13 year old boy paralyzed and health care.

[Dazzy]

What strikes me, as a non-american, is the ridiculous hight bills the family may have to pay. Free health care system or not, how is it possible that these treatment can cost hundred thousands, if not millions, of dollars? It seems to me, that the pharmaceutic companies in the US are even more greedy than the ones in europe.

I have to agree, I know most of the people involved spent hundreds of thousands on medical school, but when a new drug comes out that can help millions of people, and costs $3 to make yet is sold for $160 a PILL.....There is a monstrous amount of greed in that industry, and not much caring about humanity (the reason a lot of them got in that field in the first place). There's plenty for everyone involved to live very well without forcing patients into bankruptcy and leaving their loved ones with giant bills after they die.

[Catta]

But it won't be just for this kid, it will then be for ALL medical fees across the whole nation. The 6 cents add up.

It will be less expensive than buying insurance

[steveyboy]

But it could have never been avoided by a military, as large you want it to be.

Tell me whats gonna happen when they reduce there army size down to say 100,000.

Civil wars or civil unrest could happen.

[Wildtree]

It needs some reform, but not Osamacare.

I agree with that sentence. Because I don't see Obamacare getting anywhere near the direction of Europes systems.
No insurance can deny you, that part is the right direction. Everyone must obtain health insurance, that part is wrong in one way. Should everyone have Health insurance. Yes. But it should read "Everyone has the right to health insurance, and no insurance company can reject someone". Along with that there have to be regulations as how much they are allowed to charge for a policy. Dental must be included and not be treated as a separate topic. If you cannot afford health insurance, the govt. must jump in and pick up the policy bill until you are back on track.
So in short, the Health care system is still ways away from where it should be, even Obamacare.
America only shines on one aspect. Medicaid. If you make it to 65, you are in shape. The health care system for older people is excellent in the USA.

[Catta]

Or maybe people shouldnt partake in dangerous activities like playing sports, riding their damn bikes on public roads meant for cars/trucks, skydiving, driving anywhere other than going to work, visit family, and going shopping to get what they need, hiking, mountain climbing, surfing, skiing, and scuba diving. IF you choose to do something stupid that causes you to get hurt, then it shouldnt be society's responsibility to take care of you if we were to use your "socialist" healthcare system. Pay for it yourself!

So what you are saying is that it was this 13 year old kid's own fault and he can go fuck himself?

[Samyaaza]

They apparently blew up your twin towers though didn't they.

Yeah well shows how well spent are the money invested in military, just sayin'

[Wildtree]

Tell me whats gonna happen when they reduce there army size down to say 100,000.

Civil wars or civil unrest could happen.

No one talks about 100.000... No one who has any issue with the US military is asking to eliminate it down to a point where security issues would arise. Enough money would already be saved if the troops would just draw back from every country they are stationed, unnecessarily.
The United States spends approximately $250 billion annually to maintain troops, equipment, fleets, and bases overseas.
Here's an interesting article from Forbes

[Deleted]

A couple years ago or so I watched J Leno having Schwarzenegger as guest. They were talking about medical bills.

It happened that Leno's mother went to England for a trip. While on that trip she had a heart attack. Had to be treated there in a hospital for a few days. Leno received the bill from the English Hospital, it was $2000. Schwarzenegger broke his leg during a ski trip in the Rockies. He ended up with a bill of $35.000 for getting his leg in a cast and like one night stay.
There we see the first problem already.... How can heart treatment be so much cheaper than a simple friggen broken leg?

The answer is actually quite easy... They have to charge extremely high amounts of money because they need to be able to pay off the retarded lawsuits they get all the time, when they where doing their job to the best of their ability. Get rid of retarded unnecessary high lawsuits that people do in order to get rich quick, and healthcare would get lower in cost.

I mean what do you expect? what sounds better, a hospital that goes broke and have to close every time someone makes a 10 mill lawsuit, or they raise the price and are able to pay off the idiot before it goes to court? America wouldn't have a single hospital left.

[Bakis]

The problem is not really the lack of funding in itself but the inherent inefficiency of the US medical system, add to that a legal system with law suits that are just laughable at best.
It is on the same level as 2 alcoholics trying to run a nuclear plant.

[Themius]

No one talks about 100.000... No one who has any issue with the US military is asking to eliminate it down to a point where security issues would arise. Enough money would already be saved if the troops would just draw back from every country they are stationed, unnecessarily.
The United States spends approximately $250 billion annually to maintain troops, equipment, fleets, and bases overseas.
Here's an interesting article from Forbes

We spend almost 800b a year on our military. I'm not sure why ...

[koodledrum]

What you fail to realize, is that with social medicine the cost still exists. Its just shifted to the taxpayers.

While my heart goes out to this kid and his family, accidents are an unfortunate part of life. Giving everyone 100% free and covered healthcare are not. We do not have the resources to do so.

Lets put it this way, that is the fairest system in the world - at any point in time any person in the UK can suffer a major catastrophic health event, it doesn't matter if you're the richest man in the country or the poorest kid in the land, you will be treated no questions asked and no bill issued. While it's true that doesn't sound fair, do you think this situation sounds fair?

Jim is just 6 months old, he's just been diagnosed with a brain tumour - it's not good news but there's hope, he can be treated and the doctors give him a 50-50 shot of making it. Understandably Jim's parents are devastated by this news - but are slightly more optimistic that something can be done about it, problem is they've already spent well in advance of £100,000 to find out what was wrong, Jim's father works full time as a postman, Jim's mother prior to having Jim worked full time as a nurse, their combined wage packets work out at just under £50,000 per year pre tax - well, you don't need to be a genius to figure out something's not gonna work out here. They've already had to take on a mortgage for the surgery, the dozens of scans required & such, problem is the treatment will cost a further £2m in medicine, treatments & scans as well as hospital care.

Jim's father has worked 9 hours a day 5 days a week, 47 weeks a year since he left school 10 years ago, Jim's mother has worked the same schedule for a shorter timeframe - still having done so for 6 years, both have paid full tax since the day they started. They now face the fact they have paid tax yet when it's needed there is nothing to show for it whatsoever, they cannot afford to have their child treated for something they had absolutely no control over, for something the child clearly had done absolutely nothing to deserve - ultimately their child will now suffer greatly & die. Adding insult to injury, the £100k mortgage Jim's parents had to take out to figure out the problem will now have to be paid off as will a further £50k in loans for palliative care for Jim until his death to make him as comfortable as is humanly possible.

Meanwhile we have a second child, Mark, Mark's parents are heirs to a considerable sum of money, Mark's grandfather on being made redundant had enough money to buy a couple of cheap properties 25 years ago, he did them up a little bit now charges above average rent to people for low grade housing, as a result he earned a decent fortune by ripping people off. Mark subsequently is a little cunt of a child, he's the school & neighbourhood bully, takes drugs, has been arrested in the past for various crimes - only this time he's pulled the big job, he's nicked a car & took it for a joy ride, problem being he just wrapped said car round a lamp post. He needs an op to amputate his leg, he's also fractured his back meaning he'll likely spend the rest of his life in a wheelchair & will require further surgeries to correct various ailments through life. No problems at all as his grandparents will bankroll the entire costs.

I consider myself lucky I live in a country whereby you are treated, right now if I lived in the US there's a more than fair chance I'd be dead as a result of cancer I was diagnosed with & treated at the age of 25 as despite having worked consistently for years I would not be able to afford the medical care. Little hint, a CT scan (of which I have had 7-8) is £200 a pop, an MRI scan (1 thereof) roughly £300 for a head & chest - then there's the cost of radiotherapy, chemotherapy, consultant meetings, hospital care (2 nights per cycle for 4 cycles, 1 day per aborted cycle for 2, 2 operations, 3 days in hospital due to needing a feeding tube, 1 night in hospital due to the incorrect anti-sickness tablets). I couldn't have afforded the necessary scans never mind the treatments & hospital stays and lets be fair, even if you only pay 20% of those costs I'd be in debt probably to the tune of well over £200k.

[MerinPally]

Knowing that we have the NHS makes me so much more comfortable when I read a story like this.

[Deleted]

So what you are saying is that it was this 13 year old kid's own fault and he can go fuck himself?

I'd be inclined to say that yes, it is partially his fault for playing a dangerous sport.

But I am a heartless bastard, so meh.

[Wildtree]

We spend almost 800b a year on our military. I'm not sure why ...

if you aren't sure how could foreigners know?

That Forbes article hits the nail, with one exception. It's correct when it comes to govt. relations. However it's totally different when it comes to the actual common people living in those countries. They don't want the US Troops there. They want them gone.
I said that in other topics before, but the most extreme case is Germany. There are almost 54.000 troops stationed in Germany. 67 years after the war ended.
I was born in Germany, before the wall was raised. I lived almost my entire life there, and I got a first hand experience about the "threat" from the east.
That threat diminished over the decades and poofed entirely with the reunion of Germany.
I would agree with a contingent of maybe 5 - 10.000 troops there, since Stuttgart is the strategical headquarter of the NATO. But even that. Europes Armies are very well capable to defend themselves if they ever had to. So, no need for US Troops over there.... Get em home, spend the money on health care funding instead.

[Deleted]

even with that the NHS is constantly low on money.

It really isn't. The NHS doesn't have limitless pots of money, but it's hardly 'Constantly low'. The biggest issue at the moment is a lack of trained medical staff for fire.

[critterkiller]

The nature of our healthcare system has inflated costs dramatically. Which is in part why people don't think socialized health care can work, because medical bills are so damn expensive.

The problem is, in fact, that the business of healing is run as a business, where I think it should be non-profit.

Bingo, this is the answer someone to what someone asked above, since it is a profit based business people want more to increase sallery and bonuses, that said the doctors that operate people should get the money not the big boss above them that cuts there wallets rather than with a scalpel

[Templar 331]

I'd be inclined to say that yes, it is partially his fault for playing a dangerous sport.

But I am a heartless bastard, so meh.

I feel like a turd for saying this, but I kind of agree. Playing sports is good for the body. Playing a sport where you run and tackle another person is stupid. Making kids play this is even more stupid.

And like many others have said, my country's medical/insurance system is screwed up. It's all profit driven.

I do feel sorry for the kid. But it's stories like this that will help us learn that we need to fix our problems.

[Themius]

L
ILittle hint, a CT scan (of which I have had 7-8) is £200 a pop, an MRI scan (1 thereof) roughly £300 for a head & chest - then there's the cost of radiotherapy, chemotherapy, consultant meetings, hospital care (2 nights per cycle for 4 cycles, 1 day per aborted cycle for 2, 2 operations, 3 days in hospital due to needing a feeding tube, 1 night in hospital due to the incorrect anti-sickness tablets). I couldn't have afforded the necessary scans never mind the treatments & hospital stays and lets be fair, even if you only pay 20% of those costs I'd be in debt probably to the tune of well over £200k.

Seriously that cheap?! CT Scan my mother got was 3k-5k a pop and when she got a few scans done of different parts the bill was up to 15k in total, in scans alone she's probably up to about 40k or so now and that's just for one side of her body she still needs the other side. This at the moment may or may not fall to her.

[Zarc]

What you fail to realize, is that with social medicine the cost still exists. Its just shifted to the taxpayers.

While my heart goes out to this kid and his family, accidents are an unfortunate part of life. Giving everyone 100% free and covered healthcare are not. We do not have the resources to do so.

Are you blind to facts? The rest of the industrial world aside from the United States give everyone free and covered healthcare - and all those countries spend less per capita on healthcare than the United States, and with far better results! The United States rank 1st in healthcare expenditure per capita, while their healthcare system ranks 37th in performance (source: World Health Organization). Having a middle-man in the form of insurance companies adds alot of costs, as do the fact that those insurance companies and the hospitals have owners that are running a business like any other (although healthcare is not a business like any other, as realised by the rest of the industrialised world) and thus aim to earn profits from their business. You Most Definetly have the resources to do so.

The fact is that the vast majority of Americans would see their private economy improve if you would have had the healthcare system of say Canada, France or Germany. Two lines of money going out of the system (profit for both hospitals and insurance companies) and the cost of having a middle-man would go away, the current system that is basicly an optional flat-tax payed for by anyone who wants to have health insurance would go away and people's taxes would increase instead, and since taxes are proportional those with very high income would pay a larger chunck of the total costs while those with lower income would pay less. The result wold be that people with a very high income would see their cost of living increase somewhat, while the middle-class and everyone below would see their cost of living go down somewhat and everyone would get the care they need when they need it - not if they can afford it. This would release monetary resources among the middle-class and would therefore also somewhat boost the economy overall.

The only sane argument against this is the "but then I have no free choice of caregiver" argument, beside the point that that "free choice" is only an illusion because if you can't afford it you have no choice at all, there are many universal healthcare systems that allow you to select your caregiver as well as allow private companies to operate in the market along side public hospitals that are free of charge, having a "care allowance" follow the patient to whatever caregiver he chooses to cover whatever procedure he might have needed, and if the private caregiver want to charge a higher price than what the "care allowance" covers the patient will simply have to cover the difference himself. So free choice remains, while everyone is guaranteed the care they need when they need it.

[Themius]

I have this same health care issue, it's so damn expensive. My friend is healthy and she is looking to pay up to 300-400 a month in health care, and she can't afford it.