1. #2661
    Mechagnome
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Dubbo, NSW
    Posts
    696
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...yryso/advanced

    This is me. Do I need improvement, gear-wise or something else, or am I right until WoD?

  2. #2662

  3. #2663
    Quote Originally Posted by ShasVa View Post
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...yryso/advanced

    This is me. Do I need improvement, gear-wise or something else, or am I right until WoD?
    Only main thing I spot is you need to not care about socket bonuses, use them as a perk once you are over haste cap. until you reach haste cap go pure haste gems in every socket. You also have 1 unused JC gem FYI :P. Talent wise, all looks ok, personal preference for me I choose speed of light for tier 1, as when you need to move, its infrequent and its large movements. There are very rare situations where you need to consistently move, and for those scenarios you pick the judgement one.
    Cetraben (Armory Link) - Guild Master + Raid Leader - <Catalyst> Tarren Mill (EU-Horde) - Currently Recruiting: Click for more info

  4. #2664
    Heya!

    I came across this thread and it seems to be a solid place to find improvement for my play. I'm sorry I can't post links because I registered for this. Armory information is included and logs links are from warcraftlogs.com

    Armory Link:
    Nini on H-Draenor EU

    Alternate Specs/Glyphs:
    Using a slightly different build for Siegecrafter shredders (Exec Sentence, Focused Shield), also have Ret spec, but let's focus on Prot side now

    Warcraftlogs Links:
    reports/BmtHQXF6KCJ2rLZD - Gary attempts, pt. 1
    reports/fKZ2Vr3PM9pDbTz7 - Gary attempts, pt. 2
    reports/HTKBtF3Qa2gXcNy9 - H2 of SoO, logs pt. 1
    reports/zd6aH8bptcB4FjCh - H2 of SoO, logs pt. 2
    reports/n4D8zd9Wa3xwQcZj - H1 of SoO

    Questions, concerns, expectations:
    Please help me out on some things:
    1) suggestions on how to take less damage, as far as I know I am taking more than my fellow tanks (not sure about smoothness factor). For example, I'm not sure if I'm using EF properly or time shield slams correctly, and of course insight on defensive cooldown usage,
    2) suggestions on how to improve my dps, I have a feeling it's lower than it's supposed to be for my gear, also I lose aggro to my co-tank Monk/DK the moment he hits the mobs even if I have a few seconds head start (still, I keep them off dps fine),
    3) suggestions on some changes to gearing strategy (following Control/Haste on default settings in AMR currently with BiS list limited to N-WF items max),
    4) other tips, boss specific, addons, macros etc

    Description of Playstyle:
    Currently keybinding majority of the buttons, using CLCRet and CLCProt2.0 unofficial update to help me out on the priority list. Main UI is ElvUI and I've tried to keep it very minimal. Those priority helper icons, ElvUI frames, nameplates from ElvUI and DBM are about the only things I have combat-related installed. Recently I was fiddling around with the idea of eating some of the annihilates on Garrosh but I am not sure if it was worth the added risk, couldn't make it out of the logs I'm reasonably aware of the surroundings but especially when I need to call things out on voice chat for the other raid members (like calling some of Gary mechanics that are incoming so they'll be prepared for that) I might "tunnel" myself too much into it and miss some things in game. I'm not great or even good at any rate, but I'm willing to learn more. I just get a gut feeling I'm more useful as Ret at the moment because my tanking feels too much binary at the moment (dead/not dead, and that's about it).

    Thank you a lot, looking forward to your helpful tips!
    -Nini
    Last edited by Nini; 2014-05-13 at 08:37 PM.

  5. #2665
    Quote Originally Posted by Nini View Post
    Heya!

    I came across this thread and it seems to be a solid place to find improvement for my play. I'm sorry I can't post links because I registered for this. Armory information is included and logs links are from warcraftlogs.com

    Armory Link:
    Nini on H-Draenor EU

    Alternate Specs/Glyphs:
    Using a slightly different build for Siegecrafter shredders (Exec Sentence, Focused Shield), also have Ret spec, but let's focus on Prot side now

    Warcraftlogs Links:
    reports/BmtHQXF6KCJ2rLZD - Gary attempts, pt. 1
    reports/fKZ2Vr3PM9pDbTz7 - Gary attempts, pt. 2
    reports/HTKBtF3Qa2gXcNy9 - H2 of SoO, logs pt. 1
    reports/zd6aH8bptcB4FjCh - H2 of SoO, logs pt. 2
    reports/n4D8zd9Wa3xwQcZj - H1 of SoO

    Questions, concerns, expectations:
    Please help me out on some things:
    1) suggestions on how to take less damage, as far as I know I am taking more than my fellow tanks (not sure about smoothness factor). For example, I'm not sure if I'm using EF properly or time shield slams correctly, and of course insight on defensive cooldown usage,
    2) suggestions on how to improve my dps, I have a feeling it's lower than it's supposed to be for my gear, also I lose aggro to my co-tank Monk/DK the moment he hits the mobs even if I have a few seconds head start (still, I keep them off dps fine),
    3) suggestions on some changes to gearing strategy (following Control/Haste on default settings in AMR currently with BiS list limited to N-WF items max),
    4) other tips, boss specific, addons, macros etc

    Description of Playstyle:
    Currently keybinding majority of the buttons, using CLCRet and CLCProt2.0 unofficial update to help me out on the priority list. Main UI is ElvUI and I've tried to keep it very minimal. Those priority helper icons, ElvUI frames, nameplates from ElvUI and DBM are about the only things I have combat-related installed. Recently I was fiddling around with the idea of eating some of the annihilates on Garrosh but I am not sure if it was worth the added risk, couldn't make it out of the logs I'm reasonably aware of the surroundings but especially when I need to call things out on voice chat for the other raid members (like calling some of Gary mechanics that are incoming so they'll be prepared for that) I might "tunnel" myself too much into it and miss some things in game. I'm not great or even good at any rate, but I'm willing to learn more. I just get a gut feeling I'm more useful as Ret at the moment because my tanking feels too much binary at the moment (dead/not dead, and that's about it).

    Thank you a lot, looking forward to your helpful tips!
    -Nini
    Never gem stam, replace all non 320 haste gems with 320 gems (you can if u want take the socket bonus on helm and chest). Trinkets are kinda meh (dps wise especially), if u have hc spark from ToT go with that along with thok's tail whip ideally. Just with the regemming and trinket changes u should gain 10% or so haste, that will make a big difference to smoothing ur damage intake and boost ur dps. Drop HA for Divine purpose (only fight u should use HA is Malk for solo soaking blood rage). You should'nt lose aggro to ur co tanks (except if there are multiple targets), but to grab better threat on tank switches, make sure u taunt with 5 hp slam SotR in his face then judgement another SotR followed by AS. By the time u done that u should have taken enough hits to have some decent vengeance so threat should be fine. Remember u have a salvation u can use if u want
    You should also replace DP glyph with final wrath or focused shield.
    Last edited by Brummie; 2014-05-13 at 10:20 PM.

  6. #2666
    Quote Originally Posted by Brummie View Post
    Never gem stam, replace all non 320 haste gems with 320 gems (you can if u want take the socket bonus on helm and chest). Trinkets are kinda meh (dps wise especially), if u have hc spark from ToT go with that along with thok's tail whip ideally. Just with the regemming and trinket changes u should gain 10% or so haste, that will make a big difference to smoothing ur damage intake and boost ur dps. Drop HA for Divine purpose (only fight u should use HA is Malk for solo soaking blood rage). You should'nt lose aggro to ur co tanks (except if there are multiple targets), but to grab better threat on tank switches, make sure u taunt with 5 hp slam SotR in his face then judgement another SotR followed by AS. By the time u done that u should have taken enough hits to have some decent vengeance so threat should be fine. Remember u have a salvation u can use if u want
    You should also replace DP glyph with final wrath or focused shield.
    Hi!

    Thanks for your insight. You're right, I should replace those JC gems. Helmet mixed gem is going to stay, unsure about chest ones. I have read that I should be changing Rook's to Thok's trinket, but I'm not exactly following you on saying Malk's trinket as meh, as I've read about anywhere it's great. Care to elaborate on that?

    Switching HA out is likely sound advice, but I'm not sure about losing DP glyph as that 20% reduction on all damage seems quite decent (apart from some purposes 40% magic is better, which isn't many cases afaik?), isn't it?

    Finally, I think my threat description might've been a bit unclear. I have no trouble at all on boss tank swaps.
    What I meant was that on trash, if I get a few second headstart (both tanks at 0 vengeance in start of pull), I'll lose the aggro right away. Basically, aggro issue on where it doesn't really matter at all, but still... Well, it's a bit of a trouble on Gary P1 adds too, but that's more to do with the other tank having boatload of vengeance.

    Edit: I have currently LFR Thok's trinket, is it worth swapping for N-WF Rook's?
    Last edited by Nini; 2014-05-14 at 03:31 PM.

  7. #2667
    Malkorok's trinket is great on some fights and meh on others (when you are having to wait to use a cooldown because of a timer). A fight like Immerseus is an example of it being useless, while it allows you to use Avenging Wrath on the pull and during Blood Rage for solo-ing on Malkorok.

    There are also other fights where you simply don't need the stamina.
    Intel i7 5820K (4.5 GHz) | MSI X99A MPower | 32GB Kingston HyperX Fury 2666MHz | Gigabyte Windforcex3 HD 7950 | Samsung 951PRO nVME 512GB | Crucial M550 256GB | Crucial MX200 1TB | Western Digital Caviar Black 2000GB | Samson SR 850 | Zalman ZM-Mic1 | Noctua NH-D15 | Fractal Define R5 | Seasonic X850

    Former author of the TankSpot.com Protection Paladin guide

  8. #2668
    Quote Originally Posted by Nini View Post
    Hi!

    Thanks for your insight. You're right, I should replace those JC gems. Helmet mixed gem is going to stay, unsure about chest ones. I have read that I should be changing Rook's to Thok's trinket, but I'm not exactly following you on saying Malk's trinket as meh, as I've read about anywhere it's great. Care to elaborate on that?

    Switching HA out is likely sound advice, but I'm not sure about losing DP glyph as that 20% reduction on all damage seems quite decent (apart from some purposes 40% magic is better, which isn't many cases afaik?), isn't it?

    Finally, I think my threat description might've been a bit unclear. I have no trouble at all on boss tank swaps.
    What I meant was that on trash, if I get a few second headstart (both tanks at 0 vengeance in start of pull), I'll lose the aggro right away. Basically, aggro issue on where it doesn't really matter at all, but still... Well, it's a bit of a trouble on Gary P1 adds too, but that's more to do with the other tank having boatload of vengeance.

    Edit: I have currently LFR Thok's trinket, is it worth swapping for N-WF Rook's?
    You only need Rook's when you need the stamina cushion. Think of it this way: stamina's your best survivability stat. Eventually though diminishing returns kicks in, hard, and you no longer need the padded stamina. You're able to survive just fine without it. You're at that point now I guarantee you. So, yes, use LFR Thok's over Rook's in general. Suppose though you're doing a fight where there's a lot of bursty magic damage (e.g. Dark Shamans Heroic) and you want to give yourself a little more durability. Rook's could work there.

  9. #2669
    Thanks for your gearing and talent/glyph advice. I have made some changes, any further suggestions on those aspects?
    Furthermore, it would be much appreciated if you could point out things to improve upon from the logs I posted.

  10. #2670
    Hey guys, I will be starting to tank SoO 10HC this Sunday and would appreciate any criticism of my gear (~558) especially anything that i will be able to find as an upgrade this lockout before i go into HC. The empty glyph slot normaly is used for Focused Shield on ST fights.

    Most of our raid team is 6/14HC, I am however new to the game and have just moved from holy to prot to fill a raid vacancy. I have tanked a couple of normal clears without any problems and am confident that my rotation is roughly correct.

    If there are any resources from a tanking viewpoint with good info on SoO bosses (currently fatboss videos are what i have been watching) especially any ones with pally tricks i would appreciate being pointed in that direction.

    I am currently using HA, though i understand DP will give me slightly higher uptime in general? I have been using HA on the pull to ensure my active mitigation is up and i have high threat as early as possible in the fight and after that as a physical defensive cooldown. Should i be switching to DP?

    I know Thok's trinket is meant to be a solid item, however the juggernaut is the only other tank trinket i have been able to get hold of. A guildie suggested the 550 pvp trinket might be more useful to me than it, would this be worth grinding?

    I haven't been able to get hold of any logs of my normal runs yet.

    Any other constructive criticism would be appreciated and I will get back to you with logs after Sunday's raid if anyone would be happy to take a look at them for me.

    Name: Dayras
    Server: Aggrammar
    Last edited by Saryad; 2014-05-16 at 12:10 AM. Reason: My spelling is awful.

  11. #2671
    Field Marshal
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Illidan - EU
    Posts
    90
    @Saryad

    Gems and reforges are decent. Ilvl upgrades is the next step for you.

    Switch to DP, there is no real reason not to. HA is good if you solo blood rage on Malk and/or solo tank Thok.
    Do not take Pursuit of Justice, SoL and eventually LAotL are your best bets depending the encounter.

    I'm not sure if pvp trinket is a good idea. On use stam might help here and there but I think that smart cd usage prevents you to use it at all already.
    You can farm Horridon's Spark (ToT) which is all around good, Vial on Malkorock for survivability (I really like this one), Skeer/Core for dps.
    The SPA exp trinket is also worth noticing against the IJ one.

    The first 6 bosses won't cause you any real issue. Just use your cds at the correct time and do what you're supposed to do.
    Just ask if you want a boss to boss review, I can pm you what I do/use using our strats in mind.
    Moussaka - Paladin Protection
    Ragedoll -Warrior Protection
    Quote Originally Posted by Velkhan View Post
    Those warriors... blizzard should rename "shout" spells to "cry" they are so good at that.

  12. #2672
    Quote Originally Posted by Nini View Post
    Thanks for your gearing and talent/glyph advice. I have made some changes, any further suggestions on those aspects?
    Furthermore, it would be much appreciated if you could point out things to improve upon from the logs I posted.
    It's hard for me to really critique someone who has taken HA and doing NM content, to be honest. I'm also not sure what haste level you were @ on the logs you posted, so I can't estimate how many abilities you should've used. With that said, your logs look solid at a cursory glance.

  13. #2673
    Quote Originally Posted by Saryad View Post
    I know Thok's trinket is meant to be a solid item, however the juggernaut is the only other tank trinket i have been able to get hold of.
    Any other constructive criticism would be appreciated and I will get back to you with logs after Sunday's raid if anyone would be happy to take a look at them for me.

    Name: Dayras
    Server: Aggrammar
    I'd take a 450 ghost iron dragonling over Jugg's trink. Nothing wrong with 1800 good stats (haste / exp / mastery) The self heal from Jugg's crystal is about as valuable as the damage the dragonling does :P

  14. #2674
    Quote Originally Posted by Moussaka View Post
    Just ask if you want a boss to boss review, I can pm you what I do/use using our strats in mind.
    It would be great if you could give me a quick summary of the "danger zones" for each fight and advice on which cooldowns to use for them.

  15. #2675
    Could you please take a look at our prot palas dps on juggernaut hc progress and see if he's doing something wrong dps wise? His survivability's fine, but we're trying to only get one siege phase and seems like our tank dps is the most improvable ones.
    http://www.warcraftlogs.com/guilds/9496/

    armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Thebj/advanced

  16. #2676
    Field Marshal
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Illidan - EU
    Posts
    90
    @Overdispersion

    He has very low haste for this ilvl. He should replace some of his haste/stam or haste/exp for full haste gems. Also some items are dodge/parry or the like, this is not what he wants (but I guess loot RNG is RNG).
    Avenging Wrath glyph is bad, he should change it to Focused Shield/Alabaster/Word of Glory/Final Wrath depending the encounter. Also I hope he does not use Divine Protection glyph on IJ.
    Specifically for IJ: FS/FW/Alab or WoG. It should improve his dps by a good margin.

    Although he can do better, I don't know for other pals in here but IJ is not the fight where my dps is very high as we are 10 man and do not one tank it.
    If he is assigned to take all mines (like we do), uptime on the boss is even lower, especially if you stand at the back of the "room" in p2.
    Moussaka - Paladin Protection
    Ragedoll -Warrior Protection
    Quote Originally Posted by Velkhan View Post
    Those warriors... blizzard should rename "shout" spells to "cry" they are so good at that.

  17. #2677
    Quote Originally Posted by Overdispersion View Post
    Could you please take a look at our prot palas dps on juggernaut hc progress and see if he's doing something wrong dps wise? His survivability's fine, but we're trying to only get one siege phase and seems like our tank dps is the most improvable ones.
    http://www.warcraftlogs.com/guilds/9496/

    armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Thebj/advanced
    Looking at those logs I do not walk away saying, "the biggest concern here is clearly DPS." On 25 attempts maybe 2 were the result of not killing the boss fast enough? Maybe, probably not even then; it's ambitious to approach a fight like a DPS race when you're 3 healing it.

    People are dying constantly. Sometimes it's their fault, like not using any defensives at all or standing in cannons, but other times it's like the warrior (attempt 21) went 9s without receiving any heals at all. Then he used Shield Wall to take a mine (which I assume he was forced to do), which is fine but where are your healers? Or attempt 22 the holy paladin went 6s with no heals except for random shit from the MW. How does a healer not receive heals from himself or others for that many GCDs? Just go down the list and it's epidemic. You didn't log using Advanced Logging so I cannot review your raid's positioning but I'd seriously look into that, because it's possible during Siege Phase that you're too spread out.

    And you say the tank survivability is fine yet I'm seeing both of them, but mostly the prot paladin, dying on several attempts. I mean the prot paladin is using Sacred Shield in a tier where EF >> SS and especially on a fight where the HoT would be very useful. He'll take Flame Vents for 500k+, no CDs used whatsoever. Some of those deaths aren't the tanks' faults, granted, like a few times the DK was running around getting mines and no one was healing him at all. You need to focus him, make sure he doesn't die...responsibility is shared, best seen in attempt 5. Here your prot paladin took lots of unmitigated damage (his fault) but received two legitimate heals (Holy Shock 136k / Atonement 119k) for 14s (their fault). MW is MW I guess but what are your others doing there?

    I'd say the prot paladin's DPS is the least of your concerns right now.

  18. #2678
    Yea the palas dps is the least of his problems.

    Hes using seal of truth which is so bad its off the scale for prot. On all your attempts combined it did 22m dmg at the cost of heaps of survivability. Also he needs to use EF as was stated.
    On your 6 minute attempt his shield of the righteous uptime was 17% (fine its lower because you run away but thats bad) He also never used DP once that fight, its kinda the go tool tool to take later stacks of flame vents.
    He also never uses holy wrath. It hits hard with high vengeance. Get him to read the prot rotation in the sticky. (and his his abilities faster - I'd bet money hes a clicker)
    Last edited by Deja Thoris; 2014-05-19 at 04:55 PM.

  19. #2679
    Titan MerinPally's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Chemistry block.
    Posts
    13,373
    Your 570ilvl heroic geared protection paladin has a significantly lower amount of haste than me, and I am 530 half LFR gear half TOT or before. Haste is the number one stat. The logs are not promising given the number others are quoting. He really needs to go read about the class and find out what he's doing, missing entire spells out with terrible uptimes.

    But then by the sounds of it, this isn't even your biggest problem.
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...nicus/advanced
    Quote Originally Posted by goblinpaladin View Post
    Also a vegetable is a person.
    Quote Originally Posted by Orlong View Post
    I dont care if they [gays] are allowed to donate [blood], but I think we should have an option to refuse gay blood if we need to receive blood.

  20. #2680
    Just picked the game back up this past Monday (5/20) from where I left off at the start of Cata. J/W if anyone has any insight as to which raid fights to look to continue the gearing.

    Armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...angaurd/simple

    Also before anyone asks, this toons name used to be Alenko (always felt bad for killing him every time) but when I transferred that name was taken so went with Vanguard (ME class), that was taken so just flipped the a and u. Never knew of a "famous" pally with the correct spelling of the same name.
    Last edited by Alenko; 2014-05-26 at 05:29 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •