New Retirement plan

[Maneo]

So I think I am going to move to Norway then get my ass thrown in jail.

http://www.time.com/time/photogaller...989083,00.html

http://imgur.com/gallery/cg2Ew

[Deleted]

Between you, me and the rest of this forum. I don't think you will.

Anyway, I think we're going to need more a source than a subline.

[Maneo]

Between you, me and the rest of this forum. I don't think you will.

Anyway, I think we're going to need more a source than a subline.

Your right I won't

But the standard of living the prisoners have is better then I spent a huge chunk of my life and is probably better then I will spend my so called "Golden years"

So if I could I would.

Here is another link to a different prison in Norway

http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/europe...ons/index.html

[koodledrum]

Or why not go to Norway & train to be a prison guard - get free gym, decent working conditions & get paid for it all in one of the most scenic countries in the world, problem is you'd need to learn Norwegian (although most Scandinavians have a decent standard of English) and live in a place which can be extremely cold.

[Spectral]

I'm more interested in whether this works than whether people are offended by being too nice to prisoners.

[Deleted]

I'm more interested in whether this works than whether people are offended by being too nice to prisoners.

It's a fact that Norway has a much lower re-offending rate than most places with a more 'Conventional' prison system.

[Spectral]

It's a fact that Norway has a much lower re-offending rate than most places with a more 'Conventional' prison system.

I know that's true, but I'm wondering how substantial the confounding factors are. For example, I don't think comparing them to the United States is useful, for a number of reasons, but I'd be interested in whether they fair better than other Scandanavian countries, and Western Europe as a whole. I don't really have a gut feeling about it. If it works well, it's probably something more countries should try.

[someotherguy]

I'm more interested in whether this works than whether people are offended by being too nice to prisoners.

I would think a lot of crime happens because people are put into a bad situation, and it just escalates from there.
This doesn't include pedophilia, and things like that, but it does include armed robbery where someone dies.

It would make sense to me that putting the people into good condition, and treating them humanly would help them, and they will want to continue that lifestyle after they get out.

Having said that, it's still terrible that prisoners enjoy better lifestyle than some law-abiding citizens. I'm not sure about Norway, but in US, even though prisoners get food and healthcare, not everyone does.

Personally, I think that even though these types of prisons are good, it would be better to spend money on law-abiding citizens, making sure that at no point a law-abiding citizen is in worse condition than a prisoner.

[Spectral]

due to ridiculous socialism mostly and welfare not because it actually resocialize people, murderers stay in prisons, go back to prisons and little thiefs learns that it is better to live on other working people cost. 20-30 max years and there wont be left anything from socialism.

Even putting aside that this isn't exactly true (Norway has a very productive population and doesn't really have a public debt problem), it still sounds quite preferable to having people endangered by criminals attacking them.

[StaeleAilar]

in all honesty, prisoners worldwide are treated much better than the likes of pensioners and veterans, or students and single parents who all abide by the law and work their asses off to make something of themselves. It really disgusts me to discover and read about things like this.

[Darsithis]

A gilded cage is still a cage. Never. I would never trade my freedom, my right to choose anything in my life, for more comfort.

in all honesty, prisoners worldwide are treated much better than the likes of pensioners and veterans, or students and single parents who all abide by the law and work their asses off to make something of themselves. It really disgusts me to discover and read about things like this.

The difference is that those single parents, students, and veterans have the freedom to make the choices necessary to change their lives. Prisoners do not, no matter how nice the cell

[Rocko9]

Or why not go to Norway & train to be a prison guard - get free gym, decent working conditions & get paid for it all in one of the most scenic countries in the world, problem is you'd need to learn Norwegian (although most Scandinavians have a decent standard of English) and live in a place which can be extremely cold.

I think the point is that he won't be working or paying for anything, including taxes.

[someotherguy]

A gilded cage is still a cage. Never. I would never trade my freedom, my right to choose anything in my life, for more comfort.



The difference is that those single parents, students, and veterans have the freedom to make the choices necessary to change their lives. Prisoners do not, no matter how nice the cell

... yea, veterans can choose to either not have PTSD, or they can choose to get professional help by ... you know ... like in movies ... holding the entire hospital hostage for couple of years, while they get psychological help.

And those lazy single mothers, only working couple of jobs and leaving their kids in least expensive daycare. Why don't they just choose to have been born into Romney family, so they could just sell off some stock when things get really rough.

[Darsithis]

... yea, veterans can choose to either not have PTSD, or they can choose to get professional help by ... you know ... like in movies ... holding the entire hospital hostage for couple of years, while they get psychological help.

And those lazy single mothers, only working couple of jobs and leaving their kids in least expensive daycare. Why don't they just choose to have been born into Romney family, so they could just sell off some stock when things get really rough.

You're really stretching here. I, at no point, said that single mothers are lazy. Nor is it right to assume that every veteran has PTSD. Don't gum up your arguments with specious nonsense like this.

A single mother has the power to change her life, as does a single father. It's a lot easier, of course, with support from other people and I never said it wasn't. None of that changes that a prisoner is a prisoner.

[Deleted]

thanks to gas and oil, but everything with time gonna callapse, just like USA after became socialistic country. there is much easier way to teach those people manners, whip, it is not a torture but would teach little thieves that stealing is bad. good amount of whips on back, depending on crime and then go send him home to look after a job. I just need to simply repeat that word for pleasure: whip

Uh huh. Yeah. Evils of socialism. Rawr. AMURICA!. Good Old Days. Deport Immigrants. Execute Criminals.

Did I miss any other buzzwords that appeal to you?

Anyway, Norway isn't even Socialist, it's a Social Democracy. Capitalist Economics with Socialist social policies.

[someotherguy]

You're really stretching here. I, at no point, said that single mothers are lazy. Nor is it right to assume that every veteran has PTSD. Don't gum up your arguments with specious nonsense like this.

A single mother has the power to change her life, as does a single father. It's a lot easier, of course, with support from other people and I never said it wasn't. None of that changes that a prisoner is a prisoner.

Most people who are born into poverty will be poor.
Most people who are born into middle class will be middle class.
Most people who are born into Romney family will be in Romney family.

"choice" is not the correct word. What you're talking about is exceptions. It is an exception for someone who is born poor to end up in middle class. If it wasn't, than 33% of poor babies would turn to be middle class, 33% would be rich and 33% would be poor. (percentages should be adjusted to mimic percentages of poor/middle/rich in country)

And what does this supposed to mean "Nor is it right to assume that every veteran has PTSD. "? You said that veterans can improve their lives by choice. Are you talking about veterans like John McCain? of course not, you were talking about veterans in a bad position. There is some reason for it to be so. I hope you're not applying veterans are in bad position, simply because they were serving their country.

[Darsithis]

Most people who are born into poverty will be poor.
Most people who are born into middle class will be middle class.
Most people who are born into Romney family will be in Romney family.

"choice" is not the correct word. What you're talking about is exceptions. It is an exception for someone who is born poor to end up in middle class. If it wasn't, than 33% of poor babies would turn to be middle class, 33% would be rich and 33% would be poor. (percentages should be adjusted to mimic percentages of poor/middle/rich in country)

And what does this supposed to mean "Nor is it right to assume that every veteran has PTSD. "? You said that veterans can improve their lives by choice. Are you talking about veterans like John McCain? of course not, you were talking about veterans in a bad position. There is some reason for it to be so. I hope you're not applying veterans are in bad position, simply because they were serving their country.

Perhaps "improve" was the wrong word. I'm only highlighting that a prisoner is a prisoner and has very little control over their lives (beyond either behaving or misbehaving for an ultimate goal of getting out/remaining in), whereas people on the outside have some kind of freedom or choice. I'm not interested in getting into tangential arguments about veterans, PSTD, or single parents, only that being a prisoner offers no options.

The jail/prison shown here looks great from the outside but it's still a cell.

[Raphtheone]

To the people who claims those prisons provide a quality of living you don't have (or had), do you live in Norway? If no, I'm curious why you don't look what's wrong with your country instead. Perhaps you could enlighten me? If yes, any material you could link to, or adequately provide insight yourself on the living conditions of the poor in the country (I'm going out on a limb that you'll have to be poor here)?

And Gin, what system do you live under, if you despise Socialism so much? What would be the best system in your opinion, and why? You have strong opinions, I'm curious how well you can motivate them.

[Maneo]

To the people who claims those prisons provide a quality of living you don't have (or had), do you live in Norway? If no, I'm curious why you don't look what's wrong with your country instead. Perhaps you could enlighten me? If yes, any material you could link to, or adequately provide insight yourself on the living conditions of the poor in the country (I'm going out on a limb that you'll have to be poor here)?

And Gin, what system do you live under, if you despise Socialism so much? What would be the best system in your opinion, and why? You have strong opinions, I'm curious how well you can motivate them.

No I have living conditions that far exceed that, but my wife and I work our asses off to get it.

But when I am 60 is it likely that we are going to be able to retire? Probably not, but hey if I move to Norway and commit a crime I get a nice flat, at a resort ...

[Raphtheone]

No I have living conditions that far exceed that, but my wife and I work our asses off to get it.

But when I am 60 is it likely that we are going to be able to retire? Probably not, but hey if I move to Norway and commit a crime I get a nice flat, at a resort ...

60 seems a bit low, where do you live? And I think you misunderstand what you get as a criminal, yet get a cell, not a flat. Your freedom is stripped, but you will have a roof over your head. If your country can't provide that for you, I see no shame in turning to a country that can provide for you things your own country can't. Just speaks about how humane socialism is.

And if you do seriously plan to act on your plan (which I must say I have my doubts about), if you're somewhat honorable, go there earlier and pay taxes. If it's a medical emergency (or something), it's understandable to go there to seek help immediately, but if you're planning it in a distant future, you've plenty of wiggle room.