So what spec should we go starting in MoP raiding?

[Imnick]

1) Scorch doesn't apply critical mass and every Fire spell benefits from it so that's not a "bonus", it is balanced around having it
2) His post didn't either
3) It's still far fewer spells?

[Wixwix]

In heroics for me, frost is way better than fire. Haven't tried arcane but I doubt it's any better than fire.

I literally have zero AoE compared to frost and my single target damage is not even comparable to the numbers as frost.

[Zavri]

Frost is great for heroics because of the cleaving. Fire still does more on the boss fights though, just need good usage of alter time.

[Pyrion]

I'm doing frost in dungeons due to the fact that it's 90% trash and frost have better aoe right now. Will probably raid as frost to.

[Envyadams]

Frost is great for heroics because of the cleaving. Fire still does more on the boss fights though, just need good usage of alter time.

I dont know... i am doing better single target DPS as frost vs fire just cause getting the crit with fire to get those nice HS rolls just isn't in the gear and to reforge to strait crit is silly imo.

Now after this tier of bosses then maybe going Fire will be the way to go but at this time i believe Frost is best for single target and AoE. even confirmed by both Noxxic and Icy-viens as best single target outperforming Fire and Arcane.

[Zavri]

I dont know... i am doing better single target DPS as frost vs fire just cause getting the crit with fire to get those nice HS rolls just isn't in the gear and to reforge to strait crit is silly imo.

Now after this tier of bosses then maybe going Fire will be the way to go but at this time i believe Frost is best for single target and AoE. even confirmed by both Noxxic and Icy-viens as best single target outperforming Fire and Arcane.

I crit plenty at 23.99% crit ( with molten / AI ) Just need to use alter time so you can spam 4 pyros for a good combustion.

[lillbrorsan]

I've only been playing Fire since i got to 90 and i am really enjoying it so far, will be fun to try it out in raids!
Actually like it so much i made a video :P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnWq8ZZ3oQQ

[Mican17]

I really hope frost trumps or ties fire for raiding, as I'd prefer to use a new spec.

[Envyadams]

I crit plenty at 23.99% crit ( with molten / AI ) Just need to use alter time so you can spam 4 pyros for a good combustion.

Yea but i would prefer to use Frozen Orb with Ice Lance spam and do more DMG than a Combustion roll, well in my experience i just find the DMG from Frost more consistent.

Now I'm not bashing Fire I wish I had the stats to play it but with all the sims I can find and with talking with other mages doing spreadsheets Frost just does more DMG atm until the gear is available to make Fire better than Frost.

[Systam]

im really just trying out them all. i love fire and frost the most but i really enjoy arcane also. With all these specs being so close and especially with me no longer being in a hardcore min/max guild for raiding i can do w.e i love.

Personally i feel Fire will have its normal issues that with lower gear levels at start of xpac it won't be dominant with arcane/frost being higher. Once fire picks up gear though i feel like we'll do amazing.

I swear im almost for sure going to frost raid i miss it or deterrence is i dont want a frost pvp and pve spec lol

[Zavri]

Fire doesn't have the same issues as it had in the past because of the way heating up works with inferno blast. If you mess up your inferno blasts, then yes your dps will suffer.

The gear for fire is all there. Tons of Crit/Hit gear and Crit/Haste. Not alot of wasted stats on mastery, which is nice for a change.

[Kewi]

Fire is way better than in the past.. I'm still Iffy about the play style in raids though -- But I don't have the gear really yet to know.

I've not reforged since my last ~3 upgrades, but I'm sitting at (Self-buffed MA/AI) 10% hit, 21% crit, 5% haste, 19% Mastery.. I'm not quiet sure that I feel I have enough crit yet to smooth out RNG, and the RNG of fights back in FL/DS is what drove me insane.. going 20 seconds without a crit to inferno blast off of is PAINFUL

[Aianos]

I've only been playing Fire since i got to 90 and i am really enjoying it so far, will be fun to try it out in raids!
Actually like it so much i made a video :P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnWq8ZZ3oQQ

I was about to give up on mages until i saw your video. Thank you for that

Have not been happy with the changes, but slowly getting used to it. Pre-evo on heroic boss and maybe one more during fight isnt that bad. I have not considered raidbosses yet and how this will affect overall dps on those. Maybe IW would be better with the passiv and the fact that you don't have to stop for 5 ish seconds.
Used RoP in Beta and it was a real pain moving from stuff and returning to your spot or drop a new one. So I'd rather stop for a few seconds to Evo or use the IW when the opportunity arises.

[Tato23]

I've only been playing Fire since i got to 90 and i am really enjoying it so far, will be fun to try it out in raids!
Actually like it so much i made a video :P
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnWq8ZZ3oQQ

...Whats the bear minimum crit you need to be able to do that? I have about 8-9% just off gear, and i wasn't even close to pulling numbers like that...

[Soulstrike]

i feel like im the only arcane mage out there >_<

where are my fellow arcane mages :P

[Deleted]

Where did the PVE Frost guide go?

I only ever played frost in pvp, and not at a high level at all, so I don't completely know the ins and outs of the spec.

I would love a single target guide, since my damage is really lacking in dungeons. I guess the one Kuni made still applies, just can't find it.

One thing I did notice trying frost in dungeons is that deep freeze on bosses doesn't do any damage anymore. In cata it would say immune and hit for a large amount. Now it just says immune.

[Deleted]

Where did the PVE Frost guide go?

I only ever played frost in pvp, and not at a high level at all, so I don't completely know the ins and outs of the spec.

I would love a single target guide, since my damage is really lacking in dungeons. I guess the one Kuni made still applies, just can't find it.

One thing I did notice trying frost in dungeons is that deep freeze on bosses doesn't do any damage anymore. In cata it would say immune and hit for a large amount. Now it just says immune.

Try the guide on icy-veins it's kinda good ^^

[Imnick]

Try the guide on MMO Champion instead, it's up now
And yes, Deep Freeze doesn't hurt any more. The tooltip would have told you that!

[Tato23]

Try the guide on MMO Champion instead, it's up now
And yes, Deep Freeze doesn't hurt any more. The tooltip would have told you that!

Sweet! Hope we get a fire one up soon!

[siaro]

I'm chilling at over 7000 critt rating(that's over 27% critt), quite pleased with that. Prob sit there till i know what numbers might run better! Long live hit/critt gear!