[MoP] Protection Paladin Guide

[rhandric]

Thing is that the ilvl difference between the LFR Garrosh legs and the normal Tier legs is enough that the tier ones are probably superior anyway, so when I get a chance I'll definitely look into the other options, if there's a better itemized set I can use.

Most likely, yes. In your situation I'd definitely use the tier pants (until you can get the ones off Ordos), but still try to get other pieces of tier (so you can swap to the Ordos pants immediately when you get them without affecting whichever tier bonuses you want)

[MerinPally]

Is exactly what I'm doing. Using my coins for tier gear as my plan is to grab the 4set with the legs as offpieces.

[Toore]

Garrosh normal 10 questions:
1. Why on hell our frost DK sometimes gets desecrate on the face??
2. Usually if im tanking im doing it with bear (hate that guy - unmute him on mumble only when tanking with him) or a DK - im always on adds on P1 - i understand why with DK but I assume if its the bear he is better suited for adds (IF he stops gemming/enchanting for stam <_<) (side note: few attempts I went Holy and had 2 DK tanking - the usual one is saying he's unable to keep adds in this scenario - why?)
3. When im on add duty I have problems with aggro on first wave of adds (almost everything else beelines to me but first goes strait to healers/DPS) - how do you deal with it (im trying thors hammer on one side shield on other, not always helps)?
4. I tend to die sometimes on adds when we get out from first temple - GOAK? - but im using it on annihilates, dunno if its not healing issue (if I tank we 2 heal - rdruid and rshammy usually)
5. About annihilates - what cds to survive? I tested GOAK and AD - dunno if its getting consumed, is unglyphed DP ok to survive? How much annihilates hit? What if I bubble? When I get my tank cloak (gotta get moar goldz - using DPS one until now - I was told Ill heal Siegcrafter and up and didnt need tank one on previous bosses) will it be enough to save me (and bubble the debuff if bubble doesnt work on annihilates)?

About stat weights I go wit:
Hit (up to 7.5%) - 1.02
Exp (up to 7.5%) - 1.01
Haste (up to 20260) - 1 (alchemist with elixir 990 haste + stam food, considering change to stam flask for garrosh - but then im not technically one shooted when i die its 4-5 almoust simultanous hits from adds, dunno if ~1.8k stam will help)
Exp (up to 15%) - 0.7
Mastery - 0.6
Stam - 0.4
Armor - 0.3 (so AMR dont say to take colossus <_< - was 0.55 before)
Crit - 0.3
Str - 0.3
Dodge - 0.1
Parry - 0.1

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Toore/advanced

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Garrosh normal 10 questions:
1. Why on hell our frost DK sometimes gets desecrate on the face??

Not enough people standing far enough away from the boss

2. Usually if im tanking im doing it with bear (hate that guy - unmute him on mumble only when tanking with him) or a DK - im always on adds on P1 - i understand why with DK but I assume if its the bear he is better suited for adds (IF he stops gemming/enchanting for stam <_<) (side note: few attempts I went Holy and had 2 DK tanking - the usual one is saying he's unable to keep adds in this scenario - why?)

If the guy tanking the boss hits his AoE as the adds come into melee range, he'll be tanking them until they die.

3. When im on add duty I have problems with aggro on first wave of adds (almost everything else beelines to me but first goes strait to healers/DPS) - how do you deal with it (im trying thors hammer on one side shield on other, not always helps)?

Try tanking the boss for the first 10-20 seconds so that you have some Vengeance AP, Prot Pally AoE threat without Vengeance is non-existent.

4. I tend to die sometimes on adds when we get out from first temple - GOAK? - but im using it on annihilates, dunno if its not healing issue (if I tank we 2 heal - rdruid and rshammy usually)

What adds? left over from P1? You're supposed to clean them up in the 15 seconds between Garrosh running to the centre of the room and him pulling you into the first vision.

5. About annihilates - what cds to survive? I tested GOAK and AD - dunno if its getting consumed, is unglyphed DP ok to survive? How much annihilates hit? What if I bubble? When I get my tank cloak (gotta get moar goldz - using DPS one until now - I was told Ill heal Siegcrafter and up and didnt need tank one on previous bosses) will it be enough to save me (and bubble the debuff if bubble doesnt work on annihilates)?

Annihilate does 3.5 million shadow damage. If you are having trouble staying alive outside of the visions, and need the cooldowns in the normal realm then avoid the annihilates.

Armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Toore/advanced

If you feel like you need an extra physical damage cooldown, use Holy Avenger.

[Deleted]

Garrosh normal 10 questions:
1. Why on hell our frost DK sometimes gets desecrate on the face??
2. Usually if im tanking im doing it with bear (hate that guy - unmute him on mumble only when tanking with him) or a DK - im always on adds on P1 - i understand why with DK but I assume if its the bear he is better suited for adds (IF he stops gemming/enchanting for stam <_<) (side note: few attempts I went Holy and had 2 DK tanking - the usual one is saying he's unable to keep adds in this scenario - why?)
3. When im on add duty I have problems with aggro on first wave of adds (almost everything else beelines to me but first goes strait to healers/DPS) - how do you deal with it (im trying thors hammer on one side shield on other, not always helps)?
4. I tend to die sometimes on adds when we get out from first temple - GOAK? - but im using it on annihilates, dunno if its not healing issue (if I tank we 2 heal - rdruid and rshammy usually)
5. About annihilates - what cds to survive? I tested GOAK and AD - dunno if its getting consumed, is unglyphed DP ok to survive? How much annihilates hit? What if I bubble? When I get my tank cloak (gotta get moar goldz - using DPS one until now - I was told Ill heal Siegcrafter and up and didnt need tank one on previous bosses) will it be enough to save me (and bubble the debuff if bubble doesnt work on annihilates)?

1. He probably goes out of melee range. Desecrate can target everyone (or maybe not tanks dont remember) that is not in melee range of Garrosh. It is not targeting ranged specific. So if the DK goes out of range for whatever reason, maybe running after adds or something he can be targeted by desecrate.

2+3. Paladins are quite bad at picking up aggro on the adds compared to other tanks yes. Paladins are fairly strong at surviving the adds though, but picking them up is not the paladin strong side. If the DK cant pick them up then he is bad.

4. Shouldnt be any adds up when you get out. Anyways, strange that you die as the adds should be stunned while you are getting out. Healers not paying attention?

5. On Heroic I believe I used DP+AD->Stone Form+GoAK->DP+AM.
But hmm, something feels wrong about that since DP shouldnt be off cooldown.
Honestly, dont remember exactly how I used them, but if that worked on heroic it should work for normal aswell.
I think I might have been using DP+Stone Form -> GoAK -> AD+AM -> DP. I honestly cant remember exactly. I remember that I used DP twice atleast so definately started and finished with DP and used GoAK in the middle.

- - - Updated - - -

If you feel like you need an extra physical damage cooldown, use Holy Avenger.

I wouldnt use HA for Garrosh. You dont get that much effect out of it except for maybe in P1. I guess the burst damage from it could be useful in P3 burning.

But feels like the SotR part from both HA and SW would largely be wasted on Garrosh as he interrupts his attacks so often and you switch tanks a lot. Also the fight is so magical damage heavy.

[Zorachus]

My main is a DK Tank, but just got my Tankadin to 90 last week, right now just at i496 gear. I have 2,000 Valor points in my bag, and 6 Warforged seals, to help me get loot in Raids. What should I do with that, to gear up ?

One beef with my Tankadin, compared to my DK Tank. The Death Knight Tanks at warp speed, super fast attack speeds, I LOVE it, and the DK is great doing single target DPS in PvE when running my Dailes like Shado Pan rep I am going for.

Where my Paladin feels like he's tanking in slow motion, and spell refresh take forever compared to the Death Knight. Overall my Paladin Tanks super sloooooow, and I find it very boring to play him. Plus single target DPS in Dailies takes twice as long compared to my DK. Right now my Paladin Tank has 9% Haste rating. I assume try to get that up ? Whats the best way to increase +Haste ?

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Might sound stupid, but the best way to get your haste up is to get gear with haste rating. Look at the loot tables of the bosses and see which one to set your specialization to protection and which to set it to retribution for.

[rhandric]

Might sound stupid, but the best way to get your haste up is to get gear with haste rating. Look at the loot tables of the bosses and see which one to set your specialization to protection and which to set it to retribution for.

Gems are also a great source of haste - of my 18562 haste, 6720 comes from gems, a good 1/3 of my haste. Still not as important as getting proper haste gear, but quite valuable nonetheless.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

Gems are also a great source of haste - of my 18562 haste, 6720 comes from gems, a good 1/3 of my haste. Still not as important as getting proper haste gear, but quite valuable nonetheless.

Gem sockets will come with the "proper haste gear". You get a sum total of 3 sockets from the Timeless Isle gear; the Garrosh pants have that many sockets on their own.

[rhandric]

Gem sockets will come with the "proper haste gear". You get a sum total of 3 sockets from the Timeless Isle gear; the Garrosh pants have that many sockets on their own.

Oh, absolutely - timeless gear, even if you happen to get lucky and get haste gear from it, is still piss-poor for getting haste, is my point.

[Deleted]

My main is a DK Tank, but just got my Tankadin to 90 last week, right now just at i496 gear. I have 2,000 Valor points in my bag, and 6 Warforged seals, to help me get loot in Raids. What should I do with that, to gear up ?

With my 6 alts, which I horribly neglect, I've found the world bosses the best way to painlessly gear up. Save your seals for them, so you get 4 chances of 553 loot per week. And save your valor to upgrade whatever you are lucky to get. And pick ret loot spec for Ordos and prot for Celestials.

[pld]

My main is a DK Tank, but just got my Tankadin to 90 last week, right now just at i496 gear. I have 2,000 Valor points in my bag, and 6 Warforged seals, to help me get loot in Raids. What should I do with that, to gear up ?

One beef with my Tankadin, compared to my DK Tank. The Death Knight Tanks at warp speed, super fast attack speeds, I LOVE it, and the DK is great doing single target DPS in PvE when running my Dailes like Shado Pan rep I am going for.

Where my Paladin feels like he's tanking in slow motion, and spell refresh take forever compared to the Death Knight. Overall my Paladin Tanks super sloooooow, and I find it very boring to play him. Plus single target DPS in Dailies takes twice as long compared to my DK. Right now my Paladin Tank has 9% Haste rating. I assume try to get that up ? Whats the best way to increase +Haste ?

Considering the Paladin's top secondary stat is haste, you'll soon find that paladin tanking is fast paced. It definitely feels a little slo-motion until you can get your haste up to 25-30% (YMMV), but once you crack that threshold, it starts getting smoother.

With your valor, look at some of the Shado-Pan Assault pieces. The DPS ring (Crit/Haste) and Trinket (Expertise) are both good places to start depending on what you currently have and should be easy to get on a new character since it only requires Friendly rep. Also, if my math isn't completely failing me right now, you should be able to get both for just under 2000 Valor.

Run some LFRs and/or Flex and swap your Loot Specialization to Damage (will vary - will explain). Protection specialization gets Haste loot now, but certain bosses drop both Dodge/Parry (very poor stats for us) and Haste loot, and setting it to Damage will prevent you from getting poorly itemized pieces. Certain bosses you'll need to swap to Protection to get a chance at stuff like trinkets, weapon, and shield, so study up on loot tables! If you get lucky in LFR/Flex, it's also an option to upgrade your SoO gear vs. spending valor on the SPA pieces I referenced above. This is also the best way (only way?) to increase haste. You can use a Haste + Armor elixir too I suppose.

Paladins have a passive called Sanctity of Battle which lowers the CD and GCD of your primary spells based on haste so you'll find that getting better with more gear.

DK's will inherently do more DPS than a Prot paladin OOC, so there's not much you can do about that. However, since Prot uses haste plate, it's not a bad idea to learn how to play Ret and just double-dip with your gear. Your gear won't be fully optimized for Ret (ex. enchants/gems/etc), but it'll definitely be faster than trying to do stuff in Prot.

[Deleted]

Where my Paladin feels like he's tanking in slow motion, and spell refresh take forever compared to the Death Knight. Overall my Paladin Tanks super sloooooow, and I find it very boring to play him. Plus single target DPS in Dailies takes twice as long compared to my DK.

Yes, the first part will definitely change with haste. My L90 paladin feels like an energiser bunny - much faster paced even than my warrior tank, who used to be the one with the twitch play style. I find DK tanks the most sedate in their play style: yes, they have a 1 second GCD, but my impression is that with them it's not so much about spamming rotational buttons as timing the death strikes and the mini-CDs. As an old "turn-based" gamer, I may even enjoy the DK style more but it's fun pounding buttons with my pally in a raid too.

It does take haste though - my L42 paladin horde alt is stuck in limbo, as I find her almost unbearable to play after getting used to a L90 almost haste capped version.

On the DPS in dailies, just forget about being tank spec for that. Yes, it's not really an issue when you are well geared but even then - wearing the same gear as ret, it's just hilarious how fast things drop (especially with the dps cloak, which seems to proc on every pull doing dailies). But it's true, with the DK, I often wouldn't bother to switch out of tank form. It should get better in WoD, when tanks are given better base damage and it no longer scales with vengeance.

[Butler to Baby Sloths]

If you want to do dailies, you'll be done quicker with a blue geared retribution paladin than a 570 geared protection paladin. Add more gear to the ret pally and the difference is even more stark.

[Zorachus]

Yes, the first part will definitely change with haste. My L90 paladin feels like an energiser bunny - much faster paced even than my warrior tank, who used to be the one with the twitch play style. I find DK tanks the most sedate in their play style: yes, they have a 1 second GCD, but my impression is that with them it's not so much about spamming rotational buttons as timing the death strikes and the mini-CDs. As an old "turn-based" gamer, I may even enjoy the DK style more but it's fun pounding buttons with my pally in a raid too.

It does take haste though - my L42 paladin horde alt is stuck in limbo, as I find her almost unbearable to play after getting used to a L90 almost haste capped version.

On the DPS in dailies, just forget about being tank spec for that. Yes, it's not really an issue when you are well geared but even then - wearing the same gear as ret, it's just hilarious how fast things drop (especially with the dps cloak, which seems to proc on every pull doing dailies). But it's true, with the DK, I often wouldn't bother to switch out of tank form. It should get better in WoD, when tanks are given better base damage and it no longer scales with vengeance.

Thanks. So what's the Haste cap % for a Tankadin ? Right now my Level 90 Paladin is only at i502 gear, just DING'd 90 last week, and has 11% Haste rating, after reforging all gear stats to + Haste, and gem's with + Haste.

I have read about some Tankadins with 35% and higher Haste ratings, how do I get up there ?

[MerinPally]

21250, 50%. I had 35% haste in 506 ilvl gear, meaning I breached the 30% barrier even lower. If you're wearing timeless isle gear or something then you won't reach those sorts of levels, my gear was well itemized from raiding (a little bit).

[Deleted]

21250, 50%. I had 35% haste in 506 ilvl gear, meaning I breached the 30% barrier even lower. If you're wearing timeless isle gear or something then you won't reach those sorts of levels, my gear was well itemized from raiding (a little bit).

Yeah, was breaching the 30% easily in T14 normal mode gear. If your haste is that low it is either timeless gear or gear without haste or both.

[Zorachus]

Would be great if WoD changed the Tankadin to have a 1s GCD. I find it so much more fun to play that way. My DK Tank is blast mainly due to that 1 second fast timer, and when a Paladin Tank is at crazy 50% +Haste it makes that spec a million times better to play IMO.

[Dastuross]

I have to agree, it isn't an issue now because we can haste cap (1sec GCD) but the start of next xpac will seriously suck without so much haste.

[Deleted]

Hey guys,

My dps seem to be quite low compared to our other tank, tbh i'm not sure what i am doing wrong. Anyone mind helping me out? http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/g...um/damageDone/ a log from a few weeks ago
I feel like i hit the right rotation, but that can't be true

any help appreciated, thanks

edit: i'm not using the dps cloak