Romney - still focusing on blaming those moochers and minorities

[Shadowmelded]

I won't give a detailed list of agreement and disagreement for the Romney campaign, but I think it's disingenuous to suggest that many of the policies which seem intended to limit government are somehow targeted at hurting low or mid income people.

edit: man I'll have to post faster or start quoting more, so many posts since I typed this.

They might not be necessarily targeted at low or mid income people, but the ramifications of the policies result in low or mid income people being negatively affected. Sure the hyperbole might get a little out of hand sometimes (go politics!) but it's equally disingenuous of the other side to pretend that there are no negative consequences and that their policies hurt no one.

[Masark]

I'd love to have Voter ID... however, every attempt at Voter ID has caused certain members of a certain party to start frothing at the mouth and start babbling about 'voter disenfranchisement, you cant do that, you dont want to bring back poll taxes, its a violation of civil rights'

Because that's exactly what the proposed implementations i've seen are.

Feel free to copy our voter identification standards. It's in the public domain.

[Lenonis]

I don't mind if people vote. I mind when people who don't know what they're talking about, or racist people vote.

These people who don't want things like gay marriage. Why not? Because YOU believe in this God bullshit and you think everyone should cater to you? How on Earth is that fair? Or a correct mindset? It's fucking stupid is what it is.
Or people who voted against Obama solely because he's "half-black". These are the people that should not be allowed to have an opinion, because their opinion is fucking stupid.

There just needs to be a better system of "Voter-ID".

So....why didn't you just say "I don't mind if people vote. I mind when people who have a different opinion of value system than I do vote."

Cause that's what you meant.

[Shoridayo]

So....why didn't you just say "I don't mind if people vote. I mind when people who have a different opinion of value system than I do vote."

Cause that's what you meant.

Not at all. If people disagree with me, I'm perfectly fine with that. I'm not fine with people using outdated belief systems in order to shape how they think, or when racist people are allowed to vote solely on race.

Are you really saying that you think it's completely fine for people to vote for Romney, not because they agree with his political stances, but because they don't like Obama because he's black?
If you're saying that, please say so, so I can ignore anything you say hence-forth.

People can believe whatever they want, I don't care. But when they start forcing that belief on me? That's where I have a problem.

We allow people who literally have no idea of the political stances of either party to vote. Why? How on Earth is that smart? I want you to explain that to me. Why are we allowing people who don't know what they're talking about, to suggest how we run our country?

[Jtbrig7390]

cant you see what is happening? cant you understand you cant keep taking more and more from the rich to give to the pool. eventually you drain the rich dry and we will all be poor
let me explain
you have Paul who makes 20k a year who works part time, and you have Peter who makes 100k a year working two jobs.

The liberal tells Paul that's not fair to you so if you vote for me i will take 10k from peter and give to you.

You vote for him and put him in office now Paul has 30k and Peter makes 90k.

Next year the liberal tells Paul look peter makes 90k and you make 30k that's not fair I will take 10k more from Peter if you vote for me again.

so Peter votes for the liberal again and now Paul make 40k and Peter makes 80k.

Same thing next year same promise from the liberal now Paul makes 50k and Peter makes 70k.

Again same thing next year now both peter and Paul make the same thing 60k.

The liberal says now this is fair everybody makes the same thing and we are all happy,

But Peter looks at Paul and says this isn't fair for me. I go out and work 80 hours a week and i get the same each year as Paul who only works 20 hour a week.

Peter says I'm not working 2 jobs anymore so I'm just going to get me a part time job just like Paul at 20k a year and be given 40k.

What is the liberal going to do he has to find 80k a year from some one else to be able to pay both Peter and Paul ?

He cant because everyone makes the same now. So he says sorry guys Ive got to cut back with what Ive promised to give to you each year

both Peter and Paul says no you are not and they both start a riot

You cant create wealth by dividing it

Billgates makes 500$+ every sec and yet pays less tax's then middle class people why????? because of stupid ass loopholes and that is what is draining us.

The Lower/Middle class is paying tax's and barely getting by with what is left and the Rich is paying 1% or less of there money back in tax's. You really want to know what is draining us let me tell you its 2 simple things.

1. People should not get anything back on there tax's dose not matter if they are Lower/Middle or Upper class. That money go's back into the system to be used for government programs and to fix roads ect.......

2.The Rich/Upper Class barely paying any tax's due to loopholes but yet want the lower/Middle class to pay more. Its kinda hard to pay more when you work for 7.25$ a hr doing 20-30hrs a week and then get a chuck taken out of that. Those blaming lower class how about you try living on 7.25$ a month or be disabled and live on that its a bitch to do.

[Purlina]

I dont know, how serious do you want folks to take you?

So if a politician does or says something foolish, no one should bash them for it?

[Jtbrig7390]

I don't mind if people vote. I mind when people who don't know what they're talking about, or racist people vote.

This 100% i asked a friend of mine who was not able to vote if they could why the answer i got was "Because obama has not done anything"

Then in detail i told her what Obama has done so far and wants to do next.
Then i told her in detail what Romney wants to do....safe to say she changed her tone.

The voter who only votes because of what fox news tells them is the worse of all And those who think a man can fix in 4 years what another man broke over 8 years really need to go back to school and learn a few things.

The damage bush made is going to take a long time to fix.
Now i won't blame everything on him but we where a hell of a sight better before him then after.

[Nakura Chambers]

Reminds me of this old SNES game:

[Lenonis]

Are you really saying that you think it's completely fine for people to vote for Romney, not because they agree with his political stances, but because they don't like Obama because he's black?

Do I think it's fine? No. It's terrible and a horrible reason to vote.

Do people have that right? Yes.

I think you have identified the right problem, but the wrong solution. Because someone is racist, or is voting because they like the shoes Obama wears, or because they only listen to Glenn Beck -- that's a problem. It's a huge problem. But the answer isn't taking away someone's right to vote.

How do you determine the criteria for voter eligibility? Ignorant people exist in all demographics, all income groups.

I'd rather see a solution that focuses on the political discourse in this country and cleaning that up. Get the money out of politics. Crack down on politicians running ads that lie. Don't allow stations that claim to be a news source to have fake or spun so bad they might as well be fake news stories.

Get people educated in basic economics. Get people motivated to care about fact checking.

I think you'll see a far better solution than just taking away people's right to vote.

[Purlina]

I'd rather see a solution that focuses on the political discourse in this country and cleaning that up. Get the money out of politics. Crack down on politicians running ads that lie. Don't allow stations that claim to be a news source to have fake or spun so bad they might as well be fake news stories.

Get people educated in basic economics. Get people motivated to care about fact checking.

I think you'll see a far better solution than just taking away people's right to vote.

The whole system is broken, find a person that can actually fix it and I will worship them...

[oppie]

This is one of the reasons why personal stories are useless.

I had someone tell me with a straight face that the economy is only getting worse since the crash because she couldn't find a job. The sinking unemployment, the recovering of the stock market, the rising of housing values, the record business profits were all wrong because she couldn't get a job. The entire nation's economic status was linked to her ability to find employment. This is what she thought.

It was astounding.

I wasn't saying that the economy or the world was crashing, i was just stating that where i live, it is really hard to find employment. And i really can't afford to move anywhere else atm, but if i could find a job somewhere else then i would relocate in a heart beat. But for someone to say that they know someone that has done similar things i was just saying that depending on when they got out and where they went to when they got out plays a factor. And also retiring members of the military especially higher ranks get a lot more help converting to the civilian world than someone who is just etsing.

[dd614]

No political ads, just debates.

Problem solved.

First amendment says you're wrong. And the government certainly shouldn't be regulating the media like Bakis suggests. It will inevitably be beholden to whichever party has the power.

You immediately fail when you say the government should regulate freedom of speech.

[Rukentuts]

First amendment says you're wrong. And the government certainly shouldn't be regulating the media like Bakis suggests. It will inevitably be beholden to whichever party has the power.

You immediately fail when you say the government should regulate freedom of speech.

Hey, I remember a time when prescription drugs couldn't air ads on TV. Wasn't that long ago.

[Jagscorpion]

I'd like to interject something that might be relevant. Any form of government forces the beliefs of those who make the laws on someone else. Person A may hate the underlying world-view that shapes person B's beliefs, but any attempt by person B to overturn person A's beliefs being made law is just that in reverse. It's not bad to have beliefs. Sometimes they're wrong, but that is not determined by opinion in a lot of cases.

For example, 50% of the country could be absolutely convinced that a keynesian model of economics would be most effective for the country, where the other half could be convinced that the Wealth of Nations model has better results. Despite heated discussion this is still an inconclusive debate. Opinions are many, but ultimately one WILL be better for the country even if not everyone sees it. If one side implements their ideas, that's forcing it on other people. Just because you disagree with the other side doesn't mean that you can blanketly say that it is "wrong" for ANY idea that you disagree with to be implemented as law.

I think taking that stance is self-defeating.

Also, I say this to point out that for economic and political issues, there are often two legitimate sides of an argument. People still can't seem to make up their minds over whether Bush screwed up the current economy, or if Obama did. To be honest, the answer is probably a mix, but people take widely varying stances over the effects of economic and social policy.

---------- Post added 2012-11-16 at 05:20 PM ----------

You immediately fail when you say the government should regulate freedom of speech.

Government does regulate freedom of speech. For example, freedom of speech does not include libel or slander.

[oppie]

And no time in my life till now the takers where in a position to outnumber the makers. When you reach that tipping point it will be the snow ball effect and there will be no stopping it. when the takers become the majority they will always vote into office the ones how keep promising more and more

Who are the takers you speak of and what of your's are they taking? And show the facts that support that argument.

[Bakis]

First amendment says you're wrong. And the government certainly shouldn't be regulating the media like Bakis suggests. It will inevitably be beholden to whichever party has the power.

You immediately fail when you say the government should regulate freedom of speech.

Works fine in Europe though. I know it cant be compared off the slate but whatever you got now is clearly making people less aware and knowledgable.

Just like KFC got banned from using chicken in the name cos it was too little of it, maybe some minimum legislation what can be called news
Maybe 50% factual reporting and only 50% opinions

[Rukentuts]

Government does regulate freedom of speech. For example, freedom of speech does not include libel or slander.

Slander and libel are civil matters, not criminal.

I think this is what you mean: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clear_and_present_danger

[Chaoslux]

By definition a "minority" won't win you any election...just saying...

When your whole campaign is based on "Well, I dont care about 48% of americans, but i really need to get those swing voters"
A minority can do the whole difference. But at that point, do we really want a president that doesnt care about half of his people?

[Paloro]

Billgates makes 500$+ every sec and yet pays less tax's then middle class people why????? because of stupid ass loopholes and that is what is draining us.

The Lower/Middle class is paying tax's and barely getting by with what is left and the Rich is paying 1% or less of there money back in tax's. You really want to know what is draining us let me tell you its 2 simple things.

1. People should not get anything back on there tax's dose not matter if they are Lower/Middle or Upper class. That money go's back into the system to be used for government programs and to fix roads ect.......

2.The Rich/Upper Class barely paying any tax's due to loopholes but yet want the lower/Middle class to pay more. Its kinda hard to pay more when you work for 7.25$ a hr doing 20-30hrs a week and then get a chuck taken out of that. Those blaming lower class how about you try living on 7.25$ a month or be disabled and live on that its a bitch to do.

Bill Gates pays less taxes then me? How do you plan on proving that? He might pay less then me in a certain percentage of his income, but certainly not overall.

I know that one of the major "loopholes" is through donations. If someone can afford to drop 1 mill a year directly to a fund that is benefitting people, it logically makes sense for the government to say, hey this guy/girl is helping out society....let's give them a break on what they pay us.

[Vyxn]

Billgates makes 500$+ every sec and yet pays less tax's then middle class people why????? because of stupid ass loopholes and that is what is draining us.

The Lower/Middle class is paying tax's and barely getting by with what is left and the Rich is paying 1% or less of there money back in tax's. You really want to know what is draining us let me tell you its 2 simple things.

1. People should not get anything back on there tax's dose not matter if they are Lower/Middle or Upper class. That money go's back into the system to be used for government programs and to fix roads ect.......

2.The Rich/Upper Class barely paying any tax's due to loopholes but yet want the lower/Middle class to pay more. Its kinda hard to pay more when you work for 7.25$ a hr doing 20-30hrs a week and then get a chuck taken out of that. Those blaming lower class how about you try living on 7.25$ a month or be disabled and live on that its a bitch to do.

Because it never ends as i shown in my hypothetical scenario. Every election cycle the Liberal will have to promise more then he did last time to insure his reelection
Its just like all those towns and cities going bankrupt all over America cased by public sector unions getting promised more and more every election cycle by democrats for payment for their support