[Prot] Fix my Tanking!

[Lethora]

Well, that list is nice. However, I found out most of those things by myself when trying to bubble out of certain debuffs

[Deleted]

Well, that list is nice. However, I found out most of those things by myself when trying to bubble out of certain debuffs

always the first thing we should do on new encounters tbh - oh we're going to wipe....ah well lets see if bubble resets stacks

[Deleted]

yooo guys. you might remember me, probably not though.

I'm coming back to WoW after a 6 month break~ and I need some tips.

Anything new changed with Paladongs I need to know? Please feel free to critique me as much as you want.
http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...Felir/advanced

[Nillo]

Less expertise - more haste.
I don't really agree with your t5/6 talent choices but maybe that's just me. (both of them are very situational)

Other than that there's nothing wrong I can spot with your gear/spec.

[Deleted]

Please feel free to critique me as much as you want.

What Nillo said.

Also, I dislike your new avatar.

Welcome back!

[Deleted]

@Nillo Fanks bro. Is 15% no longer required then?
@Firefly33 Aww, have you missed me? Also, it dislikes you back.

[Nairobi]

@Nillo Fanks bro. Is 15% no longer required then?
@Firefly33 Aww, have you missed me? Also, it dislikes you back.

15% is great to shoot for, but is not (and wasn't really ever) required. Haste is always better, past 7.5% exp (since all that extra exp will only affect CS/HotR). If you max out haste and have stats left over, put them into expertise (up to 15%).

[Nillo]

You're over 15% ~
Well exp isn't all that important since several abilities don't rely on it - especially the hard hitting ones.
My way to approach this is: do not go out of your way to reach the cap.
The no-go zone: Pure exp gems, exp enchants , exp reforge over haste
The "I still need that 1%" zone: pick up mehish red slots with orange gems (like your boots), use exp food

P.S. : Not a fan of using haste over pandaren's step. Especially in higher level gear I don't think it's worth giving up the movement speed over some tiny haste gain.

[Nairobi]

You're over 15% ~
Well exp isn't all that important since several abilities don't rely on it - especially the hard hitting ones.
My way to approach this is: do not go out of your way to reach the cap.
The no-go zone: Pure exp gems, exp enchants , exp reforge over haste
The "I still need that 1%" zone: pick up mehish red slots with orange gems (like your boots), use exp food

P.S. : Not a fan of using haste over pandaren's step. Especially in higher level gear I don't think it's worth giving up the movement speed over some tiny haste gain.

Yep - Exp enchant on gloves (when you're at 15%+) is a big waste.

He's using the haste to boots cause he's got POJ talented. That one's kinda up to you, but general consensus is POJ sucks. LAotL is always going to out-perform POJ after a decent amount of haste (~500ilvl) in terms of overall and burst movement speed. Personally, I use SOL instead of LAotL since this tier has so many fights where it's far better (Jinrohk, Horridon, Council, Meg, JiKun, Primo (hc only), Animus, Qon, LeiShen), and the ones not listed there are mostly standstill fights like Tortos, RaDen, or easy movers like Durumu.

[Promdates]

P.S. : Not a fan of using haste over pandaren's step. Especially in higher level gear I don't think it's worth giving up the movement speed over some tiny haste gain.

You can use Pandaren's Step and then pick up the speed burst talent in the first tier, that way you have a passive speed increase and a burst one on demand.

[trystero]

SoL is one of those talents that for me was originally situational and then became standard. Much like DP, a talent which I distrusted completely and now cannot go without.

[Nairobi]

SoL is one of those talents that for me was originally situational and then became standard. Much like DP, a talent which I distrusted completely and now cannot go without.

Agreed. In t14, you couldn't get me out of POJ. Then, I thought about it and was like "holy shit, this sucks, LAotL is beast!" in t15 progression. I figured, as an engi, i had boots for if I got stuck in Africa. Then, while doing HC Lei Shen progress, I was like "man, this sure is a lot easier with SOL". Same story on Megaera. It's pretty much mandatory on JiKun. Soon, I noticed that it was better on almost every fight.

I still hold strong to my HA on most fights. Gotta abuse it while I can, since DP will be unquestionable in t16. RIP old friend, you've served me well.

[sandspally]

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...pally/advanced

My iLvl is 510 and I've run myself through www.askmyrobot.com
I'm generally happy but when I run with my guild, the other tank (a pally also) has the identical ilvl (but slightly different gear) seems to have less problems with aggro.

By aggro issues, if we're doing a tank swap, he *really* grabs the boss's attention. My taunts work but my threat is a lot less than his.

I'm not sure why.

He uses www.askmrrobot.com as well, so it's not like he has some secret inside information.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Thank you

[Cheekun]

The long winded answer has so many variables that without further information (logs, etc) i can't really delve deeply into this end, but i'll try.

He could very well be doing his rotation better then you are, as such he is generating much more threat and causing these taunt swap problems. You're also using Divine Pourpose, which is just flat out not the best talent in the teir (in theroy it surpasses Holy avenger at higher haste levels but its so unreliable for mitagation and threat that its a wash). Holy avenger can help with taunt swap threat (pop it when you taunt) so you can also pump out extra SoTR and through it mitigate damage taken AND generate more threat. Additionally you could hand of salv him on taunt swaps to avoid him pulling threat back till you are established.

The short answer is having your other paladin tank just back off until you have threat well established.

Just remember you have hand of salv (and hopefully you'll take HA and use it on taunt swaps or on the pull to help bolster your threat generation). I also don't agree with Hand of Purity for normal modes (and heroics but i can see its limited value there), you could take Clemecy instead to have two hand of salvs if threat is an issue even with HA.

When i was just easing into throne i'd pop wings and holy avenger together on pulls and such to boost my threat, no real loss there.

[Revvo]

It also has to do with that fact that you're taunting off a full vengeance tank with the most damage in the game while having little to no vengeance.

[Deleted]

Looking on askmrrobot you went for the default control/haste build.
Click on edit weights and tick the box "Low Stamina" save then optimize.
You don't really need that extra stamina at all tbh, working fine for me and im well into heroic tot now.
Also it seems you've been going for traditional tank gear. I've found that going for Haste dps plate (preferably without crit) is much much more beneficial. I would even change your loot specialization to Retribution for the likes of lfr and coin usage. (unless you need a 1h or shield)

If you changed the gear your looking for, changed the stat weights on askmrrobot and follow the advice Cheekun mentioned above your mate wont stand a chance tbh. To analyze your rotation, to see if it's that, we would really need to see some logs though.

I know my gear is quite a bit higher in item level but this is the kind of gear I work for and it's worked very well.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...s/Ronus/simple

[sandspally]

Very constructive and thoughtful replies - thank you all.
I'll take it all on board.

Thanking you.

PS: Good point about the other pally tank getting the crap pounded out of him and having a lot of vengence!

[Nairobi]

Vengeance will play a part certainly, but keep in mind that when you taunt, you gain 50% of his current vengeance, so you're not going in dry.

A big part is more likely the simple "hit more buttons, faster" answer. Obviously, logs help to determine that, but 99% of us here can and do get sloppy or late on key-presses. Eeking out a few more globals per minute simply by spamming faster/harder is the easiest way to boost your DPS, TPS, and ShotR uptime.

A big part of THAT comes from proper gearing. Haste, via SoB, reduces the CD and GCD of pretty much all your abilities. This means more spamming, faster. This means more GCDs spent, which means more DPS and more TPS. Obviously, you're at the mercy of RNJesus with loot drops, but you should aim to cap hit, get at least 7.5% exp, and rest into haste. Don't focus on stamina outside of what you get naturally. Should see a big boost to your D/T/HPS.

[Metic]

One thing you can do, especially on "planned" swaps is to Sac him. It's not going to hurt either of you, and it'd give you a little vengeance to work with at the start of your taunt.

[Palthus]

All of the advice I have seen here has been solid. The only other thing I would add is how to deal with swaps. Even well geared tanks can get ripped off of if the original tank has full stacks of vengeance, especially if they are using DPS trinkets that have proc'd at the time of the swap. Using Hand of Salvation on the other tank is a great way to give you a chance to grab aggro and build up a little vengeance while the other tanks vengeance is wearing off and can really smooth out tank swaps. I personally use a hand of salv mouse over macro for this.

Another thing you can do is use an offensive CD like Avenging Wrath or Holy Avenger to increase your threat when you are taking the boss. Obviously you don't want to waste this CD so make sure you know the fight and map out the fight and only use it if you know that it will be back up for a burn phase.