Dakkroth (on shaman) gets hit by a 300k heroic strike oneshot (video)

[Torgent]

It needs a nerf. It doesn't matter if it happens once in 10 seasons, it's unbalanced because it leads to an instant win and is near impossible to avoid. If people end up getting something like rank 1 on this merit then I'd say they're no better than s5 keyboard turning dks.

near impossible to avoid? You've clearly never played a warrior. It's very very very easy for you to stop a warrior from getting 5 stacks of TFB. CC them, stun them, pay attention.

[cetch22]

Have you any clue how long it takes and how much luck you have to have to build up enough for Heroic Strike to hit remotely that hard? Terribly misrepresentation. A warrior's not just going to pop his cooldowns at the start and immediately hit a Heroic Strike for that hard.

Heroic Strike is NOT the source of Warrior Imbalance.

I don't care about setup time or rarity. Any mechanism in competitive pvp that allows a one shot like this is poor game design pure and simple.

[Herecius]

I don't care about setup time or rarity. Any mechanism in competitive pvp that allows a one shot like this is poor game design pure and simple.

It takes so hilariously long for a warrior to get a 5-stack of TFB (that's assuming RNG even ever allows for it in the first place), that getting hit by a 5-stack is the equivalent of not interrupting somebody's 60 second cast. Dead serious.

One CC during that stacking process and he'd be done. One peel and he'd be done, one escape and he'd be done. You would be able to see it coming from miles away. It's like standing on the train tracks at 4 pm waiting for the 5pm freight train to kill you.

[Torgent]

I don't care about setup time or rarity. Any mechanism in competitive pvp that allows a one shot like this is poor game design pure and simple.

Bad players allowed a warrior to get his stacks. The other player on dakkroth's team should have stopped this, but he didn't and they paid the price. A warrior getting 3+ stacks of TFB is nearly impossible, in arena it's even less likely because if your team does their job it won't happen.

---------- Post added 2012-11-06 at 02:10 PM ----------

It takes so hilariously long for a warrior to get a 5-stack of TFB (that's assuming RNG even ever allows for it in the first place), that getting hit by a 5-stack is the equivalent of not interrupting somebody's 30 second cast. Dead serious.

One CC during that stacking process and he'd be done. You would be able to see it coming from miles away. It's like standing on the train tracks at 4 pm waiting for the 5pm freight train to kill you.

Best post on here by far, I'm glad there are other people who actually think instead of reacting to the damage.

[cetch22]

near impossible to avoid? You've clearly never played a warrior. It's very very very easy for you to stop a warrior from getting 5 stacks of TFB. CC them, stun them, pay attention.

I agree that in arena people should be tracking warrior stacks. However in rbg you can only have one focus target. 90% of the time that focus is on a healer for cc and interrupts. It's still shit game design.

[Torgent]

I agree that in arena people should be tracking warrior stacks. However in rbg you can only have one focus target. 90% of the time that focus is on a healer for cc and interrupts. It's still shit game design.

I'm not saying pay attention to the stacks, I'm saying pay attention to the fact that there is a warrior. Like Herecius said above, there is never ever an excuse to allow a warrior to get 5 stacks. It's rare enough on a practice dummy, CC him once and he can't get it, stand there and let him pound on you for the entire fight and you deserve to be killed.

[cetch22]

By that reasoning why doesn't every dps get a 1-shot button that lights up when they haven't been cced for a one minute period while in combat. That's right, it's stupid. Any ability that allows a player to 100-0 someone is bad game design. The same reasoning applies to chaos bolt. One skill hitting for even 190k in pvp is imbalanced. It doesn't matter that it has a long cast time, or requires setup. Out of control burst in any form needs to be addressed.

Warriors defend this but then decry a 300k heal. Can't we agree that both are a bit stupid?

[Herecius]

By that reasoning why doesn't every dps get a 1-shot button that lights up when they haven't been cced for a one minute period while in combat. That's right, it's stupid. Any ability that allows a player to 100-0 someone is bad game design. The same reasoning applies to chaos bolt. One skill hitting for even 190k in pvp is imbalanced. It doesn't matter that it has a long cast time, or requires setup. Out of control burst in any form needs to be addressed.

Warriors defend this but then decry a 300k heal. Can't we agree that both are a bit stupid?

No, that's not the logic at all. A warrior is in no way shape or form assured to get a huge stack just from being left alone. As has been mentioned, such a thing is very rare on a target dummy, but on a player? Allowing it to ever happen is unforgivable. Simply put, if you let it happen and get hit by it in pvp, you deserve to die. You weren't going to win that fight anyways. This isn't 'out of control burst.'

I see some folks comparing it to oldschool Shaman proccing ontop of proccing and abruptly one-shotting somebody. That's not what this is like at all. This has a huge huge setup time, requires a ton of luck, and also probably requires their opponent to be afk and/or braindead.

It's not something that needs fixing or balancing. There are more important issues that need fixing. I don't even play a warrior and I can see this. I could stop it with nothing more than a scatter shot and a disengage, keeping the warrior off me for a whole 5 seconds.

[-aiko-]

By that reasoning why doesn't every dps get a 1-shot button that lights up when they haven't been cced for a one minute period while in combat. That's right, it's stupid. Any ability that allows a player to 100-0 someone is bad game design. The same reasoning applies to chaos bolt. One skill hitting for even 190k in pvp is imbalanced. It doesn't matter that it has a long cast time, or requires setup. Out of control burst in any form needs to be addressed.

Warriors defend this but then decry a 300k heal. Can't we agree that both are a bit stupid?

Warriors need tuning, but this is not the right thing to cry over. This is something that will RARELY happen, even on warriors you don't CC. This isn't a DPS button you can just sit and wait for. You need to, by pure luck, get enough procs to stack it to 5. You can't just wait for 5 stacks...in most cases TFB will fall off and it will have been wasted.

[Droodeffekt]

By that reasoning why doesn't every dps get a 1-shot button that lights up when they haven't been cced for a one minute period while in combat. That's right, it's stupid. Any ability that allows a player to 100-0 someone is bad game design. The same reasoning applies to chaos bolt. One skill hitting for even 190k in pvp is imbalanced. It doesn't matter that it has a long cast time, or requires setup. Out of control burst in any form needs to be addressed.

Warriors defend this but then decry a 300k heal. Can't we agree that both are a bit stupid?

You are taking it completely out of context. A warrior doesn't do this every minute, it doesn't even happen once every 100 arena games majority of the time. One CC and it is over, doesn't happen.

Sure the damage is stupid, sure the damage is over the top. No one is debating that. BUT. You have a way to reduce the impact it has on your game, so it shouldnt be complained about to the extent it is. There is call for a reduction, but the amount of "warriors are stupidly imbalanced and are OP because of TFB" is a stupid argument.

*Edit* Furthermore, you commented on 300k + heals. This would happen more often than a TFB 5 stack hit, but everyone focus on the 300k hit, not the 300k heal (that from some classes is instant)...? =/

[Angry]

I can't believe Blizzard havent hot fixed warriors TfB and Gag Order glyph.

[cetch22]

Warriors need tuning, but this is not the right thing to cry over. This is something that will RARELY happen, even on warriors you don't CC. This isn't a DPS button you can just sit and wait for. You need to, by pure luck, get enough procs to stack it to 5. You can't just wait for 5 stacks...in most cases TFB will fall off and it will have been wasted.

Rarity does not equal balance. I made a hyperbolic example to counter "well you let it happen argument." I thought people wanted less RNG not more in pvp. Calling out one imbalance does not mean I'm arguing for its correction over all other more major warrior balance issues.

Some of the arguments stating its your fault because you didnt deal with the warrior properly are akin to arguing against the much needed hunter burst nerfs. "Lynx rush is fine. It's your fault for not using bubble."

[Deleted]

It's not something that needs fixing or balancing. There are more important issues that need fixing. I don't even play a warrior and I can see this. I could stop it with nothing more than a scatter shot and a disengage, keeping the warrior off me for a whole 5 seconds.

Ehh, that's not necesarrily gonna work..

[Nest]

I feel bad for hoping that Blizz would focus on PvP in MoP atleast a bit more.

E: Not sure if someone already posted this, but Tosan is a king.

[Herecius]

Rarity does not equal balance. I made a hyperbolic example to counter "well you let it happen argument." I thought people wanted less RNG not more in pvp. Calling out one imbalance does not mean I'm arguing for its correction over all other more major warrior balance issues.

Some of the arguments stating its your fault because you didnt deal with the warrior properly are akin to arguing against the much needed hunter burst nerfs. "Lynx rush is fine. It's your fault for not using bubble."

The thing is... it's really not imbalanced, is what people are saying. It should never ever happen in pvp, seriously ever. Getting up to a 5-stack is more of a huge reward for miraculous RNG in PvE, but it should never happen in PvP. Lynx Rush isn't nearly as easy to counter, it's not similar at all. I'm not personally happy about the LR nerf (I'm a hunter!) but I understand why it's being done. This though? This needs no nerfing. Lynx Rush is just a straight up 1.5 minute cooldown.

This is a one-in-a-million hit that will only happen to you if you let a warrior beat on you for a minute straight un-CC'd, unpeeled, while winning the lottery.

---------- Post added 2012-11-06 at 11:46 AM ----------

Ehh, that's not necesarrily gonna work..

TFB lasts only 15 seconds. If I can get him off of me for a third of that time, it's most likely going to fall off or be used, rather than risk trying to stack it again. That was mostly my point.

[Powerflux]

Does that matter? It obviously happens, this isn't the first video. Giving free wins because of bad ability design is pretty....bad.

This is pretty much how I feel. Just because it happens once in thirty games or so doesn't mean it's excusable.

[r3as0n]

Not paying attention to Warrior TFB Stacks = you get 2 shotted; you deserve to lose to a 2200 team. Blame your team as well.

[Flaks]

near impossible to avoid? You've clearly never played a warrior. It's very very very easy for you to stop a warrior from getting 5 stacks of TFB. CC them, stun them, pay attention.

I played a warrior as my only class since 2005 and I KNOW that it is practically impossible to keep a warrior from gaining those stacks because warrior sustained, control and burst OUTSIDE of TfB alone is something that other classes need to use their cds on avoiding. So when you throw that on top on a measly UI buff showing up under the warrior (remember that any truly competitive players DO NOT USE ADDONS) and you'll see why it's so hard to avoid.

Either way, there's no justifying this mechanic's existence in PvP whatsoever.

[Baracuda]

Correct me if I'm wrong but the odds of getting 5 stacks in a row is about 0.25%, you're 4 times as likely to get deathcharger.
And if the warriors is lucky enough to get 5 stacks he will have to hold off with heroic strike and utility abilties, if you can't avoid a warrior like that you deserve to die.

You could also wait with disarm and/or CC until his TfB gets high, or kite like every good pvper does.

[Torgent]

This is pretty much how I feel. Just because it happens once in thirty games or so doesn't mean it's excusable.

This guy has no idea how the class works but still thinks it's OP. Seriously people, are you even reading what we are saying? It will NEVER happen to a good team. Worship your idol all you want, this was a pathetic show of pvp ability. Kite the warrior for 3-5 seconds and he will not get stacks, stun him and he will not get stacks, put him on the defensive and he will not get stacks, move and he will not get stacks.

---------- Post added 2012-11-06 at 02:55 PM ----------

I played a warrior as my only class since 2005 and I KNOW that it is practically impossible to keep a warrior from gaining those stacks because warrior sustained, control and burst OUTSIDE of TfB alone is something that other classes need to use their cds on avoiding. So when you throw that on top on a measly UI buff showing up under the warrior (remember that any truly competitive players DO NOT USE ADDONS) and you'll see why it's so hard to avoid.

Either way, there's no justifying this mechanic's existence in PvP whatsoever.

You must be the best warrior in the world if you think it's impossible to keep you from getting stacks.