1. #2581
    Would only recommend bubbling off after you've killed your share of bloods though, because you may need the primordius dot to kill the bloods.
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  2. #2582
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    I think it's the other way around (Blood dot increases dmg done to Primordius). :P


  3. #2583
    Primordius' debuff increases damage you do to all the adds (including the horrors). The Viscous Horror debuff increases damage you do to Primordius. Hand of Purity definitely works, since both debuffs can be removed with Divine Shield.

    Although I have never needed to get rid of either debuff with Divine Shield, assuming you're swapping the boss every 2 Viscous Horrors.

  4. #2584
    Ya but primordius damage isn't as vital as blood damage.
    Also primordius can hurt a lot with the wrong combination of buffs.
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  5. #2585
    Herald of the Titans Grimord's Avatar
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    Oh, I didn't get the part where his DoT also affected the adds! So we were both right as add's dot also increases damage to him :P. Sorry about calling you out wrongly, though!

    Thanks too, ccqpuodp, I don't think I'll be needing/wanting to use DS to reset stacks but it's good that it's possible so we know HoPur will work. I like to minimize surprises and cause unnecessary stress on the healers during progression. Thank you guys.


  6. #2586


    Prot pally cooldowns are glorious, tanking lu'lin through the enrage for 30s to nab our first kill was great. So close to 1 million dps >:

  7. #2587
    Mkay. So continuing with some more napkin math for the 4p bonus. Presuming 50% haste.

    Max uptime presuming no T5 talent and GC procs - 75%~
    Presuming low amount of GC procs (around 5% of your hopo) - 79.5%~
    Presuming averageish amount of GC procs (around 9% of your hopo) - 82%~

    If you use a 2 point WoG instead of a 1 point WoG (to get even bigger heal) when generating BoG HoPo, you lose about 2% uptime.

    Using WoG at 4 BoG stacks instead of 5 is a theoretical drop of about 1.5%, however what you need to consider is that this will cause less wasted HoPo, basically using WoG at 5 stacks will cause you to instantly gain 5 HoPo which leaves room for getting wasted HoPo aswell as DP procs if you use DP.

    Using DP, if you get a proc on the fifth SotR, you would use SotR again, that additional SotR would therefor not give you any BoG stacks. If you instead WoG at 4 stacks as a baseline, if you get a DP proc at the fourth one you can just use another SotR without overcapping BoG.

    If you get a DP proc from the WoG, if you used the WoG at 5 stacks you also have a higher chance of wasting HoPo than if you used it at 4 stacks. All in all, it is very close, but it is possible that using WoG at 4 BoG stacks could actually yield a higher amount of HoPo in practice, however the difference is almost non-existant. It is very possible though that it may feel smoother to use it at 4 stacks as a baseline.

    A few things to note.
    - If you get a DP proc on the 'last' SotR in a cycle, it is worth using another SotR instead of wasting the DP proc on WoG.
    - The 4 piece devalues DP in the sense that it will cause a lot of overcapping in HoPo, however it also increases that value of DP in the sense that each DP proc generates 3.8 HoPo instead of 3.
    - You also get one additional proc chance from the 1 point HoPo. Basically you can get 6 procs every 16 HoPo as opposed to 5 every 15, or 5 procs every 12 HoPo is you use WoG at 4 BoG stacks.
    -At first glance it may look like the value of DP is pretty much +- 0, since you get a bit more procs, and each procs gives you a bit more, however you will also waste a lot of HoPo simply due to overcapping because of DP. Current DP increases your SotR uptime by 33%. With the 4p it could very likely increase your uptime by closer to 40-45%, but we need to see it in practice to be sure. The way that BoG stack interracts with DP is intriguing.

    In the end, I cant wait to see how this works in practice.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  8. #2588
    Hi guys.

    Easy question:

    Trash thunderforged boots or crafted boots?

    do increased armor make up for loss on gem sockets, leading to haste loss?


    Edit: uhm, wowhead links not working in mmo? In a layer-on-mouseover sense.
    Last edited by Kethmil; 2013-06-24 at 11:49 AM.

  9. #2589
    Field Marshal Rhag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kethmil View Post
    Hi guys.

    Easy question:

    Trash thunderforged boots or crafted boots?

    do increased armor make up for loss on gem sockets, leading to haste loss?


    Edit: uhm, wowhead links not working in mmo? In a layer-on-mouseover sense.
    Gemmed, enchanted and double upgraded the Crafted boots easily comes on top in terms of haste they are very hard to beat.
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  10. #2590
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rhag View Post
    Gemmed, enchanted and double upgraded the Crafted boots easily comes on top in terms of haste they are very hard to beat.
    I'll only be replacing mine with the HC Twins boots, that's for sure.


  11. #2591
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    I'll only be replacing mine with the HC Twins boots, that's for sure.
    Ehh, I'm not so sure on that. Losing the extra socket hurts, and the Crit is mediocre compared to the mastery.

    The only boots I'd swap my 2/2 Crafted for would be RaDen boots, but even that's kinda iffy (no native haste). Crit/Exp isn't BAD, just not good either. Eventually though, ilvl > all.

    I tried to roll the boots and/or Ring last night, and got the dreaded "HERP DERP You're not eligible for loot off of this boss" message. /rage. I did rank on the fight as Ret though, (LOL!) even though I did abysmal damage. My PVP macro for t90 accidentally casted ES on MYSELF not once, not twice, but THREE TIMES! All with wings/trinkets up. /facepalm. Show's how much I PVE Ret these days...
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
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    20k and counting...

  12. #2592
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    Well, yea, the haste in those isn't optimal but the extra ilvl is kind of tempting... Specially if a TF version happens to drop (which I doubt, only fucking TF drop I got was shite).

    On the other hand we're beginning Dark Animus HC progression now and I feel like I'm gonna grow an extra pair of gray hair in the upcoming weeks. After Megaera, Twins, Primordius and Durumu that were such easy bosses to progress through I just know I'll feel like crying...


  13. #2593
    Quote Originally Posted by Nairobi View Post
    I did rank on the fight as Ret though, (LOL!) even though I did abysmal damage.
    You ranked 35 out of 44 haha

    Remind me of when our sub rogue ranked 5th on protectors elite mode, 5th out of 7.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  14. #2594
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    You ranked 35 out of 44 haha

    Remind me of when our sub rogue ranked 5th on protectors elite mode, 5th out of 7.
    Oh I'm sure it was bad. I basically sat out at the portals to eat debuffs and judged/exo'd (and tried to ES, but apparently cast it on myself half the time, ROFL). Then, I managed to kill 2 of the Anima orbs in last phase, and mysteriously died 15 yards away to the 3rd... And then the bonus roll bugged out. Ugh. But what does that say about the 9 people that I beat? Trololol....

    #1 Ret US.

    It's ok, on our first HC Meg kill, our BrM kiter got a top 10 rank with 7k DPS.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  15. #2595
    That moment when you are supposed to get rank 1, and do 80k more dps than the previous rank 1, and realise you forgot to combatlog it... Atleast I got pictures

    ---------- Post added 2013-06-24 at 08:20 PM ----------

    On a different note: Apparently they changed Ji-Kun again so that you can skip all the trash now once again. This is the fourth fix on Ji-Kuns trash, not sure if intended or not.

    Previously (readas 2 weeks ago) you could only skip the trash after you had pulled Ji-Kun once (broken the eggs), we used to send a rogue ahead and just go and pull ji-kun so everyone could skip the trash. Now you can just skip it without doing that once again.
    Last edited by Firefly33; 2013-06-24 at 08:20 PM.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  16. #2596
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    How do you skip his trash? I was under the impression it was an LFR thing only.


  17. #2597
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimord View Post
    How do you skip his trash? I was under the impression it was an LFR thing only.
    You jump down without internet and fly up with internet.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  18. #2598
    So do you people think we will keep haste control build as main build for the entire exp and next tiers full raid progress orr might there be some changes to go towards mastery?
    Because even now mastery is quite good.

  19. #2599
    Quote Originally Posted by Seanali View Post
    So do you people think we will keep haste control build as main build for the entire exp and next tiers full raid progress orr might there be some changes to go towards mastery?
    Because even now mastery is quite good.
    So long as Sanctity of Battle and the haste scaling of SS stay, we'll prefer haste.
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  20. #2600
    I am still trying to wrap my head around the interaction between DP and the T16 4p bonus. If anyone wanna throw me a bone I would be glad to help. Been up for over 24 hours now (turning my sleep rythm around to a more normal one), so not thinking the best.

    Okay, so this is the baseline I has been using. I have been using a 10 minute fight basis, 50% haste. I have been putting GC procs on the low end, since I like to plan my tanking around worst case scenario rather than best case. Normally GC is 7-15% of your HoPo but I have set it slighty above 5% just to be pessimistic.

    So in my 10 minute fight, I recieve a total of 351 HoPo in baseline (200/134/17), equal to 58.5% uptime.
    Factor in a DP and you got 78% uptime. If you instead check using the T16 4p without the use of any T5 talents, I instead break it into cycles (each cycle consisting of 5 SotRs and one 1 HoPo WoG). 351 HoPo would equate into slightly more than 31 cycles, to be precise 31 cycles + 10 HoPo or 159 SotRs, because those 10 HoPo transfers into 3 SotR, 1 WoG, 1 SotR. So in a perfect world scenario, just with the T16 4p, 50% haste and no T5 talent you could theoretically see 79.5% uptime.

    So far so easy, here comes to hard part. Throw DP into the mix. This is where my brain just stops working. Using a bit of napkin math from the numbers using 4p but no DP, you could imagine seeing 63 DP procs from those SotRs and WoGs orginally, throwing in T16 4p into that mix, those 63 DP procs turns into another 38 SotR (and 7 WoG), all in all adding up the 137% uptime. Though I know something is messing up in here.

    However I know I made some stupid error in this. So that is not entirely accurate.

    If you however take a different approach that is simpler. Each cycle consists of 1 WoG and 5 SotRs, with DP that would make exactly 2 procs. So on average you would have 2 free SotRs each cycle. This is of course presuming a perfect world where you never get a DP proc on the 5th SotR. What this means is that in each cycle, you would actually only have to generate 5 HoPo yourself. This would make those 351 HoPo we orginally generated into 68 cycles or an uptime of 170% !!!!!

    Now this is of course not applicable to real world, since in the real world you would sometimes waste a few HoPo by overcapping HoPo due to procs happening on the 5th SotR and on the WoG. However you should also remember that this is using a very very low amount of GC procs, GC procs could push this up a lot. Could probably be 180% with a more standard amount of GC procs. All in all, I would say a 140-150% uptime is not to far fetched with DP and 50% haste considering all the factors, however I would like to hear your opinions if I am just crazy since I feel kinda tired at the moment to do maths.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

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