A few questions about Frost

[Koix]

Hi there, a fairly new DK here, (played warrior since BC) and have a few quieries i cant seem to find answers for.

This is from a DW frost spec for PVE only.

1. I know that the way to go for stats is Haste> Mastery > Crit, but what is the haste cap where we start stacking mastery?

2. I have seen some high end DK's stacking mastery with only 11% haste, is that only viable for high end gear levels? Or is it just wrong and haste is our stack everything stat.

3. With everyone taking runic empowerment, are we supposed to burn all obliterates so that FS has greater chance to return a rune?

4. Do we pool runic power at all? Wouldnt we want to get rid of it asap for runes to come back or do we wait for KM proca before burning them off? (this is before runic cap of course)

5. Why do we put rune of razorice on the MH? Shouldnt it not matter since our attacks hit with both weapons?

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Jack Bauer]

1. Haste > Mastery > Crit is incorrect, DW Frost is Hit/Exp Cap (7.5% each) > Mastery > Haste > Crit. 2H is Haste > Crit > Mastery. Whatever you're getting your information from is out of date, as that was the Cataclysm stat priority.

2. More or less covered by the above question.

3. No.

DW Priority is as followed;
Soul Reaper when target below 35%
Diseases
Frost Strike if Killing Machine is procced
Death and Decay
Obliterate when Killing Machine is procced and both diseases are on the target and both Unholy Runes are off cooldown
Frost Strike if RP capped
Howling Blast if Rime procced
Obliterate when both diseases are on the target and both Unholy Runes are off cooldown
Frost Strike
Howling Blast
Horn of Winter

This basically makes sure that you can game your Frost/Death Runes for more Howling Blasts.

4. Perhaps you would for a tight burst phase (I.E: Heroic Spine Tendon burn phases), but otherwise, no.

5. Razorice scales from weapon damage. MH weapons have more weapon damage then OH weapons do, so it's a minor dps increase.

[Hunty]

1. I know that the way to go for stats is Haste> Mastery > Crit, but what is the haste cap where we start stacking mastery?
2. I have seen some high end DK's stacking mastery with only 11% haste, is that only viable for high end gear levels? Or is it just wrong and haste is our stack everything stat.
3. With everyone taking runic empowerment, are we supposed to burn all obliterates so that FS has greater chance to return a rune?
4. Do we pool runic power at all? Wouldnt we want to get rid of it asap for runes to come back or do we wait for KM proca before burning them off? (this is before runic cap of course)
5. Why do we put rune of razorice on the MH? Shouldnt it not matter since our attacks hit with both weapons?

1: its mastery>haste>crit, after hit/exp cap. Mastery doesnt cap out either, so there is no point of stuff overtaking it.
2: obvious, haste just isnt as good as mastery.
3: I'm pretty sure DW frost takes blood tap now to game unholy runes into death runes, but since I play 2h I'm not 100% on this. Either way, you will barely use obliterate at all. Priority list in the post above is wrong aswell, DW frost plays cata's masterfrost, aka spam Howling Blast.
4: since spending runic power regenerates runes, and spending runes generates runic power, you basically want to keep using stuff to be able to use more stuff. You only hold abilities for a few seconds in certain situations.
5: razorice does % of weapon damage, and your better weapon is usually the MH. Aside from that, there is also the situation where you might end up in front of the boss because of some reason, and the offhand does not get parried, so you keep full Fallen Crusader procs.

Basically, look up a guide on how to play DW frost first. I'd recommend Icy-veins

[Koix]

Thanks for the info guys. Would love some clarity tho since im getting confusing information.

- Is DND part of our rotation? Why would we use it?

- "Currently, the Two-Handed playstyle provides considerably more DPS than the dual-wielding one."[/I] (Icy-Veins) Is this true, simcraft and other players are reporting that DW does higher than 2h. Is this based on gear? (i.e 2h does better in heroic/a few epics while DW does better stacked in all epics?

- Whats our opening rotation like?

- We only cast obliterate when we have a KM proc, otherwise we use frost/death runes on HB? What do we use Unholy on then if we only use those 2 types of runes?

- Has any1 had success with Plague Leech and Blood tap as their talent choices?

[-Atrophos-]

Thanks for the info guys. Would love some clarity tho since im getting confusing information.

- Is DND part of our rotation? Why would we use it?

- "Currently, the Two-Handed playstyle provides considerably more DPS than the dual-wielding one."[/I] (Icy-Veins) Is this true, simcraft and other players are reporting that DW does higher than 2h. Is this based on gear? (i.e 2h does better in heroic/a few epics while DW does better stacked in all epics?

- Whats our opening rotation like?

- We only cast obliterate when we have a KM proc, otherwise we use frost/death runes on HB? What do we use Unholy on then if we only use those 2 types of runes?

- Has any1 had success with Plague Leech and Blood tap as their talent choices?

1. Yes, especially for the Blood Tap DW build. Use it to burn a U rune when there isn't a frost rune for Oblit.
2. That is outdated information, DW is currently the top simming spec when used with Blood Tap.
3. Army, CDs, normal priority list.
4. More or less answered in question one.
5. Plague Leech is definitely the #1 talent for our Teir 1. And there was an error in previous versions of simcraft that devalued it for DW frost. Currently it is the top rune regen choice for DW. It changes the priority slightly as well.

[Varyk]

Played a dk since day 1. You have a few miscinceptions, I'll clear everything as best I can.


1. If you're going DW you want Mastery>Haste>Crit (after capping hit/exp).

2. Mastery is stronger than haste, so yes.

3. If you're DW, you should be using Blood Tap, however if you're not capable of using it to it's potential, Runic Empowerment is fine.

4. Not really, Frost Strike is high in the priority for a reason, you don't want to be above 76 RP (to avoid capping), using all your resources correctly is the difference between having downtime and not. You use them for Plague Strike and Obliterate, whenever your Blood Plague is about to fall off or you use Plague Leech you'll need to use an unholy rune on Plague Strike. You always want your runes on CD, if they're idle they aren't recharging, this isn't good. You also use OB when both unholy/death runes are up to keep them recharging. Something to keep in mind, your diseases damage is based off your attack power, it's good to use Plague Leech after your initial Outbreak when your trinkets/Rotfc have procc'd and you still have pre-pot/pillar up to get maximum damage.

5. You put Rune of the Fallen Crusader on the OH because it can't be parried, therefore has a "guaranteed" chance to proc. It has to do with that and not necessarily Razorice.


Both Blood Tap and Plague Leech were "coded" (for lack of a better term) in sims incorrectly, since the fix, it's the strongest choice for Frost Death Knight dps.