1. #1

    Lightbulb Problems with MV first boss. (help/tips)

    We tried for a couple of hours last week to down the Stone Guard with no sucess. We are rolling with 2 tanks, 3 heals and 5 dps. We know the mechanics well but having problems calling out taunts, any tips/ideas?

  2. #2
    High Overlord IBroughtGuns's Avatar
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    We did this in a pug last week but we r doing it for the first time with the guild this week. Seems that as long as both tanks have their dbm working it should b self explanatory. But coordination is key because slow taunts = lots of extra explosions. Make sure ur tank that is tanking a single dog is always watching the energy levels of all dogs, especially right before the next petrification starts stacking, so he can make a quick choice on who he should taunt off the main tank.

    Also, start ur raid grp on the stairs in between the dogs starting point and then afrer first petrification hits uou can move into the room on the carpet, it will help with the shards from jade? I think thats the one that puts the crystal bombs down. Tanks can rotate their raid cds for each explosion that happens when the proper one isnt petrifying:ie. jade exploding when jasper is casting petrify.

    Good luck, im gonna watch this thread too for any good pointers to make it easier.
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  3. #3
    Pit Lord Odina's Avatar
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    I will comment as the offtank / Taunt caller for our group on this fight.

    First the OT should be the only one making the calls. The MT has 2 dogs and mitigation to worry about and should not be worrying about energy levels.

    Second the OT needs to always have the dog with the higest energy not petrified.

    Third You get a couple seconds grace at transitions as the next petrification will get the glow under them a second or 2 before DBM call. As the OT if the dog im currently tanking gets it I know ahead of time what of the 2 other adds has the most energy and call out the taunt. If the petrify is on the MT targets still and your dog has higest energy still you don't taunt.

    Fourth To make sure you arent clipping and adding energy to all three the OT needs to make sure there dog is GREY! If you are the OT and the dog is still in there color then they are being clipped and ramping up energy you know you are far away enough once the dog is greyed out.

    Fifth ensure your tanks clear out ice shards whenever coblat is being petrified so you dont get stuck by shards all over.

    Thats really it get those 5 things down as the OT and let your dps go to town!

  4. #4
    The only "hard" part of this encounter as a tank is the beginning when you might need to swap around a bit to sort their energy levels out. Once that's done, if one of the bosses who are tanked together get petrification no taunting is necessary. If the boss who's tanked by himself get petrification, just taunt the one who just overloaded, i.e is on very low energy.

  5. #5
    I don't know why everyone insists on having one tank always having two dogs. My groups strategy is simpler to execute and has less room for error.

    Tank 1 grabs adds A + B
    Tank 2 grabs add C

    If the petrification comes onto C tank 2 grabs A, holds A over there until both A and C are about 50% energy then tank 1 grabs C and lets it overload.

    Tank 1 now has B + C
    Tank 2 now has A

    If petrification is on A have tank 2 grab C (Always grab the one that just blew up and keep it with the one thats petrified). If its on B or C just keep it how it is.

    If at the beginning it is on A (or B) that tank 1 will simply have them both until their energy is at ~50% then tank 2 grabs A (or B depending on who is petrifying).

    Hope this helps, it greatly simplied the fight for us so tanks didn't have to call out all kinds of crazy shit and people could focus more on chains or traps or whatever is out.

  6. #6
    Pit Lord Odina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lological View Post
    I don't know why everyone insists on having one tank always having two dogs. My groups strategy is simpler to execute and has less room for error.

    Tank 1 grabs adds A + B
    Tank 2 grabs add C

    If the petrification comes onto C tank 2 grabs A, holds A over there until both A and C are about 50% energy then tank 1 grabs C and lets it overload.

    Tank 1 now has B + C
    Tank 2 now has A

    If petrification is on A have tank 2 grab C (Always grab the one that just blew up and keep it with the one thats petrified). If its on B or C just keep it how it is.

    If at the beginning it is on A (or B) that tank 1 will simply have them both until their energy is at ~50% then tank 2 grabs A (or B depending on who is petrifying).

    Hope this helps, it greatly simplied the fight for us so tanks didn't have to call out all kinds of crazy shit and people could focus more on chains or traps or whatever is out.
    I fail to see how this is simpler than " Off tank keeps non petrified dog with highest energy" Done!

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Lological View Post
    I don't know why everyone insists on having one tank always having two dogs. My groups strategy is simpler to execute and has less room for error.

    Tank 1 grabs adds A + B
    Tank 2 grabs add C

    If the petrification comes onto C tank 2 grabs A, holds A over there until both A and C are about 50% energy then tank 1 grabs C and lets it overload.

    Tank 1 now has B + C
    Tank 2 now has A

    If petrification is on A have tank 2 grab C (Always grab the one that just blew up and keep it with the one thats petrified). If its on B or C just keep it how it is.

    If at the beginning it is on A (or B) that tank 1 will simply have them both until their energy is at ~50% then tank 2 grabs A (or B depending on who is petrifying).

    Hope this helps, it greatly simplied the fight for us so tanks didn't have to call out all kinds of crazy shit and people could focus more on chains or traps or whatever is out.
    This is MUCH easier. My group spent the entirety of our first raid week wiping to this boss, due to poorly executed taunts by one of the tanks and just overall confusion. Once we switched to the strategy where only one tank was taunting per exchange it became much, much easier. At this point, your tanks should have been grinding heroics for awhile and have some rep. gear. There's no reason why both tanks shouldn't be able to tank both dogs at some point during the fight.

    Done this way, the only exchange that can be difficult to handle is the first one, right after the pull.

    Also, if your tanks don't understand this fight, then it's pretty much game over. We wiped for two nights on this, then replaced a tank and two-shot it. So ensure your tanks understand what they need to be doing. Once they do, there is no need to ever call anything out. Best of luck!

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by bobyboucher View Post
    I fail to see how this is simpler than " Off tank keeps non petrified dog with highest energy" Done!
    because one taunt is simpler than two taunts and leaves less room for the wrong dogs to be taunted. Also makes it easier to ensure the "wrong" dog doesn't overload because you have alot more control of the energy.

  9. #9
    Pit Lord Odina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lological View Post
    because one taunt is simpler than two taunts and leaves less room for the wrong dogs to be taunted. Also makes it easier to ensure the "wrong" dog doesn't overload because you have alot more control of the energy.
    So you made an overcomplicated strat to countre bad taunts from tanks rather than have the tanks execute taunting correctly? I'm just saying form my POV as the OT making the calls your strat seems way more complicated for nothing and seems to have more room for error... id rather focus on mitigation than following a flowchart for taunts and expect the MT to know how to taunt as well when I call for the swap.

    PS: Sorry for the above post...re-reading it I come off like a huge asshat! What I'm just trying to say is for some one way is simpler and I guess for others the other is the better. much like talents and glyphs this fights strat is dependant on your team. If you are having trouble with one way with your tanks try the other! For myself your strat is way harder but then again I like to believe I have great teamwork with our other tank and we communicate really well IE after awhipe we will whisper eachother and figure out little things we could have done better even if the wipe was not tank related. Thus for this one let your tanks figure out what is best for them > forcing a strat you believe is best down there throat!
    Last edited by Odina; 2012-10-15 at 09:59 PM.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by bobyboucher View Post
    For myself your strat is way harder but then again I like to believe I have great teamwork with our other tank and we communicate really well IE after awhipe we will whisper eachother and figure out little things we could have done better even if the wipe was not tank related. Thus for this one let your tanks figure out what is best for them > forcing a strat you believe is best down there throat!
    Just because you can't wrap your head around the simplicity of "Hey mines got petrification and its by itself so i taunt the one that just blew up" thats it, the only other option in my "flow chart" would be "Hey mines got petrification and its with another so we won't do anything."

    ps: we should be discussing not insulting.
    Last edited by Lological; 2012-10-15 at 10:11 PM.

  11. #11
    Dreadlord Khatix's Avatar
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    For my group there is no real MT for the encounter what we do is we taunt the glowing one back and forth.

    For EX On the Pull

    i have A B other tank has C if A is glowing at 40 power he taunts A so now i have B and he has A C

    After A pops if C is next he keeps both regardless of how many times it goes between A and C i only taunt if mine B is glowing and i taunt the last one to pop and hold them both untill his single one is glowing then he takes the last one to pop.

    By doing this there is less over all taunting and less movement because MDPS/Chains only have to move for mines/ swap. We often find that most of the time for us any ways is that the tank with 2 of them is that it goes back and forth between those 2 a lot.


    To put it simply we play hot potato with the one that is glowing (doing petrify) but only taunt off each other if we are tanking a single one who starts to glow besides the swap on initial pull at 40. Other wise we keep them steady.

    We were having problems at first but once we did this strat it has been ez mode for us.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Lological View Post
    Just because you can't wrap your head around the simplicity of "Hey mines got petrification and its by itself so i taunt the one that just blew up" thats it, the only other option in my "flow chart" would be "Hey mines got petrification and its with another so we won't do anything."

    ps: we should be discussing not insulting.
    Reason 2 are kept together always is to save dps running from one set of dogs to another, its a dps loss and its also a danger with chains, puddles of crap and traps. Each to his own though, if the boss dies, who cares?

  13. #13
    Always taunt 1 dog at a time. Then do as said earlier:

    Quote Originally Posted by Lological View Post
    I don't know why everyone insists on having one tank always having two dogs. My groups strategy is simpler to execute and has less room for error.

    Tank 1 grabs adds A + B
    Tank 2 grabs add C

    If the petrification comes onto C tank 2 grabs A, holds A over there until both A and C are about 50% energy then tank 1 grabs C and lets it overload.

    Tank 1 now has B + C
    Tank 2 now has A

    If petrification is on A have tank 2 grab C (Always grab the one that just blew up and keep it with the one thats petrified). If its on B or C just keep it how it is.

    If at the beginning it is on A (or B) that tank 1 will simply have them both until their energy is at ~50% then tank 2 grabs A (or B depending on who is petrifying).

    Hope this helps, it greatly simplied the fight for us so tanks didn't have to call out all kinds of crazy shit and people could focus more on chains or traps or whatever is out.
    then

    Quote Originally Posted by Skallfraktur View Post
    Once that's done, if one of the bosses who are tanked together get petrification no taunting is necessary. If the boss who's tanked by himself get petrification, just taunt the one who just overloaded, i.e is on very low energy.

    Don't listen to those who say the same tank should always tank two dogs.

  14. #14
    Basically is a tank fight about switching taunts... and of course for people paying attention on chain traps.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Kanath View Post
    Don't listen to those who say the same tank should always tank two dogs.
    I agree, we found it much eaiser to go back and forth when needed. once you get the first overload under control the rest of the fight becomes fool prrof. Which ever petrification comes up you simply place that guardian with the guardian that previously overloaded.

    For the first overload, we simply let both of the dogs get to 45 energy then taunt off the petrification and take him to the single dog. so the tank who had both no has a dog with 50 and teh new tank now has the petrification and a dog at 0. Once he overloads he becomes the next target to be placed next to teh petrification.

  16. #16
    Yeah as the main tank in my raid at first we tried the double taunt every time and 1 missed taunt meant a wipe. On top of that you gain extra energy as the two dogs run past each other which is unnecessary and leads to the wrong overloads. The above strat of a single taunt going out is 100x easier for the tanks. It is slightly harder for melee and ranged that are chained to melee, but unless you get super lucky on petrifactions the 2 taunt strat is going to end in a wipe much more often.

    Just take a min and think about it the 1 taunt strategy is very simple on the tanks, saves unnecessary energy gain on the dogs and trust me makes the encounter much easier.

  17. #17
    Thanks for the tips guys, we will be making a second attempt on friday I'll let you know how it went. The main problem with our last attempt was that we were having 2 overloads at the same time. I see thats avoided at the beggining of the fight to simply wait for the one that is not petrifying to reach 50 energy then switch.

    Are you guys using other type of addon except for DBM to keep an eye on all three dogs energy levels?

    ---------- Post added 2012-10-16 at 12:07 PM ----------

    Thanks, start on the stairs and go south as mines and pools start spawning right?

  18. #18
    We used the default blizzard UI to watch energy and it worked just fine.

    It's really just a matter of the tanks getting used to the rhythm of the fight. Several of our dps kept trying to be 'helpful' and call out taunts for us, we finally made them stop and only the tanks or the raid leader would call out the taunt.

    I think about this as a 2-phase fight. Phase 1 is the first overload, where you trade around dogs depending on which one is blowing up. After that, it's just a simple matter of after one dog blows up, taunt it away if the single dog starts overloading. Otherwise, just keep the dogs in place.

    We start where the dogs are already standing, then move gradually up the room. Got to watch it that the two tanks don't get out of taunt range of one another. That can be painful. I ended up making the healers tell me if my co-tank was moving too far and leaving me behind.

  19. #19
    Here is my WeakAuras export for keeping track of the energy, its not perfect and depending on which dogs we get this week I'll have to update it to the correct colors or just fix it so. But it will show names and energy levels, and you can go in and change the colors for 1-3 depending on which one is missing this week.

    Code:
    dKtPoaGEsPAxKs02KkntaKzROUjauFtu63szNi0EP2ns7NKFkrzyKQgNuXTLQgkayWcnCq9xr1PKiDmj15uelebNxLSyjz5cEiPK6PeldepxPRrkMkqtwbth6IaOUkPuUmQRlYgbPEnPe2mI2UeXZa00uP(Se(oa9yf6WQy0IIXRiDjsj5wKkDAvDpaiReKSisfJsIQDTbTCmOrlRLAT8wlZQLAS0BzWYGbTmTmsYLrdTU3A0dSR(6SzV7O5U((2K6ERXYvzKKlJMywTuVE91qGOpREG1q0yjWfFJcEbZwkcTeSLLNjbG2trlekdeSmamabWqdAHNcFOd8GjyHM6bdFrbhwtS2YpyzXgLvXI0jmyzUDgmOLqBMnOL(0m(g0OrJgTmAqtS2Gwgtl26b5POfYeDe)gT8svqPIQOkQIpPkQn6Ja80FXTCDQA7wRtPQiMHPkOurvufvrvufvrvKE6zveaPIAJ(iXtpxUovTDR1PufuQOkQIQOkQIQOkgymfOQi90ZkOurvufvrMoOGIPdwYWFrg0ebcXYH(9h8BudAzXtanOf8cMTah4LrlWbEz0c5zGnAH8P)MXGwWly2cCGxgTah4LrlBMWt1cJgTGHVOGdg0cEbZww8GP1sA58m8zgZ4kljkxctrlNe2SmMwS1NN5hyl43ZdwslNVW84t(J5j6JMGfUeMIwaGgGCWsA5CyomYueUbihCLL0Y5j6JMGf4gGCaVGzteOLe9rlvTDRTKwohUbihWly2emAP6e062ClyqtS2e1BIqm0D7ERVR(6o6bEprdqi6nPUA0yIanXAJwGdTIaVlae4XF)g1e1B5hBuxzz4x45ZfipfbiMeTOvJwMBNbdAjTC((ANDLLqBMnOL(0m(g0OrlPLZhB9vh0eSSV2zdAzFAXmBbzQL(0m(g0cYutWccitXlYVe2eSaFc4Ljy0OrltlJKCz0qRB3AnzHOPt3Sa1p5URMUMu3BnwUkJKCz0eHmbOLax8nk4fmB5KcNQtWYpyPQTBTfKNIPaBb65dA5mm843ON5Cm8ffCynOrl0upy4lk4WAI1wsum8ffCWGws0hTu12T2sA58fMhFYFmprF0eSKwoprF0emA0eHyqltlJKCz0q35((gcqi1qQV1O)EsxtQ7DhlJPfB9G8u0czIoIFJwEPkOurvufvXNuf1g9raE6V4wUovTDHOtPQiMHPkOurvufvrvufvrvKE6zveaPIAJ(iXtpxUovTDHOtPkOurvufvrvufvrvmWykqvr6PNvqPIQOkQImDqbfthS8JnQRSGHVOGdg0cEbZww8GP1sA58m8zgZ4kljkxctrlNe2SKwohMdJmfHBaYbxzHlHPOfaObihSKwoFH5XN8hZt0hnblj6JwQA7cXcCdqoGxWSjc0sA58e9rtWsA5C4gGCaVGztWYyAXwFEMFGTGFppy0s1jO1T5wWGMyTH(wdKAiD13rpeGzNKDcetQRMUMietS2OLefdFrbhmOL0Y5j6JMGL0Y5lmp(K)yEI(OjyjrF0svBxigTKH)ImOjceIL52zWGwcTz2Gw6tZ4BqJgTKwoFFTZUYsA58XwF1bnbl7RD2Gw2NwmZwqMAPpnJVbTGm1eSGaYu8I8lHnblWNaEzcgnA0cn1dg(IcoSMyTLRYijxgn0AQb2Ds9eGt6KTUgYKSMu37BlbU4BuWly2YjfovNGLZWWJFJEMZXWxuWH1GgTG8umfylqpFql)GLQ2UqSm8l885cKNIaetIw0Qrlh63FWVrnOLfpb0GwWly2cCGxgTah4LrlKNb2OfYN(BgdAbVGzlWbEz0cCGxgTSzcpvlmA0Ojc0GwMwgj5YOHUdq9a1u3TwF2jaR7E3XK6ERXYyAXwpipfTqMOJ43OLxQckvufvrv8jvrTrFeGN(lULRtvBxG6uQkIzyQckvufvrvufvrvufPNEwfbqQO2Ops80ZLRtvBxG6uQckvufvrvufvrvufdmMcuvKE6zfuQOkQIQithuqX0bljkg(Icoyqlj6JwQA7c0sA58fMhFYFmprF0eSKwoprF0emAbdFrbhmOf8cMTS4btRL0Y5z4ZmMXvwsuUeMIwojSzzmTyRppZpWwWVNhSKwoFH5XN8hZt0hnblCjmfTaana5GL0Y5WCyKPiCdqo4klPLZt0hnblWna5aEbZMiqlj6JwQA7c0sA5C4gGCaVGztWOLQtqRBZTGbnrig6Uz7u3zsne9a10Ds3oznPUA6y0sg(lYGMiqiwo0V)GFJAqllEcObTGxWSf4aVmAboWlJwipdSrlKp93mg0cEbZwGd8YOf4aVmAzZeEQwy0OL52zWGwslNVV2zxzj0MzdAPpnJVbnA0sA58XwF1bnbl7RD2Gw2NwmZwqMAPpnJVbTGm1eSGaYu8I8lHnblWNaEzcgnA0YWVWZNlqEkcqmjArRgTe4IVrbVGzlNu4uDcw(blvTDbAb5PykWwGE(Gwoddp(n6zohdFrbhwdA0cn1dg(IcoSMyTLFSrDLLRYijxgn0AQb2Dce93zHCRbyne9Mu37BJM4TbTmMwS1dYtrlKj6i(nA5LQGsfvrvufFsvuB0hb4P)IB56u129wNsvrmdtvqPIQOkQIQOkQIQi90ZQiasf1g9rINEUCDQA7ERtPkOurvufvrvufvrvmWykqvr6PNvqPIQOkQImDqbfthSCOF)b)g1Gww8eqdAbVGzlWbEz0cCGxgTqEgyJwiF6VzmOf8cMTah4LrlWbEz0YMj8uTWOrly4lk4GbTGxWSLfpyATKwopdFMXmUYsIYLWu0YjHnlPLZH5Witr4gGCWvw4sykAbaAaYblPLZxyE8j)X8e9rtWsI(OLQ2UaTa3aKd4fmBIaTKwoprF0eSKwohUbihWly2eSmMwS1NN5hyl43ZdgTuDcADBUfmOjwBOZoPdKoAQR1FdrFDhi6nPUAUnrig6Uz7u3zsne9a10Ds3oDmPUA0yIan0z1m5gOEnq0aCYKSa1N1K6QbOrlxLrsUmAO1OVZD9nWj13aRN0jletQ79TLm8xKbnrGqSm3odg0sOnZg0sFAgFdA0OL0Y57RD2vwslNp26RoOjyzFTZg0Y(0Iz2cYul9Pz8nOfKPMGfeqMIxKFjSjyb(eWltWOrJw(Xg1vwOPEWWxuWH1eRTKOy4lk4GbTKwoprF0eSKwoFH5XN8hZt0hnblj6JwQA7c0OLax8nk4fmB5KcNQtWYzy4XVrpZ5y4lk4WAqJwqEkMcSfONpOLFWsvB3BltlJKCz0qNnBwnz1aPB2B9DG0PURj19(2YWVWZNlqEkcqmjArRgnA0sjMy9TE9gTb

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