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  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by Holyground View Post
    So I'm loving all this feedback for you heroic guys. Thank you so much. But my curiosity is sparked. I know healing isn't like dps, but how are you generating holy power consistantly with ef as your talent choice? I was sitting at 15k spirit but felt starved with ef.
    You just have to use as many HP generation systems as possible, every 10 seconds should only contain 1 or 2 GCDs not devoted to HP gen.

  2. #522
    Keyboard Turner DanaScullySSMG's Avatar
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    Thanks for the tips!

  3. #523
    Grunt Dissonik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berianther View Post
    normal Klaxxi was one of the easiest fight to 2 heal on 10m, pretty sure it could be 1 healed. I finally got enough haste to be able to do 55% haste, will see how it compares to a 45% haste build, at the expense of sacrificing mastery.
    At the 55% Heast breakpoint you are sacrificing stats that have a higher weight. Past the 45% breakpoint, Int > Spirit > Mastery > Crit > Haste. The higher the haste the lower the rating value.

    Dropping even more mastery to pick up the 55% BP would sacrifice your IH exponentially.

    Key factors that you have to remember. The more haste you have, the faster you will cast; and the faster you cast the more mana you will use. Dropping spirit is fine if you have DSoD and Amp. But, if you don't you may be hurting on mana through the fight.

    True you may be able to get more Holy Radiance out, but you lose so much IH (@55% BP) as well. Not many fights are you going to be able to just HR > HR > HS(DB2) > EF and it all be as effective as if you had more mastery to stack IH.

  4. #524
    Quote Originally Posted by Dissonik View Post
    At the 55% Heast breakpoint you are sacrificing stats that have a higher weight. Past the 45% breakpoint, Int > Spirit > Mastery > Crit > Haste. The higher the haste the lower the rating value.

    Dropping even more mastery to pick up the 55% BP would sacrifice your IH exponentially.

    Key factors that you have to remember. The more haste you have, the faster you will cast; and the faster you cast the more mana you will use. Dropping spirit is fine if you have DSoD and Amp. But, if you don't you may be hurting on mana through the fight.

    True you may be able to get more Holy Radiance out, but you lose so much IH (@55% BP) as well. Not many fights are you going to be able to just HR > HR > HS(DB2) > EF and it all be as effective as if you had more mastery to stack IH.
    You could easily summarize this with the actual reason 45% is likely the 'cap' for effective haste BPs, by saying that's when we hit the nearest BP to the GCD cap. Everything else is basic Haste play-style knowledge.

  5. #525
    Hello
    Recently I've had to go back to healing from tanking, and (couse were at Thok atm and my EF build wasnt competitive wirh other healers - two druids) wanted to try SH. Overall im happy with it (my numbers had grown, on Thok I even outperform my druids, even if its by a margin), but im not sure if my gemming and reforging are ok. Anyway here's my armoury: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...toore/advanced (we dont have WoL logs... have to remember to start recording them by my own).
    My average HPS on Thok are around 110-120k, we still have problems on the fight (didnt killed it, have some tries at around 10%) - if You guys have any advice on the fight it would be great (1 tank - drood, 3 healers - 2 droods or 1 drood and 1 shammy and myself, we start from Gorai, then Akolik (suprisingly its more difficult for us then the ice one), Motak last - cant get to second phase after Montak - we usually wipe on it, on every second phase we usually get him to 10-13 stacks of speed up, on 1st 1 phase our bear usually gets to around 5-6 stacks of panic until blood frenzy gets up)

  6. #526
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toore View Post
    Hello
    Recently I've had to go back to healing from tanking, and (couse were at Thok atm and my EF build wasnt competitive wirh other healers - two druids) wanted to try SH. Overall im happy with it (my numbers had grown, on Thok I even outperform my druids, even if its by a margin), but im not sure if my gemming and reforging are ok. Anyway here's my armoury: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...toore/advanced (we dont have WoL logs... have to remember to start recording them by my own).
    My average HPS on Thok are around 110-120k, we still have problems on the fight (didnt killed it, have some tries at around 10%) - if You guys have any advice on the fight it would be great (1 tank - drood, 3 healers - 2 droods or 1 drood and 1 shammy and myself, we start from Gorai, then Akolik (suprisingly its more difficult for us then the ice one), Motak last - cant get to second phase after Montak - we usually wipe on it, on every second phase we usually get him to 10-13 stacks of speed up, on 1st 1 phase our bear usually gets to around 5-6 stacks of panic until blood frenzy gets up)

    For SH, I would regem focusing on mastery and reforge your spirit to mastery and haste over crit.
    Last edited by Freia; 2013-10-30 at 02:20 PM.

  7. #527
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    If it's just normal, honestly, just 2 tank it, stay in the main phase the entire time, and kill him.

    Otherwise, if you want to try 1 tanking it (for heroic?) then yeah, I'd focus on changing up gems and stats. Also consider using Hammer over Prism. You should also assist your other healers with CD's. Beacon Glyph isn't that necessary with 1 tank for the most part.

  8. #528
    Quote Originally Posted by Toore View Post
    Hello
    Recently I've had to go back to healing from tanking, and (couse were at Thok atm and my EF build wasnt competitive wirh other healers - two druids) wanted to try SH. Overall im happy with it (my numbers had grown, on Thok I even outperform my druids, even if its by a margin), but im not sure if my gemming and reforging are ok. Anyway here's my armoury: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...toore/advanced (we dont have WoL logs... have to remember to start recording them by my own).
    My average HPS on Thok are around 110-120k, we still have problems on the fight (didnt killed it, have some tries at around 10%) - if You guys have any advice on the fight it would be great (1 tank - drood, 3 healers - 2 droods or 1 drood and 1 shammy and myself, we start from Gorai, then Akolik (suprisingly its more difficult for us then the ice one), Motak last - cant get to second phase after Montak - we usually wipe on it, on every second phase we usually get him to 10-13 stacks of speed up, on 1st 1 phase our bear usually gets to around 5-6 stacks of panic until blood frenzy gets up)
    For stats do what Freia and Void have said
    We two-tanked him aswell...

    A few general tips for the fight...(my opinions only...thats how we do it on 10man! there may be better ways...)
    The first phase is the one thats the most important...use heroism right after the pull and have the raid stacked at one of his feet...Light's Hammer is quite awesome here...
    The first few screeches should be no problem at all..as soon as the screeches become faster, give the first druid BoP so he can channel tranquility...when he is done, repeat that with the second druid or the shaman...bubble yourself (if needed) and as soon as both wear off use devotion aura for another 6sec of uninterrupted casting for the entire raid...we usually manage 25-30 stacks before we let the raid drop below 50% to trigger the chase-phase...
    It is important that you use your other cooldowns aswell (Spirit-Link Totem, Healing Stream, Last Stand Shouts, Banners etc.)...
    During the chase-phase melees deal the prison add and ranges try to maximize their dps on thok...
    The Montak-Phase requires some discipline...have your raid stack at his foot again...and as soon as a puddle of fire spawns, move the entire raid...do that a few times and he should be dead...if you need more time at the end you can intentionally trigger the chase-phase by having the raid stack and drop below 50%...

  9. #529
    Hi, im a veteran holy paladin but new to the MMO champion forums who has come here looking for some help about the haste build. I was suggested I try the haste build from a very good friend of mine but its been unable to compete with other mastery based builds running 25man heroics.

    Unbuffed I'm currently sitting at 25.99% haste or 11047haste. Even with mind quickening raid buffed it only reached 32%. I have reached the 45% cap before in this current gear but I cannot figure out where the missing haste went after I did a temporary change back to a mastery build. Did I sub-optimally reforge my gear or was my raid lacking a haste buff? Additionally, the hps was not there due to my best efforts to EF blanket and I am unable to determine if it is an execution problem or the lack of haste.

  10. #530
    Hi Berl,
    Can you link your armory please so everyone can have a look ?

    Maybe we can see where you're missing your haste.

    In your WOL logs under buffs gained you can see if you had the haste buff from any raid members, if not - its likely you did not have it. If you have ele shaman, boomkin or shadow priest you get it automatically. If not and you're relying on hunter I believe its a sporebat that provides this and could be other pets as well. Check with your hunter if that's the case and see what pet he's using.

    Best of Luck



    Quote Originally Posted by berl View Post
    Hi, im a veteran holy paladin but new to the MMO champion forums who has come here looking for some help about the haste build. I was suggested I try the haste build from a very good friend of mine but its been unable to compete with other mastery based builds running 25man heroics.

    Unbuffed I'm currently sitting at 25.99% haste or 11047haste. Even with mind quickening raid buffed it only reached 32%. I have reached the 45% cap before in this current gear but I cannot figure out where the missing haste went after I did a temporary change back to a mastery build. Did I sub-optimally reforge my gear or was my raid lacking a haste buff? Additionally, the hps was not there due to my best efforts to EF blanket and I am unable to determine if it is an execution problem or the lack of haste.

  11. #531
    High Overlord Berianther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by berl View Post
    Hi, im a veteran holy paladin but new to the MMO champion forums who has come here looking for some help about the haste build. I was suggested I try the haste build from a very good friend of mine but its been unable to compete with other mastery based builds running 25man heroics.

    Unbuffed I'm currently sitting at 25.99% haste or 11047haste. Even with mind quickening raid buffed it only reached 32%. I have reached the 45% cap before in this current gear but I cannot figure out where the missing haste went after I did a temporary change back to a mastery build. Did I sub-optimally reforge my gear or was my raid lacking a haste buff? Additionally, the hps was not there due to my best efforts to EF blanket and I am unable to determine if it is an execution problem or the lack of haste.
    Missing Seal of Insight's 10%

  12. #532
    Could anyone tell which cap haste Paladin healer?

  13. #533
    So im running normals and I've been back and forth this expac as far as healing and only really quickly went over the guide for stat weights ect. I was checking some of the pallys in this thread and see your geming haste or master or split gems. Is that the way to go over int? i was checking other high end pallys early in the teir and they were gemed eather spirt or int
    <KillingTime> Dawnbringer U.S. 8/8 heroic
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  14. #534
    Pandaren Monk Freia's Avatar
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    Most actually gem int. It depends on the build/fight really. With Eternal Flame most are gemming int.

  15. #535
    Quote Originally Posted by MitsuAS View Post
    So im running normals and I've been back and forth this expac as far as healing and only really quickly went over the guide for stat weights ect. I was checking some of the pallys in this thread and see your geming haste or master or split gems. Is that the way to go over int? i was checking other high end pallys early in the teir and they were gemed eather spirt or int
    Spirit (to personal feels) > Haste (to BP) > Int = Mastery, the ideal situation is to gem Spirit till you feel comfortable then drop that down and trade it into Int as you gear higher or more ideally. You should try to avoid going for a Haste breakpoint that you have to gem for, unless its more efficient than reforging for it.

  16. #536
    Quote Originally Posted by Xs View Post
    Spirit (to personal feels) > Haste (to BP) > Int = Mastery, the ideal situation is to gem Spirit till you feel comfortable then drop that down and trade it into Int as you gear higher or more ideally. You should try to avoid going for a Haste breakpoint that you have to gem for, unless its more efficient than reforging for it.
    Thanks, thats what im doing now, was just confused seeing some people do it quite differently
    <KillingTime> Dawnbringer U.S. 8/8 heroic
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  17. #537
    Depending on your raid comp you can lean toward or away from int or mastery for EF builds. Int benefits all spells to some degree and is the only one that benefits the EF hot. Mastery effects everything BUT the EF hot. So when you're in a high overhealing situation or one with a vast number of absorbs already in the raid then favoring mastery over int means that the absorb value on the raid as a whole is higher and likely to be more effective than deficit healing that might not even happen. It is not uncommon in a raid with a pair of disc priests and a couple paladins for burst damage mechanics to strip bubbles but do no actual damage.
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  18. #538
    Stood in the Fire
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    How competetive are Paladin healers atm in 25man heroic modes? Our paladin healers always do horrible HPS and we have had quite a few. Like on Norushen we did 250-350k HPS (Disc, shaman, shaman) and then came our low geared monk with 160k and then the ok geared pala 120k.. I mean there was alot to heal, but we shamans and the disc just couldnt do anymore healing even tho weirdly im hovering 80%+ mana all the time as shaman (something might trigger water shield alot not sure)

    And its on every boss, hes dead last with a whopping 567 ilvl! I was rocking with 550ilvl and did double healing on every boss.

    Is our healing comp somewhat nonsuitable for pala or is he just bad?

  19. #539
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    120k on norushen isn't very good regardless of class, but Paladins are pretty much bottom of the barrel in terms of class.

    Not by 120k much though.

  20. #540
    High Overlord Berianther's Avatar
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    Looks like your paladins are just bad if they're that far behind your other healers.

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