnt viable sadly compared to mastery stacking ... so just a few questions im really lazy to download mop beta and try it out

whats the time on your cs ?
does the rotation feel clunky with haste or is it noticeably smoother?
what 75 talent do you take for pve?

i guess thats all i can really think about for the moment

ty all in advance for your reply

I've leveled to 90 a few times over, I can't reforge on beta so no idea what my stats are at but more importantly in 5 mans right now there is a buff scaling everyone's gear to 372 ilevel regardless what you have so it's not really a good time to test but i think my CS was @ 4.02 when i checked.

[Deleted]

i would imagine haste has several plateau's when it takes hammer/judge/cs down to the "1 less global between useage" so it will completely depend on your current achievable haste levels. while also depending on certian things like how much of the fight is in "execute" phase or how specifically "how much haste for an extra 1,2,3 hammer of wraths per wings"

imposibble to tell without working out each of the plateaus to be honest.

[kosechi]

i think we are probably going to hit a few break points for cs/exo/judge cooldowns, then go full mastery. i'm still wearing my full crit reforge pvp gear on the beta so i don't think i can test it.

i think pvpers will focus more on haste/crit though since haste lowers the cast speed on repentance and allows for quicker resource generation and crit will still be great for our heals.

[ipoststuff]

I dont think haste levels matter much. You see Sanctity of Battle reduce both CD and GCD. So no matter how much haste you have you'll have 2 gcd's between Crusader strikes. Say you got CS to 3 sec cd. by then your gcd will be 1 sec. and you'll still use 2 other abilities between 2 Crusader strikes.

For PvP haste will be my top choice. Unlike mastery it increases everything you do. Unlike crit its not based on luck. But i can see mastery being good too since our DPS cooldowns(75 talents) will be boosted a lot by mastery. Crit will be the looser of all three but it wont be a stat to avoid.

[Requital]

We'll never see a 3 second CD on CS and Haste won't be the proper stat for Ret in MoP.

[padort1]

I think if we could get CS around 4-3.7 sec, Then we should be able to stack Mastery from their.

[ipoststuff]

We'll never see a 3 second CD on CS

Heroism

and Haste won't be the proper stat for Ret in MoP.

For pvp it'll be my and probably lot of others main secondary stat. It provides a lot more than just damage.

[LolretKJ]

As of now I'm getting around 500-600 more dps with haste stacking. With the new Blessing of might, you already get a lot of mastery.

[Greelix]

Sanctity of Battle

Holy:

Spell haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of your Judgment, Crusader Strike, and Hammer of Wrath.

Protection:

Spell haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of your Judgment, Crusader Strike, Hammer of the Righteous, Consecration, Holy Wrath, and Hammer of Wrath.

Retribution:

Spell haste effects lower the cooldown and global cooldown of your Judgment, Crusader Strike, Hammer of the Righteous, Exorcism, and Hammer of Wrath.

Seriously guys you are missing two more abilities on top of crusader strike: Exo & HoW. ALL HoPo generating abilities are affected by both sides of SoB. All 4.

[Requital]

As of now I'm getting around 500-600 more dps with haste stacking. With the new Blessing of might, you already get a lot of mastery.

Since everyone is crashing when trying to reforge what exactly did you pull off to get reforging working?

---------- Post added 2012-07-25 at 05:05 PM ----------

Seriously guys you are missing two more abilities on top of crusader strike: Exo & HoW. ALL HoPo generating abilities are affected by both sides of SoB. All 4.

Doesn't matter unfortunately they need to change how Haste scales for us if they want us to use it.

[LolretKJ]

Since everyone is crashing when trying to reforge what exactly did you pull off to get reforging working?

---------- Post added 2012-07-25 at 05:05 PM ----------



Doesn't matter unfortunately they need to change how Haste scales for us if they want us to use it.

I reforged all my shit to haste when I hit 90 about 3 weeks ago.

[Deleted]

I reforged all my shit to haste when I hit 90 about 3 weeks ago.

Oh, so you're doing 500-600 more dps reforged to haste than you did 3 weeks ago where there was a different beta build?
Doesn't really sound trustworthy, especially since you have no source or proof of what you're saying is true. There's a lot of things we need to even care about your statement like Logs, stats, talent build, glyph choices, which fight? dummy or a boss?

Please feel free to find an actual source and prove what you're saying is true, because right now nothing you've posted is actually trustworthy at all.

[Requital]

I reforged all my shit to haste when I hit 90 about 3 weeks ago.

I hope they fix it soon need to fix expertise/hit and secondary stats

[LolretKJ]

Oh, so you're doing 500-600 more dps reforged to haste than you did 3 weeks ago where there was a different beta build?
Doesn't really sound trustworthy, especially since you have no source or proof of what you're saying is true. There's a lot of things we need to even care about your statement like Logs, stats, talent build, glyph choices, which fight? dummy or a boss?

Please feel free to find an actual source and prove what you're saying is true, because right now nothing you've posted is actually trustworthy at all.

Fair enough, give me a minute to take some screenshots. I was doing it all on dummies.

[Requital]

Fair enough, give me a minute to take some screenshots. I was doing it all on dummies.

The problem with that is then we would need someone in your exact gear reforged into Mastery to get a comparison and we can't unless you can reforge and if you can by all means try to test it in an instance with log reports, Screenshots while they do show results it would be better to be able to compare Haste vs Mastery logs.